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There are no stupid questions, we are all here to learn

Just finished my second balance staff. For a full plate Waltham.Original Balance Staff. Used for reference. I also made a youtube video of cutting the roller table staff part and the final pivot. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Here we have a 1975 Dynabeat that cones from the Electric series Timex produced. I'll start with the basic case tear down and preparation of cleaning. Remove bezel ring, crown\stem, and crystal. Next pull hands and remove dial. Notice that these dials have tabs so care must be take not to over bend them. For this I used a modified 45 degree Xacto blade which I'v added a notch to on the tip. Place the edge of the blade at angle to tab and back the tab with you finger. Lift slowly and move to next tab. Notice that one tab is very close to the balance wheel. This is where I use the notched tip. Continue to remove the components under the dial. Be careful with the date wheel detent spring as it very thin and bends easily. Now comes the step that many will find interesting or get a laugh over. But, I tell you it works more times than not. The idea behind this is to clean oxidation off the contact wire that bushes against the staff. It also helps remove dried oil and other debris out of the movement. I use a very high tech tool next to blow air to help dry the cleaner up. "Okay so its just a cheap balloon pump". Next another tool I made up that is most helpful. After dotting any pivots both top and bottom, I dab some oil to the train gears just next to the battery compartment. Refit the stem, press down on a fresh battery and give the balance a flick. Sometimes it takes a few but this one went off with just one. clean and buff the outer parts, freshen up the hands, put it all back together. There are some steps I left out and will add in future posting. So what was the first thing that failed? If you said the sweep fell off you would be right. Why it fell off is because I forgot to tamp down the hole to be sure it fit tight again. its has since been corrected and the watch is humming nicely. Thanks for looking.

Meanwhile, back at the original question, I think it’s important to establish the objective, and then clarify the options and outcomes. The OP describes an ambition to get back to the original 100m waterproofness, so let’s look at that. JDM’s answer above is about the extent of it. If you can find an accrediter repairer who has a Wenger parts account, they may be able to obtain a new crown with the Wenger logo on it. They will fit the crown using the correct grade of loctite to attach it to the stem, if necessary, they can replace the case tube, they will lubricate the stem and seal with the correct lubricants (both different), refit the stem and a new caseback seal (also lubricated), and then pressure test to confirm all is good. My guess is that this would cost £70 to £100. If the correct crown is not available then a similar style generic one could be fitted and the cost could be a little less. A quick google search suggests that someone like InTime might be able to do this. It is unlikely you will find a repairer who is willing to fiddle around with trying to replace the crown seal. If you want to tackle this yourself then you have the choice of trying to find a replacement o-ring as JDM describes, or a generic crown. Loctite is optional, but adds security against the crown coming off, so I would reccomend. A pin vice is preferable to hold the stem, but smooth jawed pliers would do for a one-off. Silicone grease for the seal is recommended, but you could get away with not greasing the stem. So you should be able to do all this for around £20. You may need to shorten the stem or pack the hole in the crown if it’s a little short... read the sticky thread on fitting a new stem. Let’s assume you don’t want to spend hundreds or more on a pressure tester, so you will be guessing that all is good when you've finished. You pays your money and takes your choice.

Hi all thank you very much for your responses. Clearly I was missing something here, very sorry if this sounded like a stupid question... It all makes sense now. I was trying to insert the whole stem (male + female assembly + crown) with the movement in the case - it works when there is a "bevel" on the stem. I have never "clipped" the female part on the male part with the movement in the case before, I did not realise you could do that, a bit silly of me really. Thank you!

Ok, a lot of good thoughts. The end shake of the balance was ok. That's what baffled me. The cause of the problem is the very end of the cock pivot is broken off. I missed it during examination of the wheels and pivots. Too complacent! With a high power loupe you can see the pivot is broken. the end shake was good because the remaining part of the pivot would fit into the hole jewel far enough to limit the shake. It also was long enough to allow good amplitude and timing when the balance was running on the other pivot (dial down). When I inverted the movement, the pivot would bind because it is too short to reach the cap jewel. This problem is somewhat rare, but I thought I would pass it along as a lesson for others. We never stop learning in this business.

That's a tough one, I have every confidence with my battery replacement reseals in cousins gaskets, and the servicing i do on mechanical watches at this stage of my career tends to be on old watches that are splash proof at best anyway, so I don't think about that much. If you're working on modern expensive modern autos that are 50m and up, and you're promising them resealed then it might just be worth the extra expense, (If its quartz it will need to be resealed with the next battery change in a couple of years anyway, so dont worry) I dont think anything would come back to you in any time frame that you could take responsibility for, but given that some of these watches go a decade without anyone looking at them, the customer might find 8 years after the service they jump into a pool and it floods, now obviously thats not really your fault or responsibility, even if it could have been theoretically prevented with an expensive gasket that would degrade more slowly, you cant promise people that their watch will be waterproof for a decade without maintenance. so it shouldn't cause you any problems, but perhaps more of an ethical consideration for the owners of the watches and what they might face way off down the line and whether that hypothetical situation would cause you to lose any sleep. To answer more directly, as chopin says they're a bit better, but not 8 times better.

it's certainly true to say that there are a lot of watchmakers out there who consider Timex's own published service procedures to be inadequate, and the design philosophy and build quality of their watches to be contemptibly inferior. This is something that I have never understood; it's almost as though there is amongst watchmakers a culture of bias against the brand, dare I say it, an element of snobbery. It's also quite correct that Timex's service procedures would be wholly inappropriate for a fully jewelled movement, in much the same way that the service requirements for a Ferrari differ from those of Ford, but if your garage tried to tell you that they need to service your Ford in accordance with the Ferrari service procedures (and that they should charge you accordingly), because the published Ford procedures are inadequate you would quite rightly question their rationale and take your custom else where. I can only speak from my own experience and that includes quite a lot of Timex watches. There are definitely some aspects of Timex design that I dislike, just as there are design aspects of many other Swiss, American, Russian, and English watches that irritate me, however, I don't think that their durability can be questioned. What is more, from experience I can happily say that the vast majority of apparently dead, 50 years old and never been serviced and look like they've spent most of their life in a war zone Timex's that I have then given the Timex spa treatment, have straight away sprung back into life and gone on to perform as designed. If that isn't evidence of an effective service procedure then I'm not sure what is. And as I said before, I have never encountered a broken Timex balance staff. Obviously other people have different experiences and accordingly (and quite rightly) will have arrived at their own opinions. What I find so difficult to accept, let alone understand, is the (so often repeated) assertion Timex watches were never intended to be repaired or serviced. The fact that Timex went to the trouble and expense of publishing service manuals and tech sheets, and providing a supply of spare parts is proof positive that they were meant to be serviced. And my own experience with them has demonstrated to me that the published service procedures are not only perfectly effective, but also incredibly simple to carry out.

OH is quite correct in that you need to remove the dial in order to access the click and safely let down the main spring. CB has also provided the service manual which if followed will result in an effectively serviced Timex. Contrary to popular opinion Timex watches were manufactured with servicing in mind and Timex had in place the supply of all spare parts for exactly this purpose. The servicing procedures that Timex outline in the servicing manual were specifically developed to facilitate a simpler and cheaper approach to servicing a movement which was itself designed with this approach to servicing in mind. I get the feeling that a lot of he more traditional watchmakers got frustrated with Timex movements because rather than adopting the Timex procedures they tried to fully disassemble the watch to clean it and subsequently struggled to reassemble it, resulting in a hatred and disrespect for the brand. Looked after the way that Timex intended, they are perfectly capable time keepers (not Rolex precision granted, but perfectly adequate) and significantly more robust than the fully jewelled, 10x the price, Swiss alternatives. I've never come across a "V-Conic" balance with a broken pivot for instance.