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I have a major problem with vendor lock in. To my mind it is one of the most insidious aspects of human behaviour. A cynical move driven purely by greed. The simple fact is, there is absolutely nothing unique about a {insert name of manufacturer here} watch part. A gear is a gear, a spring is a spring, brass is brass, gold is gold. Even if you make your part out of unicorn droppings and elf sh*t, it is still a part at the end of the day. It is not some magic incantation that allows you to open someone else's wallet and help yourself to the contents, simply because your part forged from unicorn droppings failed. I am not advocating cloning or ripping off other peoples designs, I am simply stating that a part for a watch should be readily available at a reasonable price to anyone who needs it. This is of course not the way we have collectively decided to behave. We are constantly being reminded that were are mere consumers, and we have a duty to consume (apparently). Therefore, repairing stuff is anti-consumerist, and we should all be ashamed of ourselves for even thinking that we are worthy enough beings to be allowed to fix stuff. "Shut up and buy new stuff, and the hell with the planet" seems to be the mantra we are meant to be following.

Short answer, no it is not illegal, like this fact or not. Cousins UK ave been battling against this posture since some good 5 years, spent a lot of money to attack and defend themselves without any result. Neither the EU or anybody other regulatory body in the world do care, even less now with much bigger problems at hand. In the end it is about luxury, unnecessary spending, if you want to play or do business with repairing watches either understand what the rules of the games are, or live with the frustration.

I work in the chemical industry the effect of the corona virus lockdown is just starting to bite, for instance the company I work for provides crop protection products, there has been a 30 percent drop in demand for barley crops, with bars and restaruants closed beer production has been hammered farmers are not going to produce anywhere near their usual yield and if they do will be stuck with it, there are other sectors of the market suffering too, the car industry has already started closing plants and restructuring, we have 4 million workers in the U.K furloughed and not actively working with the government covering 80% of cost of their wages the piper needs paying eventually and many of these workers are non essential otherwise they would have still been working there is no guarantee they will have jobs to go back to after all this is over, the U.K high street is on its arse before all this started I cant see it recovering to its previous fragile state after this, no matter how you look at this world recession is on the way.

I'd wait my feeling is we have a recession looming that will be of a nature no one living today will have witnessed before, Swiss watches have been way over priced for a least a decade, if the recession comes people will be ditching them for cash and the non essential luxury goods market will suffer luxury watches will not be anyone's priority soon.

What I find interesting is on the other end of the price scale. Five dollar plastic quartz watches in cases that somebody spent a couple hundred dollars for because they like the way it looked or the like the brand name and they don't care because nobody bothered to tell them that their watch inside is worth five dollars. After all If your A watch salesman why would you tell someone what's inside the watch your there to make money.

This is an early peseux 320, a fine movement jeweled pallet and true work horse, one piece stem and a front loader. Countless brands housed one, though different grades. I too recommend it be entrusted with experienced hands to tick for another generation. Regards

A quick look on ebay. I have found these clocks. Made in china and extremely poor in every way. Do not waste your money. A genuine French carriage clock would never have holes drilled in the bell. Hardly ever do they have a sweep second hand. The platforms are normally made of brass some are silvered. I can only assume the Chinese platforms are of a metal to look like it is silvered, they are very poor. If you are considering on purchasing a French carriage clock you can ask me for advice and I will whiling advice. I expect these links to disappear when there time is up on ebay. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Cloisonne-Enamel-Carriage-Clock-with-Twin-Bell-Chiming-Repeater/273257850972?hash=item3f9f6fe85c:g:2IAAAOSwJiJbFC2Y I have no idea who made this. It is very poor quilty https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Antique-Carriage-Alarm-Clock-Brass-Complete-Working/392052641707?hash=item5b48288fab:g:5OMAAOSwhHJbCq3s https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Brass-Repeating-Carriage-Alarm-Clock-M-D-Ger/273257911846?hash=item3f9f70d626:g:CjIAAOSwSlRa7y8N https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Cloisonne-Enamel-Carriage-Clock-Twin-Bell-Chiming-Repeater/182932078625?hash=item2a979a0021:g:F74AAOSwUwFaEvpc https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VINTAGE-REPRODUCTION-SOLID-BRASS-CARRIAGE-CLOCK-PLATFORM-MOVEMENT/202102035369?hash=item2f0e3853a9:g:V6oAAOSws6ZZ-3ff

Yes they are but when it comes to mechanical men's watches nor having precious material, most buyers are Western World men below 50 yrs of age, and well informed about "whats is what", emerging trends, etc. Now, try to convince them that Euro 10,000 for a Rolex/Omega/Patek/Grand Seiko etc is too much? And that not much less for a Breitling/Oris/etc, is still too much? They know what they are buying, they know how hard is to earn that money, and they still buy the product. I think have a point, when with few exception that is an "investment" that will hold value in the long time, perhaps just a bit diluted by the exorbitant official service fee, if one chooses to go that route. All 2824 parts are available but the problem comes when you look for a special execution part like a different height hand carrying wheel, top grade parts, etc. Or when you go up the scale for other movements. Now look, at this time Cousins is adding desirable original Rolex parts. Try asking them details about how they get these and they would be in their right to not answer. I have no problem believing that things are more fluid and based on good old business sense than just a blanket "no parts period" posture.

Not unless it had a chronometer certified 2824-2 under the hood!

This debate has been going on for many years. I warned my fellow horologists in article that was published in the BHI magazine that the Swiss decision not sell parts to the general trade would not only destroy many horological businesses but it would cost the Swiss companies such as SWATCH big time. Remember SWATCH at the time had the industry sown up with many watch companies just installing ETA movements. BUT instead of investing in an interchangeable smart watch movement it decided to fight in the courts to defend its position. Companies such a APPLE could believe their luck and filled the gap. Cousins have lead the fight spending copious amounts of money in the courts. In the mean time the Japanese manufactures (such as seiko) have increased their market share. The mistake the Swiss made is bad news travels such as a Rolex service £600 etc etc. Many horologist just retired and the loser was the buying public.

Breitling's videos are great, give them a look. I would not judge you or anyone that buys a luxury watch, I got myself one in my early 20s and don't regret it. All I like to point out is how much "industrial value" is within a watch. Would you pay Euro 80,000 for a regular VW Golf?

I'm pretty sure that you ain't got a "Chinese tourbillon" because that (ST8240) reatails for $1,700, still a fraction compared to Swiss. You mov't is some common "open hart blance" or other flashy contraption. However it was good to start with because being cheap or free, it taught you that parts for Chinese are not available, and things are not as easy as they seem. Good luck with your future endeavours!

That's the normal overpricing that some Swiss makers manage to apply to their watches, an healthy 400% markup over perhaps Euro 600 of fair value. Since they get away with that, hats off to them, some type of advertising is not cheap to sustain.

Hi Wes and welcome to the forum Not the right watch to start on I am afraid, I should lay hold of some simple/robust Russian movements, available at low cost therefore any damage done is low value, the chinese Tourbillion is not easy as you found out and also parts/tech information is scarce. Another good starter is the Seiko range, plenty of spares and plenty of tech information. Put it down to experience and move on all the best

Hi Attached is the AS 1320 tech sheet you should be able to find it on there I hope cheers AS 1320,1323.pdf

All This Bull Sh*t is protectionism on the part of the manufacturer. You only have to look at SWATCH to see how that works. The most commonly used movement the ETA is now under their brand and the legal wrangling carried out by Robin Cousins of Cousins uk w ho took his case to the , European court. As SWATCH is Swiss owned the European court kicked the ball into the long grass sooner than take up a fair challenge on behalf of the consumer so as not to up set a major contributor and there the ball stays and the manufacturers do as they please.

This is a Breitling Ladies Diver, which is half diameter of the Mens Breitling Marine Star. I’m currently restoring it but struggling to obtain a new crystal (chrome armour ring, diver profile). I’m going to try to obtain one direct from SternKreuz. In the photo, the bezel is missing but I have now managed to acquire one with the wire retaining spring which is a bonus. The movement is an Adolf Shilds, automatic (I forget the calibre) but it is running so well I’m reluctant to service it. New stainless steel crown with double o ring is on order from cousins, but the case seal is proving to be a nightmare. Wherever I search they seem to be obsolete. I look forward to any comments or advice. Kind regards Deggsie Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Beware, this game can get addictive. Will you treat yourself to a tour of Chaumet dandy.

Yep, that's the post that inspired me to write this one!

See my earlier post. Lol. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

The whole question of price is based on brand names, the bigger the brand the greater the price. The same can be said at the other end of the scale the greater profit is a cheap movement in a flash big brand case. The average watch buyer knows nothing about the mechanics of the watch only that it carries an in you face big brand and by that has street cred. But as Old Hippy says its their money and if they want to spend it on a flash watch with no guts that's their problem. They only get disapointed when it stops and Mr watchmaker tells them it cant be fixed and the answer then is I paid £££££s for that watch. Up till then is just bling on the wrist.

Hi all, This is my first watch build. I started it in January 2020 with no previous experience of watches or watchmakers tools and it's been quite a learning curve but hugely enjoyable. It runs on a Miyota 8215 movement that appears to be working well (after a few issues with hands getting stuck). Total Cost of materials was £115. I've never owned an automatic watch before so am enjoying wearing this, but I think the dial looks pretty bland without some form of personalisation. I'd appreciate any thoughts on how it looks now or how others think it could be improved. I've had a great time on this project and am happy with the cost, but would be interested to hear what others think of the total cost of the build, does it seem worth it? Cheers, Tom

I think I saw one broken tooth in barrel, completely missing.

As you turned the gears, ratchet wheel etc, you stayed within an interval turning clock&anticlock, what if a faulty tooth is located outside that interval, will you turn a full turn of the barrel.

I would tear the stem out and bin the movement. The steel parts in quartz movements will be toast by this stage and not worth your time trying to save.

The strange thing with this set is it's not a general-purpose sets which I think would be more useful. In other words is made for specific calibers. Then they didn't clone the handle the way it normally should Look? Plus there's no mystery pieces? So for instance here's a link to the eta set and And a PDF with a few more details. https://www.bergeon.swiss/assortiment-de-12-estrapades-pour-calibre-eta.html Here is a link to the general purpose set. With an added bonus the PDF here is much much nicer as It explains how to use the Winder. https://www.bergeon.swiss/assort-estrapades.html

Breitling, like IWC and others that I don't care to mention here is another notorious "overcharger" which bases sales on active lifestyle sponsorships and advertising - they deliver little innovation beside casemaking. Most people would not even care to know that for the same money you can buy a bespoken automatic watch, designed and produced in house during this decade.

Maybe I misunderstand your post. "Normal people" don't by a watch primarily for its movement. What matters is the brand and what it looks like. You can buy a new Breitling for $4000 housing an ETA 2824-2 (albeit decorated and chronometer).

Replacing the part with a genuine one fixed immediately any issue!! I'm, so happy now. Thank you all for the suggestions! Ascanio

By expensive you mean about $160? I notice one on eBay when I did a search it looks like it's in a really nice condition. When I was looking for your part online I did find one missing the discs? This implies that they come out perhaps. The Rolex parts listings are weird because the 1570 refers you back to the base caliber of 1530 neither listings indicate this ring? But if you go to the 15 75 which has a base caliber 1530 the ring is there. So on that listing where we can see the ring you can see the other part that I highlighted the stud and I think that's what you're looking for. In any case if that's your problem and you don't want to pay to get a replacement then I would push it out and see if you can polish it.

Practice is the main thing, beyond that it's also safe to assume that every part has a purpose and will fit where it is intended (don't force anything).. this isn't always the case, particularly with 19th century watches which were rather handmade - similar screws may be found with punch marks to indicate which goes in each hole, or jewel locations, etc.. in this case the screw threads may not be identical like modern threads. On modern movements some bits like the bridge screws are pretty interchangeable, usually with a shorter screw to clear the keyless works. If in doubt take pictures, I use my phone camera for stuff which is likely to cause some questions - usually for camera shutters but it applies to anything new to me.. and having a few pictures afterwards can be nice to look back on too. I'd recommend taking a picture of the keyless works for the first few times - occasionally I still find little springs are going to be difficult to remember to get their places correct - say if they're the same size but only have some slight difference. Lastly there are some guides, forums, and blogs which can be helpful for gaining an insight into other peoples practices or solutions to problems.

We live in a interesting world where quite a few people do not realize that things can be fixed. That even less people know anyone who can fix a watch. So if you make the mistake of mentioning to anyone that you can fix watches suddenly all kinds of people will have watches for you to fix. Then of course the problem do you really want to work on your friends watches? Like for instance if you break the watch will this person be understanding and still be your friend or will they be unhappy? My preferred thought is you should start on something like a ETA caliber 6497 or 6498 Clone off of eBay. You really do need to practice on a running watch which is why you get a new watch there really cheap off of eBay. Then you can practice taking it apart putting it back together and if it doesn't work after you put it back together because it was running in the first place you know who to blame. Typically when people start with broken watches and there's still broken they'll blame that on the watch versus may be who was playing with the watch. Then you really should stay away from pin lever watches and Timex watches as yes they can be fixed but they have their own challenges which can lead the frustrations for beginners. Than the recommended watch I have is nice because the technical sheet available and the Swiss even have the link below the step-by-step disassembly and reassembly instructions. http://www.eta.ch/swisslab/6497/6947.html I think you'll find if you really want to remove the movement the stem comes out, the two case screws and the movement goes out through the front which means you have to take the crystal off.

Now there is some sound advise from jdm. If you can do a timex this should be easier. But heed jdm's advise and practise , practise on a cheapie both you and your friend will benifit from the knowledge gained. wish you well

Success !! with your help and minimal tools, I managed to get my watch up and running again. thank you all very much i put new hands on that look a bit overly (old hands lume had fallen off ) with the new lume compared to the patina on the face. I could not for the life of me get the new second hand on, but original went on easy. really happy at the mo, hope it all doesn’t fall apart . cheers Gary

Hi I think the genuine part will fix it after market parts although look the same quite often are not. Consider the crispness of the edges of the pattern part are they sharp if not that is likely the problem sliding over the pin not along it.

That is not how the process works. It is more akin to this. 1) Print dial designs on to clear decal slide toner paper with a laser printer, in black toner. 2) Pass said designs, still on the sheet, along with a piece of the metalised or white/coloured heat transfer film through a pouch laminating machine. This fuses the transfer foil material to the decal paper and you should end up with a decal that has white, gold, bronze or whatever, in the places where your black toner is. 3) You use the water slide decal in the normal way. You can use the laser printer to do the heating, if you don't have a pouch laminator, using tape, but this is risky as you may end up with glue from the tape on your laser printer fuser rollers. Here is one of many guides from the interwebz that shows the process done that way. https://cedarcanyontextiles.com/outrageous-idea-transfer-foil-to-paper-with-a-laser-printer/ Note, your design is limited by the resolution of the laser printer, and these are typically around 600dpi. Inkjet printers will produce finer detail, but they cannot be used with heat transfer foils, and generally can't print white, unless you go for some very specialised and expensive printers and inks.

It has been for a long time what really surprises me is the prices they are fetching on a regular basis and it seems a lot of dealers just dont care and list them as antique when I'm sure they know full well they are not. Here is a miniature carriage clock movement from china very poor quality and yet as I write its at £95.00 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Miniature-Carriage-Clock-Movement-With-Enamel-Clock-Face/113024026604?hash=item1a50c1c7ec:g:XBAAAOSwdrlbCG1~ This is a real shocker as far as quality goes but the seller is listing it as a antique French clock its a turd and I said as much on the comments on his you tube video: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Perfect-French-mini-Anglaise-engraved-8-days-carriage-clock/192549610344?hash=item2cd4d9e368:g:IjAAAOSwao1bFYO2 And the video for this absolute delight: And the following type of clock has been appearing for 4 or 5 years both in auction houses and Ebay always the same model they are crap but fetch silly money https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/French-Style-Petite-Sonnerie-Striking-Quarter-Repeater-Brass-Carriage-Clock/253505077158?hash=item3b06147fa6:g:~3kAAOSw-3FZHPJC One of the above sold a couple of weeks ago on ebay in the u.k for £523

As ever a concise unambiguous reply to points raised, without preaching! Thank you Marc.