Relume Watch Hands.

[Geo]

This is a personal view only.

If it is lume on the markers and paint on the numbers, I would match the hands to the markers.

If it is lume on the numbers I would match the hands to the numbers, which I think would look better anyway.

[BeyondWorld]

I wish I knew what lacquer and thinner bergeon use, I go through this stuff like there's no tomorrow. And it's getting a little expensive £7 - £8 per tiny little bottle.

[cdjswiss]

For a large jar of quality lume + thinners try Ranfft's material:

 

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun.cgi?10&ranfft&b7&1usem&1456959601

 

or for smaller jars:

 

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun.cgi?10&ranfft&b6&1usem&1456959602

 

Not low-cost but, as he says: optimized for use.

 

Useful notes on the application of lume - similar to Mark's

[BeyondWorld]

I only really need the thinner, as I've mixed up a collection of pigments for matching the hands with what's already on the dial.

 

I've tried lighter fluid, acetone, turpentine and acrylic paint thinner.

 

And none of it works. Just doesn't mix in and separates with the binder.

[ramrod]

so what IS the thinner? i would have guessed acetone would cut anything.

[Geo]

Could it be cellulose thinners that you require?

[Ado213]

I've found that the bought lacquers can sometimes harden to an extent that you can't apply them if your doing a dial and hands at the same time, you just some run out of time.

It's also a pain then to mix another batch with the exact same consistency as the last so it matches.

A tip that works for me, I use UV curing clear nail polish as my lacquer for powdered lume's, it's fairly inexpensive, doesn't harden as you use it and of course you can cure it under uv light I less the 20 secs. If you are luming 12 indices on a dial it's nice to add or remove droplets with an oiler, this method allows you to get all 12 nice and equal,

Top tip, don't do this in daylight

[BeyondWorld]

I've found that the bought lacquers can sometimes harden to an extent that you can't apply them if your doing a dial and hands at the same time, you just some run out of time.

It's also a pain then to mix another batch with the exact same consistency as the last so it matches.

A tip that works for me, I use UV curing clear nail polish as my lacquer for powdered lume's, it's fairly inexpensive, doesn't harden as you use it and of course you can cure it under uv light I less the 20 secs. If you are luming 12 indices on a dial it's nice to add or remove droplets with an oiler, this method allows you to get all 12 nice and equal,

Top tip, don't do this in daylight

 

Are you able to use a thinner with the UV nail polish or is it a case of once it's set it's set?

[ramrod]

Are you able to use a thinner with the UV nail polish or is it a case of once it's set it's set?

 +1 . my question exactly.

[Ado213]

Good question. Haven't actually tried it with thinners, it's not as viscous as the normal lacquer, so haven't needed it. I have done hands and indices markers with it to good effect without any problems on shrinkage etc

[ramrod]

so, it just sits there until you apply the light to it? that is way too easy. that's the direction i need to go. i've done a test on a junk dial, and i STILL felt way too rushed to do a nice job.

[rogart63]

I've found that the bought lacquers can sometimes harden to an extent that you can't apply them if your doing a dial and hands at the same time, you just some run out of time.

It's also a pain then to mix another batch with the exact same consistency as the last so it matches.

A tip that works for me, I use UV curing clear nail polish as my lacquer for powdered lume's, it's fairly inexpensive, doesn't harden as you use it and of course you can cure it under uv light I less the 20 secs. If you are luming 12 indices on a dial it's nice to add or remove droplets with an oiler, this method allows you to get all 12 nice and equal,

Top tip, don't do this in daylight

What kind of uv lamp do you use? And where do you buy the clear coat nailpolish? 

[bobm12]

Hi guys,

 

I've been following this threads with interest and by my recent experience with luminova from ofrei, I believe it just has to be the right mixture (consistency). I was able to prepare enough for a bunch of different Seiko hands. My way:

 

1.- dip watch hands in acetone

 

2.- clean thoroughly (acetone will have dissolved the old lume)

 

3.- If needed, sand lightly

 

4.- prepare the mixture: lume powder, varnish and thinner. Texture is kind of flowing almost liquid but not quite. Mix thoroughly.

 

5.- Apply with oiler (usually the yellow one but it depends)

 

Since you prepare the mixture in the very last minute -- having everything else ready beforehand -- chances are your lume never dries out while you are working it...also, prepare a reasonable amount: too little dries faster, too much is a waste.

 

I hope this helps,

 

Cheers,

 

Bob

 

PS. When applying lume to watch hands, it gives me an idea I'm making bubbles with this round thing we used as a kid....maybe this mind picture helps to realize how little lume is really needed for each hand...and how important is to have it right the first time!

[Ado213]

For the UV lamp, just search eBay, they range from £10 to £35. I use CND shellac UV base coat, but I guess any clear uv curable nail shellac would do.

When just doing hands, normal luming method is fine and does work well, but when doing indices at the same time and out of the same mix I always seem to run out of time, as I'm applying the lume the viscosity changes as it hardens slightly

Then I have to do another mix and it's never the same in terms of viscosity and lume powder content and therefore doesnt match.

You only need seconds to cure this product under a uv lamp, mine is a 35 watt unit probably too strong a light as I don't even have to put the dial and hands directly under it, just near it is enough to cure them.

[ramrod]

good info guys. thank you.

my only real worry is having the mix harden during a dial relume and then having an issue with consistancy.

i'm not worried about doing the hands.

[Vich]

Thanks to Mark for the Vid and everyone else for the additional info.

I have been able to do a half decent job on my first re-lume and I am well pleased.

First I researched for colour and got the lume that I hoped would be close to a match. It changed colour on drying but that was to my advantage, I would love to claim skill but it was pure luck. It has some luminescence but I don't really care about that part.

This is the before image it looks more orange in this photo than it actually is.

Got the stuff together

Hands have been cleaned with soap solution in the ultrasonic and all the old lume came off, then given a good bath in isopropanol to get rid of any soap or grease.

Following Marks advice, it seems to go on quite thick but on drying the thickness disappears, I ended up giving it two coats as it was a bit translucent with just the one

It even glows a bit

Last pic I have rested the hands on the dial which as yet is uncleaned, probably will just be given a gentle wipe down with cotton buds and mild fairy liquid solution.

Not too shabby, and I would never even have tried it if it was not for help given on this forum - Thanks to all

[Geo]

Nice job Vic, I look forward to seeing the completed watch!

[OmarHaltam]

Thank you very much for the tutorial, I am learning quite a bit from everyone. I wish you all the very best.

and special thanks to Mark for all the hard work and effort on your videos and tutorials. 

Thank you

 

Omar, raleigh USA

[szbalogh]

Here is how i do the relume Since i am hobby watchmaker i am using cheap chinese powders. It turned out that they are really good for the price! There are three types that are white in daylight each with different properties (the colored ones are from this 3 type with some paint added, lol). The night green one has the highest initial brightness which goes pale quickly. The turquoise has low initial brightness and loosing it as fast as the green one. And the deep blue has lowest initial brightness but is as bright as the green one in half an hour and much brighter after a night. You can see all of them glowing after a night and even after a day in complete darkness if Your eyes got used to it.

Particle size is really important! The bigger the brighter. But bigger ones are harder to apply and looking ugly on the watch. So we have to make a compromise here. There are pigments sold in ~ 1mm particles which need to be grinded and sieved. Used this sieves:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T304-Stainless-Steel-Co**BLEEP**-Dense-Gauze-Woven-Mesh-5-to-500-width-3-to-20-VA-/181505011630?var=&hash=item2a428aafae:m:mr9ZSZ3z9I76O9J31WG9ejA

Between 0.03 and 0.07 mm is perfect. It is important to leave out the finest batch since it will fade the lume.

The three whites here have a good particle size:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-Super-Bright-Glow-In-The-Dark-Powder-Luminous-Pigment-Strontium-Aluminate-10g-/222043965311?hash=item33b2da077f:g:PfEAAOSwjVVVr63b

Tried acrylic (Tamyia x22), nail polish and UV nail polish up to now. Acrylic is soft if hardened and may be soluble in water and can adsorb it even if cured. You have to exclude water since strontium-aluminate will fade in presence of it. Simple nail polish is excellent, i dilute it with semi-polar solvents like "epamine" solvent (mix of aromatics and alcohols). In particular, You have to use those with high boiling point. Check the composition; look for xylene and n- or iso-butyl alcohol. If toluene and/or iso-propyl alcohol is written on the label then dont buy, it will evaporate quickly. These solvents are also OK for the UV gel. Just deposit the mix on the surface and let it dry, and expose to UV thereafter.

Mix the prepared paint every time before taking from it, since the big particles will settle at the bottom and You wont get consistent coating on the different indices or hands.

Using dichloromethane for removing the old lume quickly. Using ear cotton buds dipped in this solvent if the hands are painted to scrub down the old lume carefully not to touch the upper side of the hands.

Just sanding down the excess if to thick layer is applied with sandpaper after curing. Usually leave 2 days for acrylic and simple nail polish to cure perfectly. The acrylic is much softer.

Here is my every day watch with the green on the dial and hands and deep blue on the bezel.

And some comparison of the powders. You can compare the lume brightness dependence on the particle size looking at the small vials. First batch is 0.075-0.106 mm and the smallest batch in the middle of the picture (<0.032mm). The blue ones on the right are on their original grain size:

 

 

[vinn3]

I have noticed that OTTO FREI  does not want to  copy his web page.

[bobm12]

Great results SZ! I might try your way too, especially when I'll be saving a lot of money!

Vinn, you can always do CTL-C and CTL-V to copy and paste in the ofrei page.

Cheers,

Bob