Small pocket watch repair

[Trues]

I have a small silver pocket watch with a cylinder escapement which has two broken pivots. Can it be repaired. Are parts still available. It has sentimental value as it is a family piece

thanks jt.

[Cad101]

Kknowing what the watch make is would be a good place for the helpful people on here to start with and maybe a few pictures of the movement.

[clockboy]

Pivots can be made using a watchmakers lathe or finding a donor movement. 

[Trues]

57 minutes ago, clockboy said:

Pivots can be made using a watchmakers lathe or finding a donor movement. 

It's a cylinder escapement, I have not been able to source a new one

[bobm12]

Welcome to the forum, Trues!

[Tmuir]

Post some photos which will help those that know how to give you an identification on whether the repair is worth it.

If the pivot is broken its possible that the jewel it rests in is also damaged and will need replacing

The pivots on a cylinder knock out of the cylinder so they can be replaced and are known as Tampons.

I've actually got a box of 'NOS' cylinder tampons in the post to me at the moment which as part of a job lot of parts I just purchased, I don't yet know if they are sized for watches or platform escapements from clocks yet, not that I'm up to the skill level to do such a job yet, but I'm guessing there will be a number on this forum that can do it.

[oldhippy]

Cylinders themselves are extremely brittle and are very hard to repair. Parts will not be available. First of all you will need to knock out both ends with punches that are for cylinders, a very good staking set should have them, but be careful as the cylinder might split. If you don't have the correct tools and skill you won't be able to undertake this repair. You could look around and find someone who could under take such a repair. It will be very expensive and you might not think the watch is worth the price.   

[szbalogh]

4 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Cylinders themselves are extremely brittle and are very hard to repair. Parts will not be available. First of all you will need to knock out both ends with punches that are for cylinders, a very good staking set should have them, but be careful as the cylinder might split. If you don't have the correct tools and skill you won't be able to undertake this repair. You could look around and find someone who could under take such a repair. It will be very expensive and you might not think the watch is worth the price.   

I did not have a cylinder watch yet. Is it possible to remove the balance wheel, broken tampon/tampons and finally anneal the staff to make it less brittle? Then insert new annealed tampons and harden the assembled three parts together? Or this is not the right way for such a repair? How is the balance wheel fitted on such a staff?

[Tmuir]

I'm not qualified to say how to repair it, but it is my understanding that the tampons are steel and the cylinder is brass, so you couldn't do why you describe

[oldhippy]

A cylinder consists of three pieces two ends and one center, the two ends are taped into the center making one whole piece and this is then taped into the balance wheel. You have to make sure that when the hairspring has been fitted it is the correct distance so nothing is fouling. Balance staffs tend to have two ways of being fitted and they are a single piece, riveted in place or tapped in.  

 

I did not have a cylinder watch yet. Is it possible to remove the balance wheel, broken tampon/tampons and finally anneal the staff to make it less brittle? Then insert new annealed tampons and harden the assembled three parts together?

Yes with a cylinder but why  would you want to do such a thing and don't forget you will need to re harden the cylinder, if not it will be open to wear out quick.

[vinn3]

welcome to the forum.  cylindar escapements  are  very,  very,  bad when  worn out.  i dont know  anyone who has restored one.  i have a couple in silver cases [non working,  but nice looking].  they also have (button set ?)  for the hands.   it would nice to know the history of that mvt..  vinn

[Tmuir]

I've just scanned 6 pages out of 'Watch and Clock Making and Repairing' by W J Gazeley 1953 edition and attached them as a PDF.

It goes into how to repair a cylinder escapement, well beyond my skill level, but interesting reading.

 

Cylinder_Escapement_1.pdf

[bobm12]

Hi guys, I moved this thread to a more appropriate place! Cheers

[oldhippy]

1 hour ago, Tmuir said:

I'm not qualified to say how to repair it, but it is my understanding that the tampons are steel and the cylinder is brass, so you couldn't do why you describe

No the cylinder is very brittle steel. If they were made of brass they would wear in no time.

[vinn3]

i don't think its  worth while,  BUT - if you can get it to run and not lose more 5 minutes a day ;  its  "hats off".  vinn

[oldhippy]

Lose or gain 5 minutes is an excepted time keeping with a cylinder escapement. 

[vinn3]

5 min.  + or -  is good for any old  watch,  keeping them running is a challenge    vinn

[antonyh]

I have done a few over the years, I would've do one for anyone else as for me it was always hit and miss.

It's having the time and money to spend the time on a on that simple doesn't pay.

There are a few people out there doing them, as I recall there in the back of the watch magazines, you should be able to find them on the internet, £100 + I should think .