Identifying clock

[MechanicMike]

Hector, Weasol and Hippy, many thanks you guys. back on track, continuing on the assembly and on to making it tick. Updates to follow.

(tip of the hat)

[HectorLooi]

1 hour ago, MechanicMike said:

Except now, i'm wondering, "How the heck does he get his stuff so clean and shiny?"

Polish, degrease, ultrasound and wear gloves. 

The secret to getting an anniversary clock to run is using the right suspension wire at the correct length. Then getting it in beat. You'll need to work in a very quiet environment as the ticking sound is really soft. ( or I'm really getting deaf! )

Good luck!

[watchweasol]

Hi Hector  they are very light on the tick/tock  I have a pizo disc attached to a croc clip a couple of foot sheilded cable (headphone cable) that plugs into an amplifier that does the trick. Although setting up an anniversary clock relies on the spring and the pendulum over swing and like most clocks the escapement, they can be frustrating. 

[MechanicMike]

So what you guys are saying is I need to hire a sound and boom guy? 

[watchweasol]

Hi Mike  not unless you are a bit deaf like me, I have lost the top end  so I find the Amplifier useful.  I think the important thing is setting the escapement using the Grid for you to copy in the book, and watching the over swing.

[MechanicMike]

On 1/26/2021 at 10:57 AM, watchweasol said:

Hi Mike  not unless you are a bit deaf like me, I have lost the top end  so I find the Amplifier useful.  I think the important thing is setting the escapement using the Grid for you to copy in the book, and watching the over swing.

I'm ALOT deaf! but I have the grid already made out, and the regulating tool came in. After the last brain freeze I managed to get it all assembled and am closing in on the suspension unit and setting it. I've noticed my minute hand is a little loose with play. is there something i can do to snug that up? add washers to the tension washer or something with the tension washer itself? 

Edited February 1, 2021 by MechanicMike
wrong word! minute, not hour!

[oldhippy]

You say the minute hand is a little loose with play. Do you mean it flops about or say just past the hour it will drop down to the 6. The hands on these clocks are not meant to be really tight like on other clocks, if they are to tight the clock will not work correctly it will even stop. If the hand just drops say a minute then yes a washer can be the answer, are you sure you have all the washers in place after you took it apart and you haven't misplaced or even lost one. 

[watchweasol]

Hi Mikeas Old Hippy said its ok but not too tight, Is it a domed washer being held on by the pin if so a very thin washer will do ok.   You will find that tool indispensible when working on 400 day clocks.

[MechanicMike]

5 hours ago, oldhippy said:

You say the minute hand is a little loose with play. Do you mean it flops about or say just past the hour it will drop down to the 6. The hands on these clocks are not meant to be really tight like on other clocks, if they are to tight the clock will not work correctly it will even stop. If the hand just drops say a minute then yes a washer can be the answer, are you sure you have all the washers in place after you took it apart and you haven't misplaced or even lost one. 

Yes, the minute hand just seems sloppy and does move about. About 2-3 minutes either side of 12. It doesn't drop tho. Understood the hands aren't to be too tight. Got it. I may have discovered the issue: the tension washer had a groove or dent in it where the tapered pin rests. I rotated the washer and it snugged up some. I'll see if that works. 

[MechanicMike]

2 hours ago, watchweasol said:

Hi Mikeas Old Hippy said its ok but not too tight, Is it a domed washer being held on by the pin if so a very thin washer will do ok.   You will find that tool indispensible when working on 400 day clocks.

I put it up on the saddle and I can see right away why this tool is a must, and why not to use needle nose pliers. It's very obvious!

I think the groove in the domed washer was the problem. It wasn't creating enough tension. Moving forward! So close!

[watchweasol]

well done Mike, you will have a worker soon

[MechanicMike]

Back at it soon as I get home today. Hope so.

[Michael1962]

On 1/12/2021 at 10:22 PM, watchweasol said:

Hi Mike  If you can get one of these tools it makes the escapement easier to adjust, nt cheap  the one pictured is from cousins at £27  you can get them cheaper though.

OK. I'll bite. What is it? I don't know. 

[Michael1962]

OK. I found it on Cousins so I know what it is now, but I don't know how it would be used?

Methinks I have much learning to do.

Edited February 6, 2021 by Michael1962

[oldhippy]

This is how you use the tool. Where you have the fitting for the top block that holds the suspension spring, The tool is clamped around the outside of the whole block that holds the suspension. That part is friction tight, because the tool has a long handle you are able to make tiny adjustments to the beat. 

[watchweasol]

I Think Old Hippys explanation says it all once used you wonder how you ever managed without. Not a cheap option though but will save the frustration and temper.  I have about six of these 400 days and the tool was indeed handy to say the least

[MechanicMike]

without question. it is a must-have. 

I began to install the suspension spring and spotted a problem-when trying to attach the pendulum it seems to rest at the bottom of the cup and I'm not even close to attaching the lower block to the pendulum yet, giving the appearance of the spring being too long. it's the correct one according to the book and matches the chart. the tubes or rings they call them, don't appear to be mushroomed and the base appears flat. Went thru chapter 8 Q & A's and didn't read anything else regarding this? do I need to shim up these tubes or (I hate to) shorten the spring?

[oldhippy]

Are you sure the back plate matches to the book don't forget the screws placement they are shown in black it should all be in the same place as your back plate, when you have the top and bottom blocks in place fit it to the movement and hang the pendulum and see if it is clear from the cup, you should be able to lock it for moving. 

[clockboy]

I have had this issue although the correct strength the new spring was a touch too long. You will have to snip some off. 
However measure twice cut once!!!!!

[watchweasol]

Hi Mike   as Old Hippy said check out the backplate for correct identification  ALL the holes in the plate must match the diagram for correct identification, there are some that look very similar and easily confused.        cheers

[MechanicMike]

Hi guys-I had examined the back plate closely, holes, black dots and all, just for that reason and I will check it again when I get home for accuracy. If I were to have to trim the spring, on what end would it be?

Measure twice cut once-you how many times I've measured stuff 20 times only to find out maybe I should have measured it one more time?

[watchweasol]

Hi Mike  What model Kundo is it and I will have a look in my book in case there is a typo.  Which end does not matter just tale enough off so that when the blocks are fitted the pendulum clears the cup allowing you enough lee way to lock the pendulum for moving the clock.  One thought tho is that has this been dismantled before and washers have been left out of the support columns as that would effectivly reduce the height of the clock giving you the exact same problem you have now as the clock head is too low.  Before cutting the spring just for the hell of it raise the height of the head and see where that leads as once the spring is cut you cannot put it back on.  Nothing to loose.

[MechanicMike]

the back plate. I checked the book again. let me know if you see anything different.

[MechanicMike]

7 hours ago, watchweasol said:

Hi Mike  What model Kundo is it and I will have a look in my book in case there is a typo.  Which end does not matter just tale enough off so that when the blocks are fitted the pendulum clears the cup allowing you enough lee way to lock the pendulum for moving the clock.  One thought tho is that has this been dismantled before and washers have been left out of the support columns as that would effectivly reduce the height of the clock giving you the exact same problem you have now as the clock head is too low.  Before cutting the spring just for the hell of it raise the height of the head and see where that leads as once the spring is cut you cannot put it back on.  Nothing to loose.

I have no idea of the history of the clock except it was given to the owner by her grandmother when she was little.  I haven't cut anything yet. I'm measuring for the 22nd time...by my account, it's plate 1389?

[watchweasol]

Hi Mike  had a look at the book, It does indeed look like the right one all the holes correspond. It quotes .0032mm (.081mm) Horolovar      units 1 and 3A          Kundo standard 49 and standard 53 both using the same suspension. In fact all the stardards use the same.

On some of these clocks there are polished washers under the support legs and at the top of the columns for decoration.