Balance removal from captured index

[Woolshire]

I’ve noticed folks that are working on shock jewel watches rarely remove the balance from the cock, which makes perfect sense. But when working on an older watch, a technique needs to be implemented to fully remove the balance. 
I’m curious how others do it. I pull the balance and cock off and gently turn it over. I then place a brass nail across the cock, under the balance. I hold that down firmly while I turn the index yÿto allow the balance to be removed. I also keep holding it until the hairspring stud is removed.

is this similar to how others do it?

[mikepilk]

I find the hairspring stud is awkward.  I put the cock+balance upside down on some pith wood, so I can get the screw driver horizontal. But often a balance wheel arm is right above where you're trying to work .  That's why I often loosen the screw while the cock is still in the movement. Putting it back is harder. 

To turn the regulator boot, I just hold the balance cock (inverted) flat on the desk with a finger. If it's curved, small, I use Rodico to hold it.

I considered trying to make something to hold the balance cock upside down, but there's so many different shapes and sizes it's not easy.

I'd like to hear if anyone has a better method

[Nucejoe]

 Fixed stud holders generally came in two types,

One;,    stud friction fitted into the hole of the stud holder,

Two;     stud is secured in the hole by a screw.

 Other designs were manufactured too.

 I unscrew the stud with cock still on the mainplate, so there is no need to hold the cock down with brass or wooden stick,  the movement& movement holder hold the cock secure. this is safer and easier. 

Usually faults in hairspring show when the oscilator is running, little faults however might go unnoticed specially if at or near the collet. You really don't have a good view of the coil unless the oscilator is out so it can be inspected under good magnification. I don't believe a audmars piguet get reassembled with a little fault in the coil. 

Regs

 

[watchweasol]

The hairspring/balancespring can be removed in either of the described methods, its just a matter of choice and which method you prefer. The criteria in either method is to be careful because as many have found out the spring is easily damaged

[LittleWatchShop]

This is a great topic. I have struggled with this issue.

i started using pith wood as a base with inverted cock, but it is too soft. you can accidentally press the cock into the pith wood. instead, I use a bench block.

I don't like removing hair springs, but for vintage non shock watches you have to in order to remove the cap jewel.

I have started removing the stud screw while on the plate, but that does not work in reverse.

[Nucejoe]

1 hour ago, LittleWatchShop said:

 

I have started removing the stud screw while on the plate, but that does not work in reverse.

 There is no need to remove the stud screw,  just loosening it enough to slide the stud out would do, I always make sure to tighten the screw all the way back in, it tends to unscrew and fall out in cleaning machine, specially in ultrasonic.

Use a wider blade driver on stud screw, twice to three times wider than screw slot, this would reduce chances of the blade leaving the slot in case of a little slipage.

Friction fitted studs are least versatile and riskiest to remove. I lift the cock and balance out, hold the stud in tweezers( tweezers supported by bench top)  and push the stud out. Nice to have a anvil to support the stud arm against. 

Regs

[Woolshire]

Yes, I will admit I have totally messed up hairsprings trying to hold down with my finger and suddenly…fling! The balance cock flips away and the balance ends up, still attached and upside down under/around the cock…talk about immediate blood pressure issues?!?! 
of course, this is only an issue on non-shock jewel watches with captured index

[LittleWatchShop]

1 hour ago, Nucejoe said:

no need to remove the stud screw,

Sorry, I misspoke. I just loosen it.

[Woolshire]

Here’s a photo of how I hold the balance cock while removing it via the index turn and balance stud screw….but another question: how in the heck do I get the jewels free? This is a little Omega (r13.5 calibre). Not screws but looks like the cover should turn to align the free spots, but it doesn’t want to turn. Another new one for me.

Edited December 25, 2021 by Woolshire

[Plato]

28 minutes ago, Woolshire said:

Not screws but looks like the cover should turn to align the free spots, but it doesn’t want to turn

This video might help, have a look at 21:00 onward. Not sure if it's the same calibre but it looks like a similar retention method. 

 

[mikepilk]

57 minutes ago, Woolshire said:

Here’s a photo of how I hold the balance cock while removing it via the index turn and balance stud screw….but another question: how in the heck do I get the jewels free? This is a little Omega (r13.5 calibre). Not screws but looks like the cover should turn to align the free spots, but it doesn’t want to turn. Another new one for me.

That holds it down nice and firmly, but it means your screwdriver is either at an angle or on the desk to undo the stud screw. That's why I hold it down either on a bench block, or some pith wood. 

As shown in the video, put a screwdriver in the slot to get at the jewel.