Jump to content

Hi all


Trebor

Recommended Posts

Hi,

 

Just wanted to introduce myself. I’m Rob and I live in The Bay Area in California.

I am keen to try my hand a repairing a mechanical watch, being an engineer at birth, ;-), I just can’t help myself. I refuse to strip my watch down, but I was given a broken Seiko 5 to play with, it was dropped, shattering the display back getting shards of glass in the movement, stopping it.

So far I have opened the case and removed the movement, just waiting for a few tools before I proceed further with the strip-down, cleaning, oiling and reassembly.

Rob

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well thanks for the warm welcome.

I was looking at ultrasonic cleaners, but $80 new is a small investment I might not be happy to make right now, for 1 watch. But if I continue maybe. I did see 2nd hand units on fleabay for anywhere from $10. I would want to avoid the cheap plastic looking consumer units, I presume.

Photo’s of the movement? I hadn’t expected such a positive reply actually, so thanks! I’ve attached some photo’s, from and rear of the movement, I also included the “ring” of the watch back without the shattered glass, as I noticed it had a number on it too.

 

 

DAFE81AA-535A-4367-935D-A10790C59D0E.jpeg

C0F113BC-4661-4395-951D-F70A86831537.jpeg

9069C10A-3E63-4EB2-9C7A-AAAE31088490.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Trebor said:

I was looking at ultrasonic cleaners, but $80 new is a small investment I might not be happy to make right now, for 1 watch.

You don't need an U/S to perfectly clean watch parts. There are many other tools, proper lubricants, timegrapher that are needed first.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, jdm said:

You don't need an U/S to perfectly clean watch parts. There are many other tools, proper lubricants, timegrapher that are needed first.

Thanks, if all else fails I was considering brake cleaner as a degreaser, a water rinse, followed by isopropanol alcohol as a drying agent before air drying.

Yes, I’ve ordered some “generic oil’, I.e Moebius 8000, and 8030, I didn’t want to invest in a full compliment of synthetics, also not knowing what exactly to buy anyway.

 

I was also planding to buy a Timegrapher, one of them generic Chinese ones, if nothing else I can use it to check my other watch when it come back from it’s service.

 

Rob

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Rob    As jdm says U/sonic at this stage is not really needed as hand cleaning using the brake cleaner, Naptha, Isopropyl,  method will work well enough. The Tgrapher oils and appropriate tools, tweezers, loupes ,screwdrivers are the first items on the list.

What you have there is a seiko 7S26C, a good solid movement.  I Have attached the tech sheet  and the user manual for the watch.

7S26C, 7S36C.pdf 7S26 seiko user manual.pdf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Trebor said:

Thanks, if all else fails I was considering brake cleaner as a degreaser, a water rinse, followed by isopropanol alcohol as a drying agent before air drying.

Personally I think petroleum ether (refned naptha) is better, and is an horological product.

1 hour ago, Trebor said:

Yes, I’ve ordered some “generic oil’, I.e Moebius 8000, and 8030, I didn’t want to invest in a full compliment of synthetics, also not knowing what exactly to buy anyway.

We have ample discussions on the subject. When bought in 5cc quantity there is nor much price difference to synthetic, which is to be preferred. I recommend that you get 9010, 9514, and HP-1300. You will also nee a graphite-loaded for the Seiko lever pawls. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, thanks a lot for the tech sheet, I was looking for something like that online.

I’ll source some naphtha, and look into the oils you recommend, thanks for that too.

I realize this isn’t exactly a high end time piece, but still a nice piece to play with and practice on.

Rob

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for all the advise so far.

I’m just pricing up oils...

Graphite loaded oils, I have some graphite powder for locks, it seems pretty fine, can I mix this with one of the heavier weight oils?

9514, is that a Moebius oil or some other brand/ I’m not able to find it.

I’m referencing this sheet, it’s possible it’s not complete? I also looked on the Moebius site but couldn’t find it. I’ll do a little more googling.

image.thumb.jpeg.d7dc58367da60538eab097fa222ded10.jpegMoebius Technical Data Chart

Rob

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The graphite grease is 9301, alternative to Seiko S-6, which is also available from Cousins UK. 

And the other I had misspelled is 9415. special for pallet stones. One can of course use 9010 for that and only lose a bit of amplitude. 

All that and much more is well covered on

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks JDM, I’ve started reading the oils thread. I’ve stripped down my Seiko 5, my dad thought splintered glass was jamming up the works, I found out the real reason it’s not running. It looks like the drop did more damage than first thought.

The following item is called a balance staff, is it? Is this replaceable on this movement? It looks like a greater challenge for a first timer than I first thought! ;-)

81DF4B8D-256D-4068-9256-4B0D205AAEE5.jpeg

44738670-E8E6-4BDC-AE6C-A37C6DF00833.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Must've been quite the shock to snap the balance staff in half like that. Who knows what else could be damaged. Almost anything is replaceable on a watch with enough effort. But imo the effort in this case is far from worth the cost of just replacing the whole balance complete, or even the entire movement. 

Edited by CaptCalvin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks, that’s kinda the conclusion I was coming too as well with some googling of part no’s...

I might try source a replacement balance wheel and hair spring though, as I’m not doing this for anything other than the fun of the challenge.

Rob

Link to comment
Share on other sites

56 minutes ago, Trebor said:

I might try source a replacement balance wheel and hair spring though,

That is called "balance complete". Check topic below about the availability of cheap Chinese ones Vs. genuine.
However the real issue for a beginner is fitting the end stud to the arm without damage, we have many discussions on the subject.
Being straightforward, that aspect added to all other of service make the learning curve a bit too steep, I understand that you want the challenge but  considered that with less than $30 you can get a nice NH36 wich adds manual winding and hacking seconds, I'd recommend you go that route. You will find that even casing work when done to perfection is an engaging task, and keep the spare mov't for further relaxed exercise.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Lots of rust on that hairspring Nev, would you even try to clean it up ?
    • How do you find the working distance from microscope lens to movement? Is it comfortable enough to get tools in?
    • Once you have the collet closer bits off, and the pulley off, there are two nuts on the spindle. These must be removed. There is a large nut in the back of the headstock with two holes, remove this with an appropriate wrench. The front large nut comes off too. The spindle now comes out- but wait- there's more! There is a spacer between the outer races of the bearings; the spindle will almost certainly come out "assembled" with both bearings and this spacer (it can actually come out front or back-ways with the large nuts off the headstock). You have to manage to press out the spindle from the rear bearing, get the spacer off, then remove the front bearing, now you can get to the key.   Imagining you get it all apart without causing any damage to the bearings, now the fun part starts. You must apply preload to the bearings, and this is a very tricky endeavor. Basically once you have the bearings back on, and are in the casting, you snug up the rear nut (one of the two) on the spindle, checking the play of the spindle with at least a 0.002mm reading indicator, until there is zero axial play, then just a little more, then snug up the second nut to lock things in place. Of course snugging up the second nut influences the preload, so you can go back and forth a few times to get it right. Too much preload and bearing life diminishes, too little, and you get poor performance, poor surface finishes, ball skidding, etc.   When I replaced the bearings in one of mine many years ago, I was surprised to find that the bearings were regular deep-groove bearings, but of a higher precision class than normal. I replaced with dimensionally identical angular contact bearings, class P4. In trying to set the preload, I just about lost my mind, so called Barden (the high precision arm of FAG bearing makers, and who made my new ones) and a nice engineer told me that the folks at Leinen were either crazy, or really good- he also said it's 100% A-OK to set up deep groove bearings with preload like this, but best is angular contact. In this bearing setup, the standard way to do it is to have a spacer between the outer races, and another between the inner races. Leinen has the former but not the latter, haha. His advice was to make an inner spacer. The trick is it has to be the exact same length as the outer spacer, within like a micron.  Then you just tighten everything up and the preload is set, because the bearings (the new ones) are ground in a way that they have proper preload in that situation. Easy. Sort of- if you have the means to make the other spacer!   Just to note- Schaublin does the preloading as Leinen did on these on their lathes using angular contact bearings. There is a procedure in the manual, where you tighten the nut until axial play is zero, then a certain number of degrees more. This works on their setup as the nut itself locks without a second nut, and they spent the time to figure it all out in a repeatable way.   I say all this not to scare you off from dismantling your headstock, just to give a heads-up what you're up against to get it back to where it was before.
    • Do, write a nice letter to Santa. I do all disassembly and assembly under the microscope. I consider it a necessity.
×
×
  • Create New...