404 Club

[Tony13]

On 2/13/2022 at 9:32 PM, spectre6000 said:

OK, so it's viable, the question is how much would it take to make it worthwhile? I'm thinking years' worth of cast off cases and bracelets here. Not looking for any quick return, just another fun aspect of this weird bifurcated hobby. How many watches/bracelets worth went into getting that 2 grams?

I am not quite sure been a while.

It was quite a lot.

I had 30 motherboards about 60 AMD cpu's and quite a bit of memory bars around 200 or so.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Tony13

[AndyHull]

It takes quite a lot of plated and rolled gold items to get enough worth recovering. Back in the day when I worked for a company doing board level repairs and servicing I had much more access to the kind of computer scrap that might have been worth while. These days, hardly any gold is used, and most of the contacts are much smaller, so you need more stuff to make it worth your while. Having said that, some people make a living from it, so it is possible, but hard work.

 

Edited February 20, 2022 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

Having said all that, if you keep your eyes open you do still find the occasional pieces of scrap gold. I picked a ladies 18ct Omega case back a while back, in a job lot. I hadn't even spotted it in the listing, it just turned up in the box of assorted watches and movements. Not worth a huge amount, but probably something north of sixty pounds in scrap, which given that the job lot cost less than four, was a bit of a bargain.

Speaking of job lots (and 404 club stuff), this lot came in at two pounds for the four watches, or fifty pence each, plus shipping. I really only bid for the American Waltham, as I don't have a good clean example.

I have a couple of very scruffy Waltham calibres and a couple of cases in need of some TLC. That dial looks immaculate, so hopefully I can get it running and cased up in a genuine period correct case. Time will tell.

As I say, I'm optimistic about having a suitable case for the seven jewel American Waltham, which dates from some time between August 1895 and May 1899. These are not particularly rare with approximately 350 thousand of this particular mechanism produced.

None the less, clean running version are still very collectable, and can fetch hundreds of pounds depending on style condition and case material. Waltham movements were often re branded and cased by local  American jewellers, as you can see if you follow the link.

There is a high probability that the reason the mechanism is orphaned is because someone scrapped the case, since it was probably worth more than the watch at the time. Some of the Walthams did come in silver,  rolled gold and even solid gold cases.

 

The Medana may well be a cheap pin lever in a nickel silver case, but the enamel dial on that also looks pristine. I guess there is a very slim chance it might be jewelled and that case might be silver, but I have my doubts.

The no name *might* be gold plated, but that is a very long shot.

The Ingersoll might also be recoverable, but that is not a high priority.

I will of course keep you all posted if I manage to bring any of them back to life.

Edited February 21, 2022 by AndyHull

[spectre6000]

I'm not all that familiar with the history of Ingersoll, but in my mind they immediately get flushed into the "ignore" pile because they seem to universally be unjeweled pin levers. That's fully jeweled though, and likely the nicest Ingersoll I've seen (again though, I mostly see the name and move on). From that photo, it looks like the movement is very tidy and businesslike. The balance looks a bit chintzy, but aside from that it's got a charm to it... 

[AndyHull]

I have a few Ingersoll and they are a mixed bunch in terms of movement quality.

I've included a couple of zero jewel 404 club examples below.

 

Don't dismiss them out of hand, some of them are actually pretty nice, even if they are a little short on rubies.
 

[watchweasol]

Richt on Andy. because they are the lower end of the market like the Timex a lot of people dismiss them (watch Snobbery) there are exaples of them like times being abused and still running. Thery were similar to the smiths enpire and others of that era, built for the working man at a price they could afford as a daily wear. Pin lever watches had a job to do and did it well. Me  I like them.

[spectre6000]

FTR, I wasn't saying I look down my nose at them, just that when I'm 404 hunting, they get scrolled past along with the Japanese, Russian, etc. watches. Not what I'm after. I've had at least a handful of Ingersolls. 

[GuyMontag]

I won an auction for a very large number of watches from a watchmakers estate. The total cost was around $1,500 but there were easily around 1,000 to 1,500 watches, not all of them complete.  They came organized in several large dresser drawers sorted by movement.  It's been months and I'm still going through all the watches. I come across one that sparks my interest and then go down the rabbit hole looking into a watch brand I've never heard of, so I still have quite a few to figure out exactly what's in all the little envelopes. Not sure if that counts for the 404 club though.

 

 

 

 

[LittleWatchShop]

11 minutes ago, GuyMontag said:

1,000 to 1,500 watches

Have you found one that made the purchase worth it?  Sounds like a dollar per watch more or less.

[Plato]

6 hours ago, spectre6000 said:

I'm not all that familiar with the history of Ingersoll

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingersoll_Watch_Company

An American brand made in Wales 

Not much is made here any more. 

Edited February 20, 2022 by Plato
Typo

[GuyMontag]

3 hours ago, LittleWatchShop said:

Have you found one that made the purchase worth it?  Sounds like a dollar per watch more or less.

I've come across a number that I've been setting aside but have not yet photographed (including a couple of 1940's Longines Sei Tacche watches). A couple that I have taken pictures of:

 

This Movado in a stainless steel Francois Borgel case. I found an ad that called it an "Acvatic"

 

I'm a sucker for alarm watches so I really dig this Vulcain:

Edited February 20, 2022 by GuyMontag

[LittleWatchShop]

19 minutes ago, GuyMontag said:

I'm a sucker for alarm watches so I really dig this Vulcain:

I have four Crickets.,..Cal 120.  I have seen this cal on ebay, but not familiar with it.

[spectre6000]

That's a helluva haul! Hopefully there are a few more gems in there for $1500, but that seems pretty likely.
 

At a minimum (business brain kicking in), you could supply affordable assortments of practice movements for people on the forum here for a reasonable price, and easily come out ahead as long as the majority are reasonably complete or are at least in multiples that are differently incomplete.

[AndyHull]

I picked up a little no name key wind cylinder escapement pocket watch movement for £1

If I can get it to run, I may have a case for it. If not, it can sit in the stash.

 

I like the elegantly simple enamel  dial, and the fact that it is anonymous is intriguing. There may be some identification marks under the dial, and I'll try to remember to post a few pics of the teardown and re-assembly. Its a bit of a shame that the hour hand is damaged, but I guess for a pound, you can't complain.

Edited February 26, 2022 by AndyHull

[spectre6000]

I guess the key sets it as well via the center square. Is there a jewel under that screwed on plate with the setting square in the middle? Also, that balance looks interesting... I don't think we get watches like that over here....

[oldhippy]

It's a called a 5 bar movement very common. spectre6000 no jewel in the center bar where you set the hands from. Movements are Swiss and made more or less on the Swiss french border, some people mistake them as french movements.  

[AndyHull]

15 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

It's a called a 5 bar movement very common. spectre6000 no jewel in the center bar where you set the hands from. Movements are Swiss and made more or less on the Swiss french border, some people mistake them as french movements.  

The design is pretty common. It is a little unusual in that there doesn't appear to be any makers mark, but I guess it may be under the dial. It hasn't arrived yet, but I'll keep you all posted if I spot anything interesting when it arrives. @oldhippyWhat would you suggest is the age of it

@spectre6000 You can see a broadly similar movement in action here.
 

 

 

Edited February 26, 2022 by AndyHull

[oldhippy]

Around the 1880's. I don't think you will find anything under the dial as an I D. 

[AndyHull]

Just for good measure, here is another similar mechanism. This time it is a lever rather than a cylinder escapement, and this one is much finer quality. You should probably also watch part 1 to see the tear down for cleaning.
 

 

Edited February 26, 2022 by AndyHull

[oldhippy]

I've repaired so many of this I think I could still take one apart and put it all back in my sleep. This one has a nice dial. 

[AndyHull]

While we are on the subject of pocket watches, you might also like this minute repeater video.

Sadly I suspect it is well outside of the budget of the 404 club, however we can but dream.

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by AndyHull

[GuyMontag]

On 2/20/2022 at 7:13 AM, AndyHull said:

I have a few Ingersoll and they are a mixed bunch in terms of movement quality.

I've included a couple of zero jewel 404 club examples below.

Don't dismiss them out of hand, some of them are actually pretty nice, even if they are a little short on rubies.
 

Nice, I like the looks of both of those.

[AndyHull]

Thanks.

Here is another Ingersoll, this time a 17 jewelled movement that I picked up a while back.

 

I can't find any pictures of it after I cleaned and serviced it. These are from the auction listing.

As you can see, it is in the form of a tab, pin brooch/fob, or nurses watch, but I may tempted to re-case it in a wristwatch case, as the original case is nothing special, but the dial and hands are very nice.

I guess if it had been in a wristwatch case, then it wouldn't have been on the 404 club radar.

Edited February 27, 2022 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

It seems that there may have been some "re-branding" of PU (or perhaps cardboard) fake leather here in India. 
I see quite a few of the low cost watch bands are being marketed as "vegan" leather.

Now to the best of my knowledge, while veganism shuns animal based products, there is no such thing as "vegan" leather.

Artificial leather, yes, vegan... not so much, especially since I can almost guarantee that these watches use petroleum based alternatives to leather, which are arguably as bad for the environment as the leather industry is. 

[KarlvonKoln]

So is it, like, their own version of Naugahyde?