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JohnR725 last won the day on June 25

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About JohnR725

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  1. I think you'll find the link below interesting. As mentioned above it used to be 9010 was recommended on pallet stones even Seiko up until relatively recently was using it. Then 941 came into existence interestingly enough it's slightly lighter in viscosity than 9010. Then much later on 9415 classified as a grease for higher frequency Escapement's. 9415 has interesting properties it's a grease so it stays in place but on the impact it becomes fluid. Then if you look at current tech sheets they probably grasp that watchmakers are cheap and it's basically either or for 941 or 9415. Then I'm attaching a PDF Starting on page 13 is lubrication of a lever escapement. This is where things get really complicated 9415 has a problem if it is applied too heavy. So they explain how it has to be applied very very thinly. You'll also notice another term Lubrifar which is really just Molybdenum disulfide ETA And probably others have been using it for quite a number of years on the escape wheels. http://www.moebius-lubricants.ch/en/products/oils 8645_WI_40_rules for lubrication.pdf
  2. So in addition to the question that just now got asked before me I would be curious about the price and the price of the other two items I added to list below. Then I have a link to the manufacturers website. So I see it has in our oscilloscope feature that's nice. hen it might just be my reading skills but on the spec sheet and the users manual nowhere to my finding technical specifications other than just it will do these things. So if you look at the witschi technical specifications they give you in detail all the ranges and all the specifications and that seems to be lacking on this machine. http://greinervibrograf.com/?pageID=34&lng=en https://www.beco-technic.com/geraete-maschinen/uhrenpruefgeraete-kontrollgeraete/geraete-zur-pruefung-von-uhren/witschi-watch-expert-pruefgeraet-fuer-mechanische-uhren.html https://www.beco-technic.com/geraete-maschinen/uhrenpruefgeraete-kontrollgeraete/geraete-zur-pruefung-von-uhren/witschi-chronomaster.html Chrono Touch Operating Manual.pdf
  3. This question implies that you think you're going to have to bend the hairspring in several places other than near the stud? One of the interesting things in watch repair is everyone has different techniques. For me from the limited pictures it looks like a problem around the stud and personally I just fixed the problem everything else should be fine. But I'm looking at a couple of photographs with limited view versus holding the watch in my hand where I might see something entirely different. Then learning as you go is the typical way all watchmakers learn but before practicing on live watches you really should practice on separate hairsprings balance complete and disposable watch. Hairspring manipulation isn't something you learn fast. A really helpful reference for learning hairsprings is a book by Fried, Henry B: “Bench practices for watch and clockmakers” with a rather sizable section on fixing hairsprings. Another reference can be found at the link below the book Joseph School of Watch Making Personally I download the entire book it's really a wonderful reference but Specifically right now Unit 6 - Hairspring Truing. https://www.mybulova.com/vintage-bulova-catalogs Then I have a couple a images out of Henry's book that you might find helpful. Notice both hairsprings are centered and yes there is no balance wheel there. But notice the terminal curve's there different. You have to be careful with the videos and other sources that are showing very specific ways that terminal curve's are formed because that may not be the way your hairspring terminal curve is formed. The balance complete image that I got shows a very gradual curve similar to figure 90 below.
  4. Googling I found you a PDF at the link below it's on page 16. Then I really should find you a picture of this but the other method is to not to remove the hairspring. Some companies Rolex for instance supplies special tools for this which were not going to have and are exceedingly expensive even if we did. So what they do is to push the staff out and once the staff is free of the balance wheel they continue to push the staff right through the Hairspring collet. http://www.awci.com/wp-content/uploads/ht/2006/2006-05-web.pdf
  5. Crumbling a hairspring collet is interesting how did you do that?
  6. Usually when I'm doing hairspring work I like to use number five tweezers. They have really nice long and narrow tips. Then it looks like from your photograph you have identified the areas that don't look quite right. The other thing that was bothering me the one that's closest to the stud and it may be an optical illusion almost looks like it's twisted their.
  7. Looking at your pictures I found what I was looking for so I've snipped out the interesting ones. Looking at the images attached you'll notice that your hairspring is touching the backside of the regulator pin. It also looks like your terminal curve is distorted. In the video I gave you he clearly shows how to make the terminal curve but you have to be careful in that each watch is different. So for that I went looking on eBay to see if anyone had nice picture is of a balance complete. Currently on eBay there are quite a few balance completes a couple have pictures this one was the nicest picture. Personally for fixing this I would do it in the watch. That's because the problem is in the watch. Looks like the balance complete has a nice gradual terminal curve which I think yours still has. The typical problem and it's the most common problem for watchmakers is distortion in the around the stud. The preferred method of practicing with the hairspring would be to practice on a disposable watch. Practice distorting the hairspring bending it then fixing the problem until you get good at it. But as there are replacement balance completes on eBay you can practice with this watch what's the worst you're going to do? I notice they even have movements on eBay.
  8. Starting off with the timing results first as they are helpful if they're correct? I like the program and it works nicely but it be nice if you verify with another watch that it actually is working and can pick up watches. We've had another discussion were somebody had questionable results because they weren't getting a good clean signal from the watch. Then if the signal is correct when you get random dots the numbers mean nothing. Timing software/machines can only run correctly if they have a nice clean signal and this signal is not nice. It would be nice before undertaking hairspring work to find a disposable watch to practice with. Even a disposable balance wheel just to get a feel for how easy it is to bend a hairspring.. It takes a lot of practice to be good at bending hairsprings.. Your video is interesting and misleading perhaps. Misleading because were looking at your hairspring doesn't look centered but is that really an issue? So the hairspring needs to only be attached to the stud,, collet and go between the regulator pins. If it's off-center it's not an issue as long as is not rubbing bumping touching anything else. I'm attaching an image of your video notice the curvature from the stud through and we can't see the regulator pins? It would be nice to have a slightly angled view to see the curvature better. To understand what I'm getting at I'm attaching a link to a video.. As a reminder in the video he comments that they hairspring cc gets in this condition because the students didn't properly form their terminal curve. You had a properly formed terminal curve and casually it looks like it's not quite right? So we need to figure out why it's not right and if it is not right before attempting to fix the problem.. Usually the place that hairsprings get bent at is the stud to because it's an easy place for watchmakers to bend their hairsprings accidentally. Then recovering too many subjects and if you're having a terminal curve problem that needs to be addressed before putting the watch in beat. I checked the service bulletin for your watch it appears to have a fixed stud mounting. A lot a modern watches have floating stud's they can be moved to put the watch in beat. Visually you should build a verify whether your watches in beat without the timing machine and then use the timing machine the verify you got it correctly. o it in the watch will have the pallet fork between the banking pins but that doesn't guarantee the watches in beat. Technically the roller jewel has to be centered in the slot of the fork which is really hard to see so we usually go by the pallet fork should be centered between the banking pins. I can explain more about that but let's see what we can do about they hairspring and getting a better signal on the timing machine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EYk787sjAM
  9. When I made the suggestion of this particular movement I was suggesting the movement only. If you purchase a complete watch it has to be brand new which is why a movement is a better way to go. As someone new to watch repair you need to learn how the watch works and how to successfully disassemble and reassemble it without destroying it. Then preferably you going to practice a lot with this watch until you get really good at disassembling and reassembling without accidents. Go to eBay search for eta 6497 movement. Specifically we're not looking for the 6497 or the 6498 were looking for the clone's as their way cheaper. So just now doing the search I can see one of the clone goes by ST-36. Then see you can see what the 6497/6498 looks like I have links below. http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&ETA_6497_1 http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&ETA_6498_1
  10. I was thinking perhaps a different approach is needed for this watch? One of the problems with the message board is if you ask a question we will give you an answer but is the question the correct question for the problem of the watch? To get a better feel I read the prior messages related to this watch and? So is this your first watch learning watch repair? Then what was the condition of the watch before you started repairing it? I noticed you misplaced one of the end stones did you find that? then it be really helpful if we could see the watch-a-scope Print out. That is preferably into positions like dial down and crown down http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&Felsa_690
  11. With the exception of American pocket watch parts hairsprings typically come only with the balance wheel they were vibrated to. So that means if you need a new hairspring you need a balance complete unfortunately.
  12. In modern watch repair shops what you're describing is known as pre-cleaning. The incoming watches have their hands and dial removed and any calendar discs anything that's painted will be removed. Then the entire watch is run through usually a separate machine just for this usually with a shorter cycle of cleaning. Then with the now clean watch the watchmaker will proceed with a normal repair procedure. Then of course once all the repairs are made the watch is cleaned again this time totally disassembled.
  13. The nice thing about the 6497 Is the Chinese have cloned the movement and it's available on eBay. It's something disposable versus destroying the limited supply of watches you currently have.
  14. As your starting off why not start off with something simpler than this watch like a 6497 for instance. Then practice taking it apart and putting it together a lot of times until you get the feeling of how things work. This watch isn't really considered a beginner's watch. Not exactly the same automatic but if you want to see a walk through I have a link below. https://www.eta.ch/swisslab/6497/6947.html https://www.eta.ch/swisslab/2892a2/2892a2.html http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&ETA_2783
  15. In the beginning of this discussion you said one of your movements, and here you're indicating the movement belongs to a customer? Helpful now we know what movement this is but that presents an interesting problem. Amusingly googling this movement specifically I was looking for anyone that actually has serviced one and timing machine results and anyone that's had one of these near a timing machine the results have been very disappointing. Apparently the identical clone to a real Rolex may have quality control issues.
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