Automatic Seiko, Not Holding Charge.

[ftwizard]

Hello everyone, my first post. I have very limited watch knowledge. (none)

 

I have just acquired my Dad's old Seiko 5 watch, but it doesn't hold much of a charge, probably about 6 or 7 hours.

Is this acceptable? and if not, what would be the minimum I would need to do to get it back up to scratch?

[Blacklab]

Welcome to the forum. No minimum really, it probably needs a full service and would benefit from a new mainspring. Can you let us know the model number (something like 7S26-0020) and the serial number? A couple of photos would be helpful too.

[ftwizard]

6309-8230
1D0929

 

 

Wow, a bit big, sorry.

[ftwizard]

I guess that makes it December 1981 ?

[clockboy]

I would say a service is needed.

[Blacklab]

I guess that makes it December 1981 ?

Looks like it. Just one other thing, when you shake the watch does the rotor sound like its scraping inside the case?

[Ishima]

Firstly, I think what you mean to say is it's not staying wound. I don't know if I'm just being pedantic, or whether you might be confusing 'kinetics' that run off a rechargeable cell and circuitry. (but otherwise work on the same principle with a rotating weight that recharges/rewinds the watch), and automatics which are, instead, entirely mechanical. 

I don't mean to be in anyway condescending, I'd just thought that was worth clarifying. 

Edited November 25, 2015 by Ishima

[ftwizard]

Looks like it. Just one other thing, when you shake the watch does the rotor sound like its scraping inside the case?

Now you mention it, it does sound a bit rough when I shake it. Do I need to have a look inside?

What's the best way to take the back off without the correct tool?

[Blacklab]

Bit of an Achilles Heel with Seiko's, this could be as simple as the rotor retaining screw coming loose or a worn rotor bearing. The only way to take the back off is with the correct tool, there are various about, I use a Jaxa.

 

The power reserve on these is normally 40 to 50 hours.

[clockboy]

Hello everyone, my first post. I have very limited watch knowledge. (none)

 

I have just acquired my Dad's old Seiko 5 watch, but it doesn't hold much of a charge, probably about 6 or 7 hours.

Is this acceptable? and if not, what would be the minimum I would need to do to get it back up to scratch?

Welcome to the site ftwizard. As you have found lots of enthusiastic & knowledgeable guys here. However if you have not serviced a watch before I would not tinker to much as it is very,very easy to do permeant damage. Take it to a watch repairer and ask for a quote to have it serviced. The fact that it runs shows there will not be a great deal wrong.

[ftwizard]

I couldn't help myself, so I whipped the back off. Nothing obviously wrong, just makes a lot of noise when the rotor spins.

The thing is, a service is going to cost at least twice what it's worth. Not sure what to do next.

[ftwizard]

Is there a bearing or something for the rotor, maybe I could add a little light oil or something?

[JimInOz]

No need to add oil.

 

If the watch hasn't been serviced through it's life, the only oil that would make it quiet is 20/40W.

 

Best option is to get a "qualified" hobbyist to have a look at it.

 

That would save you the cost of a watchmaker's opinion.

 

Where are you located?

 

Cheers

 

Jim

[ftwizard]

I think I've got some 20/40W in the shed, I'll give it a try......;-)

I'm in the UK, south Essex.

[clockboy]

I think I've got some 20/40W in the shed, I'll give it a try......;-)

I'm in the UK, south Essex.

It seems as the rota bearing is suspect. The Seiko can only be wound via the rota turning as there is no manual winding. Follow the vid below to see how to wind.

 

If this does not work it,s a case of having it serviced & getting the rota checked. Without this the watch performance will not improve.

[ricardopalamino]

Aloha ,

You could get an inexpensive 6309 donor watch from India . It's a 1 screw change . Just watch the shipping charges .....Good Luck , Louis

 

 

 

[Blacklab]

Sound like the rotor bearing to me, see previous discussion here:http://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/1136-seiko-6309a-rotor-bearing/

[ftwizard]

Perhaps a little background would help. My Dad died in 1989, so the watch was eight years old at that time. It has not been touched until about a week ago, so 25 years in a cupboard. The watch has never been opened, and looked mint inside. Apart from not holding much of a charge, it keeps excellent time.

There was no sign of rubbing when i took the back off, and the rotor spun OK, but was quite noisy. I have no experience of watches, so I don't know if this was a normal amount of noise or excessive.

Obviously there is huge sentimental value, so there is no chance I will change the movement, but by the same token, I can't afford to spend £200 getting it serviced. I was just hoping there may be something I could do myself.

I think a trip to The Watch Lab at Lakeside may be in order, see what they think and how much it will be to sort it out.

[Ishima]

I can't afford to spend £200 getting it serviced.

Who's quoted you £200? that's excessive by anyone standards for an auto service on a standard Seiko.

The company I work for would charge, at the central workshop, 120, some of our fully fledged watchmakers who work on branches would offer to do it themselves at better prices than that. 

I should think you'd be able to get a £100 estimate without difficulty.

I just googled Seiko service charges and Seiko themselves charge aprox £91 to service their automatics, that is if i was reading the chart correctly.

 

 

 I was just hoping there may be something I could do myself.

 

Sometimes, with some guidance, that is the case. And we'd like to help you, other times you can do far more harm than good, even with basic battery watches there's many a trap for the unwary and people without the experience make mistakes they wouldn't have even considered as possibilities even if they sat and thought about it for an hour. (for example, people sometimes try to change a battery, only they don't secure the movement while they pry the battery out, then the movement lifts off the dial and all the hands fall off and the person has no idea what they've done wrong.)

Maybe it's just the auto winding mechanism,-- the very top part of the movement, responsible for transferring the movement of the weight to wind the mainspring. --that really needs attention, if so, maybe someone might be willing to just have a tinker with it themselves, (the entire auto wind module of the mechanism only consists of about 10 parts). but who knows, it sounds like the mainspring might be broken, they can continue to work once broken, just never fully winding, keeping the watch going for short intervals. A mainspring is not something an amateur can hope to fix, you have to dismantle a substantial amount of the inner workings (in some cases nearly the entire watch) to get the mainspring barrel out, and once you've done that, you need special equipment to wind in a new spring,-- that you can probably only get through a business account with Seiko. -- and that equipment that would cost you far more than even an expensive service estimate. 

 

Edited November 26, 2015 by Ishima

[ricardopalamino]

ftwizard said , "I think a trip to The Watch Lab at Lakeside may be in order, see what they think and how much it will be to sort it out.".... At this time that sounds like the best Idea to sort out what needs to be done and get an estimate . From there you'll have a better Idea on how to proceed . It's been sitting in a cupboard this long so there's no rush to get it going properly . Once repaired , {possibly at little expense} , the workhorse 6309 will run for years .

  Talk to the people at The Watch Lab to see exactly what they will do to make repairs so there will be no surprises , as you stated , "Obviously there is huge sentimental value, so there is no chance I will change the movement "....

 

The SeikoCitizen Watch Forum has many members located in the UK , and in the Essex area I believe . Post on that forum what you are trying to accomplish and you may meet a member local to your area that can help you out and maybe work with you after you have visited The Watch Lab . You have options , just be patient ....And good Luck ....Aloha , Louis

[bandi9111]

Hello,

I read the content & find out some similarity with my actual topic.
I have the same seiko 5, jut in a little worse condition... attached ....   

I bought it from a small market 3 year ago as not realy working one, but it started. I take it to a local watch repair shop and for ~100£ they fixed it(full clean, oil, some part change). After some time the watch lose the seconds hand --> repaired again --> after some time it started to make within 1 day ~30 minutes less than it should by normal operation. (weared full day, so it could wind itself) From the beginning it has a rotor noise, I tought it is normal by such an old watch...

I give back nowdays to the same shop, they fixed and cleaned again for ~100£, but the rotor was quiet, after 1 month the rotor gives the same strage and stong noise. Definetly I can also feel the movement of the rotor too as by the beginning. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1P9Uoj8vxwQSgZkUQ1UmYl13kI2op2NS8/view?usp=drive_link

After 2 times of full service (some part change, cleaning oiling...) I'm not sure, that my watch is in better condition.
This noise can be some loose screw, or the bearing is full worn, just the shop don't care about just tightened it more?
What can be the problem?
The watch winds itself up when worn, but today I experienced an other strange behaviour: the rotor moved from the watch itself a little (like unwind the already stored winding)

I'm not a specialist to know that this is a problem. Is this phenomena fixable or I need to search an other watch for daily usage?

Thank you for the suport in advance  
(I'm from Hungary, so UK local watch shop support is not an option for me)