Which Watch Have You Got Coming In The Mail ? Show Us !!!

[Neverenoughwatches]

7 minutes ago, Galilea said:

If this hijacked vessel can handle one more stowaway observation, I find it somehow sad and disappointing when people amble through forums like this one asking how much their watch is worth. It's even worse when it was handed down to them from generations gone, especially when it says Quartz on it.

Aannnd now you know what taking the pee means

[Knebo]

I could not resist this one and hope that it really looks as nice as in the pictures of the seller. I'm salivating over those blued hands. 

An Omega ref 730.17 from 1939 with the calibre T17 that was record breaking at the time for it's 60h power reserve. In fact, Omega took until 2006 (call 8500) to surpass  this number. 

It has a nice 22mm (without crown) by 39mm (with lugs) size. 

 

[AndyHull]

A West End Watch Co – Sowar Prima, Possibly with a  Taubert & Fils. Case (I'm pretty certain it has their FB stamp inside), is on its way.

 

I'm not sure of the caliber, possibly a FEF 190-1

I'm also uncertain about the age. The case looks as if it has been restored, or at the very least, slightly over polished. The mechanism looks to possibly be from the 1930s or 1940s.

West End Watch were popular in India, but I picked this one up on Ebay in the UK for a bit of a bargain price. Not quite 404 club material, but only a few pennies north of that mark. These pictures from the listing are somewhat fuzzy, but hopefully if is genuine and looks to be in reasonable condition. At that price, almost inevitably, it does have a fault however, but when did that ever deter us?

Edited July 23, 2023 by AndyHull

[gpraceman]

I've been slowly working through my queue of watches and was looking for some other watches to add.  I won this lot for about $8 per watch.  Two Wittnauers, two Benrus, two Helbros, an Elgin, and a Clinton.  I was attracted to the lot by the Elgin.  Love that case.  Some have some obvious problems.  I don't know what the movements looks like yet.  Hopefully, these will be interesting projects.  The last lot that I bought I was able to make some nice wearable watches out of them, so I have hope.

[AndyHull]

https://buildingourpast.com/2017/05/10/the-story-of-h-samuel-britains-largest-jeweller/

I suspect this one has more rust than jewels.

A gun metal 7 jewel "Herbert Wolf Ltd. London, Liverpool & Manchester" "Magno" pocket watch... in need of a lot of TLC.

This is obviously a 404 club candidate, and will need a lot of cleaning and more than a little luck to get it going.

I suspect the watch may be roughly the same age as the date of the picture of the shop, some time around 1900 to 1910.

Edited July 24, 2023 by AndyHull

[Waggy]

11 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

will need a lot of cleaning and more than a little luck to get it going.

Good news is that the balance spring appears to be ok, hopefully the staff is in good shape too, and looking at the picture the balance wheel doesn't look to be leaning to one side, so that is encouraging.

My biggest concern is that case, I was thinking of suggesting that you put it in rust remover liquid, but there may not be much left once the rust has gone 

Perhaps leave it alone and go for the Rustic or "shabby chic"  look?

[AndyHull]

Just now, Waggy said:

Good news is that the balance spring appears to be ok, hopefully the staff is in good shape too, and looking at the picture the balance wheel doesn't look to be leaning to one side, so that is encouraging.

My biggest concern is that case, I was thinking of suggesting that you put it in rust remover liquid, but there may not be much left once the rust has gone 

Perhaps leave it alone and go for the Rustic or "shabby chic"  look?

I'm quietly confident I can do something with the rust on the case, without it being too obvious afterwards. I'm more concerned with the whatever may be going on with the keyless works, and anything on the dial side. If there was water ingress there, then things may get pretty tricky.

Sadly it doesn't quite have the look of this version, although I suspect the dial (and hands) are almost identical to how this one once looked.

[Waggy]

White epoxy putty may help with the dial?

You can tint it before application to colour match

[AndyHull]

9 minutes ago, Waggy said:

White epoxy putty may help with the dial?

You can tint it before application to colour match

Improving the dial, beyond simply cleaning it is a major challenge. The enamel's white colour comes, at least in part, from the lead pigments fired into the enamel, and reproducing the correct shade in a convincing manner is difficult. There are specialists who can do this extremely well, but the budget nature of this watch put these services out of reach (unless H. Samuel want to reach out to me and sponsor the process of course ).

I'm may try a few experiments when I get back. Epoxy thinned with acetone might work.... reproducing the art work for the numerals and the railtrack is a whole different problem.

 

White is a tricky colour to match.

Here I've copied a small ellipse from an adjacent area and placed it over some of the damage, just to illustrate the point.

First thing I'd like to do is clean the dial, and see just how bad it is, then I'll see if I can find any pigments that are as close a match as possible.

Modern whites however are almost all titanium dioxide based which is a harsher and bluer white, so not easy to blend to the correct shade. 

Edited July 24, 2023 by AndyHull

[RichardHarris123]

1 hour ago, AndyHull said:

Improving the dial, beyond simply cleaning it is a major challenge. The enamel's white colour comes, at least in part, from the lead pigments fired into the enamel, and reproducing the correct shade in a convincing manner is difficult. There are specialists who can do this extremely well, but the budget nature of this watch put these services out of reach (unless H. Samuel want to reach out to me and sponsor the process of course ).

I'm may try a few experiments when I get back. Epoxy thinned with acetone might work.... reproducing the art work for the numerals and the railtrack is a whole different problem.

 

White is a tricky colour to match.

Here I've copied a small ellipse from an adjacent area and placed it over some of the damage, just to illustrate the point.

First thing I'd like to do is clean the dial, and see just how bad it is, then I'll see if I can find any pigments that are as close a match as possible.

Modern whites however are almost all titanium dioxide based which is a harsher and bluer white, so not easy to blend to the correct shade. 

Find a local college or university that teaches graphic design to reproduce the numbers/ letters, then use the lazer printer transfer method. 

[AndyHull]

If you want to see the results the professionals can achieve, you could take a look at the gallery pictures here -> https://www.clock-dials.co.uk/#gallery

 

Laser toner transfer and laser foil transfer might be an option. Water slide decals are another possibility.

This is certainly as much art as it is science.

I suspect that working on a very large scale copy of the dial in Inkscape, Gimp or Photoshop and then scaling the artwork down to the correct size for laser printing might be the way to go. That way you can work on the fine details with greater precision.

[Neverenoughwatches]

2 hours ago, AndyHull said:

https://buildingourpast.com/2017/05/10/the-story-of-h-samuel-britains-largest-jeweller/

I suspect this one has more rust than jewels.

A gun metal 7 jewel "Herbert Wolf Ltd. London, Liverpool & Manchester" "Magno" pocket watch... in need of a lot of TLC.

This is obviously a 404 club candidate, and will need a lot of cleaning and more than a little luck to get it going.

I suspect the watch may be roughly the same age as the date of the picture of the shop, some time around 1900 to 1910.

As tradition dictates the three gents on the corner are choosing their xmas presents while the girls clothes shop in Next. 

[AndyHull]

15 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

As tradition dictates the three gents on the corner are choosing their xmas presents while the girls clothes shop in Next. 

.. then 'orf round the corner for a bite to eat no doubt.

[Waggy]

11 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

then 'orf round the corner for a bite to eat no doubt.

Off to Mrs Miggins Pie shop for a pie and warm flagon of ale

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 minute ago, AndyHull said:

.. then 'orf round the corner for a bite to eat no doubt.

Sounds rather porsh, i was thinking   they'd be  " having a pint in the dog and trumpet " 

3 minutes ago, Waggy said:

Off to Mrs Miggins Pie shop for a pie and warm flagon of ale

Wow is then when things were so tight in retail that it was ok with the shop to haggle ?

[oldhippy]

4 minutes ago, Waggy said:

Off to Mrs Miggins Pie shop for a pie and warm flagon of ale

Nothing better then Mrs Miggin's pie shop. Just don't have the sausages they look like horses willy's 

[Knebo]

This little beauty arrived today! 

An Omega "tank" from thr 1930s. Cal 12.6 (or T12.6). I love it and its blued hands. 

It'll be a birthday present for my mother after I service it. 

It was supposed to cost 200 EUR - already a great price for such a piece, I find. But the seller admitted that it was running 30-40min fast per day. So we agreed on 160 EUR. 

Since I wanted to service it anyway, I was happy. 

 

Well, when winding it, I immediately felt that the mainspring must be broken. The obvious click-slip sound after every 2-3 turns of the crown. Well, I had already ordered a new mainspring anyway

Then on the timegrapher... complete snowstorm. So I demagnetized it. And yes! that created some clear lines and at least some output on the Weishi. But running super slow now. 

When I looked at the regulator, I saw it positioned all the way to R/slow. The seller must have tried to compensate for the magnetism (making it run super fast). 

Sliding it back to a more neutral position, I was able to get some more horizontal lines. But still wavy. 

I will report back after the full service

[JohnR725]

1 hour ago, Knebo said:

hen I looked at the regulator, I saw it positioned all the way to R/slow. The seller must have tried to compensate for the magnetism (making it run super fast).

It's a common thing if anyone can get into their watch to push the regulator to some extreme to fix a problem that is not regulation problem.

1 hour ago, Knebo said:

Then on the timegrapher... complete snowstorm

Usually until you can make the snowstorm go away all the numbers are worthless. Basically the timing machine is telling at your watch needs to be serviced. I wouldn't even be worried about the beat until the watch cleaned and its running better and then see how things look again. A lot of things will go away once it's been cleaned up With a better looking amplitude

[Knebo]

40 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

 lot of things will go away once it's been cleaned up With a better looking amplitude

Yes, absolutely. Full service coming.

But... I don't trust my eyes... I must be dreaming... Did Mr @JohnR725just use the a-word???

[JohnR725]

8 minutes ago, Knebo said:

a-word???

Okay, down relax and chill out.

The problem is with a snow globe effect you can't rely on the numbers at all. Then to be honest I'm suspicious of the numbers especially with the watch this grossly out of beat. Usually is the amplitude goes down everything gets magnified beats will look bad so if this amplitude is below what it is which I suspect it really to be everything will look dramatically bad.

Usually what you want to do is visually look at the watch and see what you perceive it's doing in other words is the amplitude look pathetic or does it look adequate and is the timing machine agree with your visual assessment. So my suspicion is the amplitude probably looks pathetic and the timing machine is probably wrong at least it might be probably wrong not 100% convinced it could be either way

So for instance on this watch if you really want to get a good assessment wait 24 hours and see what the amplitude is see if it even makes it 24 hours. This will tell us of the amplitude isn't really what it appears to be

so yes I did use the dreaded amplitude word but Hamas of trying to suggest that the watch probably needs to be cleaned before further assessment can be done for timing. Which is exactly what the timing machine is trying to tell you

 

 

[Knebo]

C'mon @JohnR725, I was just teasing you! 

But you were preaching to the choir. Please look at my original post. I didn't even mention amplitude!! I said that the mainspring was broken (so everything on the timegrapher is with, let's say, 10% of power); and I said that it needs a service. 

1st picture: snowstorm; it doesn't even show amplitude. It's magnetised.  

2nd picture: after de-magnetizing. Rather straight lines, but loosing time.

3nd picture: after pushing the regulator to neutral. For me, this is an "encouraging" reading for a 90-year old watch, with 10% power and BEFORE a service. "Encouraging" in the sense, that a full service can make it run well. And yes, of course, I'll give it a full service. It clearly needs it and I hope the wave-lines will become straight. 

[JohnR725]

Oh by the way I'm disappointed this is a watch repair discussion group we like to see watch movements naked watch movements without their case and where's my watch movement to see? Really quite disappointing here

36 minutes ago, Knebo said:

Please look at my original post. I didn't even mention amplitude!! I said that the mainspring was broken (so everything on the timegrapher is with, let's say, 10% of power); and I said that it needs a service. 

Yes I did see that but there is still showing timing machine results.

Then unfortunately far too common on the group is people instead of showing the image will say I have numbers and they look fine but my watch doesn't work? So then we get stuck asking could you please show us the timing machine picture so we can see all of it because conveniently they want to disregard the snow globe affect and only look at what they perceived to be good. With often times extremely low amplitude will show up as a much higher amplitude because the machines picking the wrong part of the waveform.

40 minutes ago, Knebo said:

I hope the wave-lines will become straight

The way the lines can be magnetism but it could also be more than likely power issues. Things like the little bit of the mainspring you have is sticky the gear train is sticky get powertrain fluctuations the look like this. This watch cleaned up should look really really nice. Unfortunately it's too vintage the show up on my Omega list of timing specifications. They do have a section of watches who don't show up on the listing if you're curious about what they perceive timekeeping should be

Then I did find a picture. I was curious about whether the beat could be adjusted which typically does not occur on vintage older watches. I'm still assuming but I hate assuming that your beat condition is brought on by amplitude much lower than what the machine is showing. Often times with super low amplitude the timing machines will give you a nice happy number. Versus the reality of the situation. Which means once that number comes up a little more the beat problem should go away hopefully. Hopefully nobody's played with the watch beyond pushing the regulator.

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&172&2uswk&Omega_T12_6

 

 

 

[Knebo]

56 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

Oh by the way I'm disappointed this is a watch repair discussion group we like to see watch movements naked watch movements without their case and where's my watch movement to see? Really quite disappointing here

I'll definitely post a picture of the movement when I get a moment to disassemble.

This topic is "which watch have you go coming in the mail", so normally we would rely on seller's pictures here. I admit that I have already received it and could have opened the case, but didn't have time yesterday. 

59 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

Yes I did see that but there is still showing timing machine results.

Then unfortunately far too common on the group is people instead of showing the image will say I have numbers and they look fine but my watch doesn't work? So then we get stuck asking could you please show us the timing machine picture so we can see all of it because conveniently they want to disregard the snow globe affect and only look at what they perceived to be good. With often times extremely low amplitude will show up as a much higher amplitude because the machines picking the wrong part of the waveform.

Yes, I wanted to show the patterns (snow vs lines) and didn't focus on the numbers. Should I have censored them?

I think it can be useful for other users as well to see actual timegrapher readings of a magnetized movement. While this movement needs a full service, in other cases, buyers/users may be able to avoid a full overhaul if they just recognize magnetism and deal with that. And not, like the seller, just push the regulator to super slow.

But I completely agree with you that just writing the amplitude as a number in the post, instead of showing the entire timegrapher line/snow pattern, can be misleading.

1 hour ago, JohnR725 said:

The way the lines can be magnetism but it could also be more than likely power issues

I agree. If I'm lucky, it's just the power issue and irregular torque from the broken mainspring -- worst case, also an out-of-round wheel. I already demagnetized on the last picture, but maybe some residual magnetism. 

 

1 hour ago, JohnR725 said:

I was curious about whether the beat could be adjusted which typically does not occur on vintage older watches.

Yes, I also checked pictures of the movement and it looks like the beat error can only be adjusted by moving the collet.... I hate doing that. But I'll first fully service and see if cleaning and power will eliminate the beat error. If not, collet moving I shall.

 

[Galilea]

On 7/19/2023 at 2:39 AM, Galilea said:

Good morning people. I want to share the watches I bought at one auction yesterday. Eight watches, six lots, with little time to spare because I didn’t know about the auction. I think I got really lucky on all of it, but one in particular is unlike any I have seen before. I’ll whip through the first seven watches quickly then on to my unusual one. I hope somebody here can tell me about it.

 

UPDATE: I have found more info about this last watch, what some have called the Jungle pocket watch, perhaps all I will ever find out, but still trolling: Two pocket watch lovers commented, one who wanted to date it to about 1869 because "large and solid b"  type regulator is like one on a watch he has from then; also, another heard tell of a school in Switzerland or Germany where students were required to come up with a project watch like this to graduate. Therefore, I started looking for schools in those nations, at around 1870.

I found two watches, both in the same hands now of a German gent, who dates them to about 1870, says they are Swiss, he thinks, and maybe from a school. Here are some pics:

(And @oldhippy, if I put this in the wrong place, well, please give @Neverenoughwatches good talking to, because I cannot find where he explained me how)

[Galilea]

On 7/23/2023 at 11:49 PM, gpraceman said:

I've been slowly working through my queue of watches and was looking for some other watches to add.  I won this lot for about $8 per watch.  Two Wittnauers, two Benrus, two Helbros, an Elgin, and a Clinton.  I was attracted to the lot by the Elgin.  Love that case.  Some have some obvious problems.  I don't know what the movements looks like yet.  Hopefully, these will be interesting projects.  The last lot that I bought I was able to make some nice wearable watches out of them, so I have hope.

Nice job! Without a Bulova or Timex among them (although they are both excellent), and only one stem missing, for $8?  They are right in my aesthetically-preferred zone.