Leaderboard

After working on it for a few months I've think it's time to create a specific thread about the Ingersoll Sealion that @Johnnie offered me on that thread here. I already had made a custom bezel for it, as neither Johnnie nor me ever found anyone available on the web, but I had made it a little too "aged" and to "orange" so it didn't really matched the color and condition of the dial. So yesterday I've decided to redo that bezel and, while there, do some more renovation work. So I've dismantled it once again, polished the case, crown and caseback a little more, used some toothpaste and polywatch to get a nice clear and shiny plexi. After polishing the caseback I took a close picture and saw that it certainly had, at a time, some brushing on the flat part which is engraved ... so I've decided to try to redo that brushing and here is the result ... CASEBACK AFTER POLISHING CASEBACK REBRUSHED After casing the movement and before putting the caseback on, I've took some pictures of the Ronda 1217-21 movement ... RONDA 1217-21 INGERSOLL ENGRAVING 1217-21 MODEL ENGRAVING SWIIS ENGRAVING ... so that movement is definitely Swiss And the nice Ronda star with RL inside ... probably meaning "Ronda Lausen" And now today's wristchecks ... showing the "finished" watch with it's new bezel, less aged and more reddish ... Maybe some day I'll dismantle it again to redo the lume, which is almost "dead" ... of course if I do that I'll take care to make the lume really low, as it should be on a 43 years old watch ...

Hi Jay I was originally struggling, trying to get the train sat on the back plate but Jersey Mo linked a few pics of his rebuild and it clicked for me. By building it up on the front plate, dial side down in the clamp, you can line the train up first, then the escape and the pallet fork rests on the balance which is just sat in place, it also helps if you loosen the balance screw a bit, it adds stability to the pallet while trying to get the smaller back plate to line up with the pivots. I then just eyeball the back plate with the keyless works and mainspring barrel and just nudge it around with an old oiler or very gently with the tip of my finger until it sits in place. Then loosen off the clamp, slide the tweezers in (get a reasonable grip on the whole movement) and flip it over to screw the plates in. Takes a little while to get the knack but after a bit of practice you get used to it.

The sad reality is the luxury watch industry just isn't big enough like electronics and automotive for consumers/repairers to make a big enough stink about it. If we have a big enough coalition to take these guys to court and win we might make a difference but we all know that's not gonna happen.

Another came in over lunch! This one is even running! A. Schild movement. Gold case with some damage, but the damage suggests it's at least not plated. Dial is in good shape. Not a bad score for €3,50!

Very neat work indeed! Sets the watch off a treat.

return bar is right. I found these pics https://watchguy.co.uk/cgi-bin/library?action=show_photos&wat_id=2180

I'm not saying it's impossible but it be a rather unusual watch that turning one direction sets the hands turning the other sets the day date. If you look at your own parts list it's a three position setting. In other words all the way in is winding, middle position day date setting and third position Time setting. You'll notice at the link below there is a reference to the quick day date setting. Your picture of everything assembled looks wrong because there things are up too high? At least from the angling of the shadowing doesn't look right. I snipped out something this park has two protruding pins one of them is critically engaging what it needs to engage in but the other pin is doing nothing? That's the part that engages the quick day date set. So you need to move that somehow over so it can engage in that part of the pin. http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&AS_2066

Two more for 404! A "Thoresen" and a "Sussex". The former is an unknown 17j Swiss movement, the latter is a 17j French movement. All I know about them are these two photos, neither work for unknown reasons, the French one is missing a hand and the dial is rough, and they're coming from Germany. They're from the same seller, and I'm hoping he'll combine shipping. If so, the Thoresen is at the absolute limit at current exchange rates for €4,49 and the Sussex was €1,00. Meanwhile, the US "494 Club" moniker may not be stable... At today's exchange rate, it's the "499 Club".

Yes, decade more, decade less.

It's good to meet a polemicist every once in a while. If you don't want to accept that is you, you're welcome to think that it's me . I'll be curious to read you contributions here in six months and then in one year, good luck.

This of course is the nub of the matter. We are being sold this idea that "quality" is an optional extra, and that if you buy a "quality" watch, you need to pay through the nose to have it serviced and repaired. Quality I assure you is not optional. As has been stated more than once on this forum, If you buy cheap then you can expect to buy twice, however what galls me is that often what passes for quality is simply bling. I have a petrol lawn mower that is still running after the best part of 20 year. This is no accident. When I bought it, I looked at all of the machines on offer, and chose the most robust one I could afford. What will finally kill it is not the motor, but the weather. It is made from steel, and steel doesn't last in this cold wet and windy part of the world. Even though the machine has always been stored out of the weather, it is in an unheated shed, where condensation leads to rust, no matter how well you clean the thing prior to storage. It also gets subjected to flying rocks, spun up by the blades and the constant abrasive and damp conditions caused by chopping up vegetation and soil. I expect it to fail ultimately, and sure enough it now has a few rust holes in the metal skirt. I give it maybe another five years before it becomes unserviceable simply because there is not enough metal to hold it safely together. I have repaired it several times. The carb has been rebuilt, the blades sharpened, the clutch and fan cleaned out, the pull start cable repaired and so forth. This is because it is repairable, and the parts are available. I looked at the replacement machines available today for around the equivalent cost as this one 20 years ago. They look however much cheaper. More flimsy plastic bits, more go faster stripes, more marketing b*llox and less quality. I don't expect to get as robust a machine now as I did even then. This despite all of the "greenwashing" that the manufacturers are splurging on their advertising. I also looked at a "Robot" mower. This thing trundles round your lawn and cuts it apparently, thus saving you from one of the few forms of light exercise still pressing on your precious time. No doubt while it is trundling round the lawn rapidly heading towards its first breakdown, you can think of at least a dozen excuses to not to use the time it has freed up, to not go to the gym. It costs five times as much as the equivalent of my current mower. It has bluetooth and wifi, and an app, and is made of marketing w*nkery and other flimsy crap. So that means you need to spend five times as long doing whatever task it is that brings in the pay-check as you would if you simply bought a decent mower and used it to cut some grass. Actually for that money, if you are really lazy or unable to do it yourself. you could pay someone to cut the grass, but that is not what a "Robot" lawn mower is for. It is not there to cut the grass, it is there to say "I can afford a Robot lawn mower, 'aint it smart, and 'aint I the bees knees". Arguably that is also true of most of our toys of course. Was I tempted to buy a "Robot mower"... of course I was. I'm only human after all.

I'll definitely give it a try. Well, that's a good idea, but the problem is you're bound to need certain parts a lot more frequently than other parts. Nevertheless, it's magnitudes better than not being able to get any parts at all. To me that sounds like excellent advice!

I'm happy with the service I get from Cousins when it comes to Seiko parts. I'm sure that there is no intent by the Japanese to not sell parts. I have confirmation of that by my jeweller friend in the US which is able to buy parts with a reseller account and no service shop. What helps more is that with the 7S/4R/6R is easy and cheap to get complete movement or watches, new or used, get what you need and store the rest for future use, or resell on Ebay if you're after Euro 5 or so. Call me opportunistic or cynical but since I was a teenager I learnt to pick my fights, live happily and avoid black eyes.

Thank you[mention=2964]Johnnie[/mention] I just got a new avatar [emoji39]

Perhaps, but if we don't call out these restrictive practices when we find them, we have simply given in to the bullying tactics. I agree that trying to put the bell on this particular cat may not be the world's top priority, but none the less we cannot simply ignore the problem either.

There is no restriction for basic mov't like 7S26, 6R15, etc you can get all parts. Going up to middle-level you can send a request and they may try to get it. No parts for Grand Seiko, which can only be serviced in Japan. Not really. There is no material house that sells online in Japan, and even if there was they would probably not ship overseas. You can, however browe on Yahoo! Yapan and buy there using an agent.

Fault at third wheel. ( minute) Clean and inspect all ( gear teeth and pinion) of the minute wheel under high magnification. There is a slight possibility of bent pivot or damaged pivot hole, enlarged pivot hole cause depthing and exacerbate the condition.

I should have mentioned that to become a "authorised service centre" companies had to install the recommended Swiss tools even if the tools already being used were perfectly good they had to be replaced. If my memory serves me well it was in the region of €50,000. Many experienced horologists just retired and who could blame them.

It may function perfectly well for many years, in much the same way as a fake Rolex may function perfectly well for many years, but if you have bought one or been sold one as genuine then a deception has taken place a fake or homage that is sold as such is just that and costs much less than the real thing. Anyone who is paying antique French carriage clock money for a modern Chinese one is being deceived and anyone who is passing off such a clock as the real article is committing a fraud. The Chinese are churning out these things by the thousand, fine but lets never forget that they are a £50.00 product at best and if they didn't sell they would not make them but never can they be considered as good as a genuine article.

The situation is not unique to watches of course. Years ago when the world was young, (and so was I) you could repair computers. In fact I made a good living doing this back in the day. You could also repair pretty much everything else, TVs, radios, watches, even kettles. Slowly we became more lazy and stuff got cheaper, so nobody bothered any more. Of course the true cost of never repairing anything is not fiscal. It is the cumulative and slow poisoning of our environment. We all rush around making money to buy stuff so we can show off our stuff, to the people we are working with who all buy stuff, and make money so they can buy stuff (rinse, repeat etc.) All the while this happened. I have to admit, having seen it, it is pretty impressive in a deeply depressing sort of a way. I grew up in sunny Scotland, and when I started my working life, there were fields on my way in to Glasgow from the leafy suburbs. There were also fields in the vicinity of Linlithgow, and even in the rural Scottish borders, much loved by the tourists (I believe they love the landscape, rather than the landfill). Over the course of my many miles and many years of driving round the country making money to feed my consumer habits, two smaller, but no less depressing mountains sprang up in those fields. These were the lesser garbage alps of Glasgow and Edinburgh. I shudder to think what all is in these stinking piles of crap. They are capped off with turf now, and lined with pipework to extract the methane from the decaying detritus, and will no doubt be there for many years to come. Other similar consumer driven pustules on the landscape have since taken their place as repositories for all of our discarded consumer crap. Of course a lot more of our waste (particularly dangerous or difficult to process stuff) was exported, and no doubt some of it may well be in the monstrous Delhi mega pile of festering garbage in the video above. With this in mind, it should indeed be illegal to sell stuff that cannot be repaired at reasonable cost, and easily recycled if it is beyond repair. That includes everything, from the humblest of wristwatch to the fanciest of Pateks. Luxury goods should not be exempt, or treated any differently, simply because they are "luxury".

I think Andys post hit the nail on the head, we are just mere consumers and what do we know about it, I also think this was a major factor in the Fake watch market, over priced bling but that's another story. we have been there .

Yes they are but when it comes to mechanical men's watches nor having precious material, most buyers are Western World men below 50 yrs of age, and well informed about "whats is what", emerging trends, etc. Now, try to convince them that Euro 10,000 for a Rolex/Omega/Patek/Grand Seiko etc is too much? And that not much less for a Breitling/Oris/etc, is still too much? They know what they are buying, they know how hard is to earn that money, and they still buy the product. I think have a point, when with few exception that is an "investment" that will hold value in the long time, perhaps just a bit diluted by the exorbitant official service fee, if one chooses to go that route. All 2824 parts are available but the problem comes when you look for a special execution part like a different height hand carrying wheel, top grade parts, etc. Or when you go up the scale for other movements. Now look, at this time Cousins is adding desirable original Rolex parts. Try asking them details about how they get these and they would be in their right to not answer. I have no problem believing that things are more fluid and based on good old business sense than just a blanket "no parts period" posture.

Hi My pleasure glad to be of assistance good luck with the repair. cheers

I had one it also had the ultrasonic device as well, used to clean 3 or 4 watches at a time. The best watch cleaning machine I ever had, nothing could touch it for fine results. About a month ago one on ebay was going for £400 which was a bargain.

Yes, It is very helpful in determining authentic GI issue watches. There seems to be a cottage industry of fake military watches. Mine is 100% authentic thankfully. I do wish I had the original carboard box it came in. I nearly manufactured one from scratch, but I gave up when I saw the work involved, lol. BTW... The photo I posted of the dial looks awful... Specs of dust on the Crystal That's better!

All of the watch mainsprings I'm aware of can potentially be hand wound into the barrel, some are just more tricky than others - some shapes or types of mainspring can be awkward regardless of method. Having a pre-wound mainspring is nice when everything is going to plan.

Nonsense! None of that has anything to do with me personally, if you think it does you have simply ignored half of what I have already said. I'm very well aware that every hobby that has ever been invented in the history of mankind (and with a web forum dedicated to its providence) has the same type of gate-keeping. have a good day!