Ultrasonic Cleaners

[IFELL]

Hi, I have recently bought this old Elma watch cleaning machine. It has the movement holder fitted and I do have a holder for the set of baskets, but I am missing the baskets.
Any good idea where to find those? Obviously I don't want to pay ~150£ for Elma brand new...

thanks,

[clockboy]

Cousins used to supply some cleaning machine parts

[Ken2018]

Hey guys, I'm looking to buy a lower priced ultrasonic cleaner to clean 1-2 movements a week. Do you think this one would be OK?

https://www.ebay.com/p/3l-Digital-Ultrasonic-Cleaner-Stainless-Steel-Industry-Heated-Heater-W-timer/1223430514?iid=382536129729#UserReviews

Thanks!

[Muligans]

I just bougt myself a ultrasonic cleaner and was wondering what kind of solutions u guys use? Is water good enough or should something else be used?

[Geo]

15 minutes ago, Muligans said:

I just bougt myself a ultrasonic cleaner and was wondering what kind of solutions u guys use? Is water good enough or should something else be used?

If you do a search, you will find many posts on the subject.  If you click on this link I have a couple of posts explaining what I do.  

 

 

[AndyHull]

On 3/24/2014 at 9:42 PM, No8yogi said:

Hello there, I have a jeweler friend who runs all my bits through his ultrasonic cleaner for me as I don't have one, whilst nice this isn't practical, on the famous bidding site there are many around the £25 mark, my question is are these any good? Does anyone have a recommendation, I don't need large capacity just something that comes recommended and works

I have one of the cheap 'n cheerful small Chinese ultrasonic cleaners, and while it works (I bought it faulty and fixed it), I can't say the build quality is very impressive, in fact quite the reverse. 

Some of the really cheap items advertised as "ultrasonic" dental cleaners are not even genuinely ultrasonic. The small plastic ones often have nothing more than a vibrating motor in them, so steer clear of those. 

Edited October 24, 2018 by AndyHull

[Muligans]

On 10/24/2018 at 6:03 PM, Geo said:

If you do a search, you will find many posts on the subject.  If you click on this link I have a couple of posts explaining what I do.  

 

 

Thanks Geo, will try the search function next time.

[measuretwice]

I'd always thought a key aspect of great watch cleaner was no residue, like the L&R products with multi jar contraptions (which I have and really like).  I think  L&R makes an ultrasound solution as well.  Once trick to controlling cost is to put water in the tank but suspend a glass jar with parts and special cleaning fluid into the water;  it greatly reduces the cleaner required and the waves travel well through glass.

I also like using water and some simple green general cleaner/degreaser in my ultrasonic cleaner..it does an amazing job of cleaning general things, but I haven't used it on watches as I've no idea of the residue factor

 

Edited May 3, 2019 by measuretwice

[nellis003]

Hi all,

I'm new to watch repair, so before I invest too much in tools and equipment I thought I'd get some opinions here.

Would an inexpensive ultrasonic jewelry cleaner like the one listed below be a good way to start practicing disassembling, cleaning, and reassembling a couple inexpensive watches I have to get myself started?  

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HZVYAVM/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

I already have the basic tools, so the cleaner is the only thing stopping me from getting my feet wet.  

Thanks,

Nick

[Klassiker]

That's the kind of thing I use, and I'm happy with the results. No doubt a professional machine is better, but these get 90% of the way there for a fraction of the price.

[WatchMaker]

Personally this would be down my list of tools and priorities for a beginner. When I started out I preferred to hand clean movement parts. I know a lot of folk have and use small ultrasonic cleaners though.

[nellis003]

Thanks to both who responded so far.  

I'm game to skip the ultrasonic cleaner for now.  Can you recommend a specific type of cleaning solution to use by hand?  

[Jon]

I started with lighter fluid as a cleaner and isopropyl alcohol as a rinse.

You can put the watch parts into mini glass jars and use these fluids to clean more effectively when the jars are immersed into water in an ultrasonic machine. Make sure you don't get water into the jars, or put in pallet forks. Clean those by hand, as the ultrasonic effect might loosen the jewels.

It is a good idea to start cleaning by hand, as you really get to know intimately what clean parts look like, especially when you peg out all the jewels with sharpened pegwood beforehand. Even if you use an ultrasonic, peg out the holes first

[WatchMaker]

Good advice from @Jon for a beginner and where I was coming from on the reason for hand cleaning to start with.

Lighter fluid is often recommended for beginners as it's cheap and readily available and fine if you're working your skills up. However you'll appreciate that it's not a horological product so may contain unwelcome additives. If you think you'll make this into a longer term hobby it's worth 'investing' in something purer like Renata Essence. If you locate one or more tiny glass 'pinch bowls' (you don't need anything wider than a movement plate) then a little fluid goes a long way. Most of any grime and residue will on the movement plate so after getting this removed change the fluid and proceed with the cleaning of individual parts inspecting and assembling as you go along.

[jdm]

21 minutes ago, WatchMaker said:

Lighter fluid is often recommended for beginners as it's cheap and readily available and fine if you're working your skills up. However you'll appreciate that it's not a horological product so may contain unwelcome additives. If you think you'll make this into a longer term hobby it's worth 'investing' in something purer like Renata Essence.

The direct replacement is petroleum ether, or refined benzine. It's cheap and available online.

[WatchMaker]

Hi @jdm - I've always used Horosolv or Renata Essence but note your comments. Are these effectively just rebranded petroleum ether?! The price difference for 250ml - plenty to start with for a hobbyist - is not that big (UK ebay = £14.89 vs £13.29) but once into larger quantities PE gets a lot cheaper by volume (e.g. 500ml is £24.99 vs £14.00) so I might consider next time I need supplies! I note that there are differing 'boiling point' ranges though. Obviously we're not into boiling this stuff when cleaning watches so does this make any difference or is there a particular range you recommend?

[jdm]

Essence (French) == Petrol (UK English) == Gasoline (US English) == Benzine (Italian, German, many others languages) == Naptha (Argentina Spanish). Chemicals for sale in the UK must make available composition and hazard info, so check there. My  knowledge of chemistry is rudimentary, but I believe that purity affects boiling point, however not making a difference for our purposes.

[WatchMaker]

Hi @jdm - I've given your reply a 'like' but this subject remains fuzzy.

Take UK based Horological Solvents Limited. They produce two products: Horosolv and Renata Essence. Both are excellent cleaners/degreasers; both are recommended for hairsprings etc.

One is aromatic hydrocarbon based the other aliphatic hydrocarbon based. So only one might share petroleum ether properties. But which is best? And if neither is best why not just have a single product? Fuzzy!

 

[nickelsilver]

I'll just throw in here that naphtha is a sort of catch-all petroleum name that could be a mix of numerous levels of petroleum distillation. Here in Switzerland the really good drug stores have pretty much any chemical you want; I use Ronson lighter fluid to clean manky clock parts before actually running through the ultrasonic so thought I'd be smart and buy a liter of pure naphtha.

 

The guy looked at me weird and asked why I wanted that and I said it's lighter fluid at a fraction off the cost. He said lighter fluid is benzine. I bought it anyway. This "pure" naphtha is super headache inducing stuff, I tried but it's actually scary. Back to lighter fluid for clocks.

 

I use benzine frequently for various watch parts, generally precleaning muck before the cleaning machine. It's not particularly safe to breathe or stick your fingers in but not particularly bed either. If isopropyl alcohol will manage I use that as it's definitely safer.

 

Side note- I needed fuel for my old Coleman camp stove and it's hard to find in Europe. Drugstore guy said "benzine, definitely", showed him the info I had and that it needs some specific mix of petroleum distillates and he held firm and danggit if my 40 year old stove doesn't run just perfectly on benzine, 5 years running.

 

BUT- there are different types of benzine rectified, distilled, and what seems to be the good one here Benzine 60/95. No residue with that one. I bought distilled benzine once from a different source and it left visible traces. And if you google distilled benzine you get- naphtha....

 

The "pure" version of which is nothing like any benzine I've tried.

 

French guy I worked with brought in benzine from France and it was different still hahahahaha.

 

If anyone wants to go down a rabbit hole try to find out what's actually in Coleman fuel. Depending how you look its "26% naphtha, 34% naphtha 10% naphtha, 13% naphtha, 17% naphtha". Which could all be classified as benzine, depending on which definition you're using. CAS numbers get foggy here...

 

 

[jdm]

3 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

BUT- there are different types of benzine rectified, distilled, and what seems to be the good one here Benzine 60/95. No residue with that one. I bought distilled benzine once from a different source and it left visible traces. And if you google distilled benzine you get- naphtha....

You're on the point as always, Normally at this point of discussion some Anglophone comes in a very serious tone to remember everyone that benzene (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzene) is toxic. No surprise, as 'E' and 'I' are often mixed since the time Britons began using the Latin script. Another guy was worried that Petroleoum ether was in fact Diethyl ether and we all would get high .

[WatchMaker]

 I guess some things weren't meant to be clear!

I'm going to educate myself and I'll come back with why (if?) an aliphatic hydrocarbon based cleaner is better (or not) than an aromatic hydrocarbon based cleaner! Wish me luck!

[nichod]

Consider this:  

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B072JXQ9P5/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_fcp.Db9D8H1RS

Dual transducers and quite well made for the money.  Even has a fan to cool the electronics and the price is nominal. 

I wish people were not afraid to specify their locations.  Here in the states, V M & P Naptha is cheap and readily available.  Chemical names vary by country.

[RyanGreerMcGilloway]

Hi all,

 

can an anyone recommend a decent ultrasonic watch cleaner with a few baskets for around the £40 mark and where to get it from. eBay?

 

i brought a sonic cleaner but all that does is just shake them around a bit.

[watchweasol]

Hi  Ultrasonic cleaners are as varied as grass, to get what suits your requirements will require a considerable amount of re search to acertain the qualities of each brand. Ebay is probably the best place to start in isolating the ones you would want. preferably get one with a heating element and variable timer.

[jdm]

19 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

Ebay is probably the best place to start in isolating the ones you would want. preferably get one with a heating element and variable timer.

These are much more than £40. Example: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32977799683.html

Personally I'm doing just fine brushing cases with hot soapy water  and cleaning movements with petroleum ether then IPA, cost 5 cents a cycle.

Edited December 24, 2019 by jdm