Help needed removing crystal & movement

[NigelB]

Hi All

Not sure how to proceed with this as I've always been able to remove the movement from the back before.

I have a Roamer Vanguard 303 with a removable back that I need to strip down to clean out some dried black gunk, however the movement appears to be held into the case with screws from the rear.

 Am I missing something ? or do I need a claw tool to remove the glass to be able to remove the movement ?

Roamer Vanguard 303

All stainless steel Model 802 - 5120.303

Case number inside back 311802

Any help would be greatly appreciated

 

[oldhippy]

As it’s a Roamer I expect it has a two piece stem. They pull out, you need to have something behind the button and give a good pull. I always used nippers. You will need to remove the glass with a crystal lift. Then un- screw the two screws (red arrows) the movement should drop out from the front. Un-do the stem screw (green arrow)  

[NigelB]

1 minute ago, oldhippy said:

As it’s a Roamer I expect it has a two piece stem. They pull out, you need to have something behind the button and give a good pull. I always used nippers. You will need to remove the glass with a crystal lift. Then un- screw the two screws (red arrows) the movement should drop out from the front. Un-do the stem screw (green arrow)  

Thanks @oldhippy I had a feeling that was going to be the case but wanted to be sure before I go breaking things, I will order up a tool for removing the Glass then proceed as you have advised. 

I did remove the stem & case screws but replaced them as there were no signs of the movement coming free, and I was wary of damaging anything.

[ro63rto]

As it’s a Roamer I expect it has a two piece stem. They pull out, you need to have something behind the button and give a good pull. I always used nippers. You will need to remove the glass with a crystal lift. Then un- screw the two screws (red arrows) the movement should drop out from the front. Un-do the stem screw (green arrow)  

Are you sure?
Only seen that in their Waterproof cases that push out from a carrier then the sandwiched acrylic crystal/case can be separated etc...

[vinn3]

   as i most wristwatches,   when you remove the stem,  try to get somthng ( or the stem) back in there after removing the mvt., to prevent the crown gear "upsetting" while the mvt. is being worked on.     this does not apply if total tear down.  vin

[NigelB]

Thanks everyone for the help so far.

Whilst I'm waiting for the tool to remove the crystal, and guessing the black stuff is some sort of sealer, should there be an 'O' ring fitted in the groove in the case to seal the back ?

If there should be a seal how are they sized and where can I get one ?

[oldhippy]

If it is a screw on back then yes. Snap on back I would say no. A good watch materials supplier will have them. If you look at the top of the forum see resources hover over that and you will parts and tools suppliers, click that and you will see a list of countries pick which which one you need.

[ro63rto]

If it is a screw on back then yes. Snap on back I would say no. A good watch materials supplier will have them. If you look at the top of the forum see resources hover over that and you will parts and tools suppliers, click that and you will see a list of countries pick which which one you need.

Snap backs need gaskets too

[oldhippy]

Agree. But looking at it I do not think there is enough room for an 0 ring if its snap on. 

[Nucejoe]

The 802 indicates caliber,  MST 802. 

I release the power and start to unscrew eveything, penetrating oil on everhthing that dosn,t come out peacefully.

[Hamish]

Just my view, but I think the stem should come out after releasing the stem retaining screw. I think there is a movement spacer in there as well that is probably held fast by possibly corrosion and or the remnants of an o ring. Penetrating oil might do the trick, but also might cause dial staining. See if you can gently tease out the spacer after movement retaining screw removal or at least see if you can get any movement in it, this would provide a clue.

I provide this advice without any knowledge of this watch or movement.....one thing for sure though, when it comes out you will know exactly what was holding it in place. I guess the trick is to find out before something gets damaged.

Good luck

 

[vinn3]

On ‎6‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 5:23 AM, oldhippy said:

Agree. But looking at it I do not think there is enough room for an 0 ring if its snap on. 

     some of those snap backs have a thin seal ring,  hardly an o ring,  generly fall apart.  vin

[NigelB]

I am making note of all the suggestions, Thanks everyone.

Yes it is a snap on back, and it's tight to remove and refit ( back won't go on without a press )

Now before I start removing the glass, it has been suggested that the movement is fitted into a mounting ring.

Can anyone clarify as to whether or not there is a mounting ring or not before I try to remove the glass from the front as if it has a mounting ring then I would expect the movement and glass to come out from the back. 

I have looked and cannot see a joint line from the rear so was expecting this to be a front loader ( never had one before ) so, something totally new to me, and I'm expecting the removal tool to arrive in monday's post.

[MrRoundel]

I think that you are in best position to see if there's a movement ring. If you look with magnification at where the case/ring seam would be, and there isn't one, I'd have to say it's a front-loading case, and is mounted much like old pocket watches, which almost always came out the front, albeit with less effort. The black stuff makes it hard to see for sure, but I don't really see a seam from here. Good luck.

 

Edited June 8, 2019 by MrRoundel

[NigelB]

Thanks for all the suggestions, just to bring this up to date ......

The movement is fitted into a mounting ring fitted from the back and on this particular watch the stem and crown are all in one piece.

After much cleaning with wood and plastic scrapers and a bit of pressure I managed to remove the mounting ring and the movement from the case. I took photo's at every point of the strip down so hopefully it will go back together in a logical sequence and all the parts are seperated into small groups to aid in reassembly, now to start cleaning all the black stuff out of the components and plates.

The glass came out from the front of the watch and seems to have a steel ring fitted to the inside diameter of the glass, is this a removable part ?

[vinn3]

Quote

 

   the ring is part of the case,  holding mvt. in.   the proper crystol fits over it.  vin

[jdm]

1 hour ago, NigelB said:

The glass came out from the front of the watch and seems to have a steel ring fitted to the inside diameter of the glass, is this a removable part ?

Kind of. It's called tension ring, you can research this term to learn about that old system.

Edited June 16, 2019 by jdm

[NigelB]

Thanks @jdm its easier if you know the correct name / term, that helps a lot.