Dubois Depraz Chronograph Module Parts Interchangeability

[DrKnuckles]

Hi all, 1st post here, happy to be on board!

I am currently assessing a newly acquired watch with a Dubois Depraz 4500 chronograph module and it looks like I will need at the very least a replacement hour recorder. I understand new DD parts are unobtanium so I am looking in the used market. I am curious if anybody knows what interchangeability (if any) there is between DP modules? According to WatchWiki the existing DD chrono modules for the ETA 2892 are:

DD 2020 - Chronograph

DD 2021 - Chronograph

DD 2027 - Chronograph with yacht timer (used by Audemars Piguet, Bulgari, Omega)

DD 2030 - Chronograph with small seconds at 3 00 and 30 minute counter at 9 00

DD 2071 - Chronograph with sweep minute counter, hours at 6 00, and seconds at 3 00 (used in Mido Multifort Center Chronograph)

DD 4500 - Chronograph with big date

DD 4900 - Chronograph, big date, four-year calendar, month window at 4 30

[DrKnuckles]

So having eyeballed various dp modules online it certainly looks like some parts and the general configuration of the modules is the same which would make sense. Variations appear to be contingent on the model (i.e., big date, placement of chronograph registers, etc.) Still curious however whether or not someone can confirm parts interchangeability. Might make sense that there is interchangeability within the 2000 series, but what about between 20xx and 40xx modules?

[Nucejoe]

Didn't know DD  modules come with that many sorts of complications.

That would be @nickelsilver dept, he might have even made some parts for DD prototypes. 

Rgds

[nickelsilver]

21 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Didn't know DD  modules come with that many sorts of complications.

That would be @nickelsilver dept, he might have even made some parts for DD prototypes. 

Rgds

I avoid these at all cost! They really aren't pleasant to work on, and the absolute unavailability of parts or tech info just makes it a gut wrenching nightmare. You can have friends in the biz with parts accounts all over the map, there are no parts available from DD. A friend of mine even lives about a block from their main building, and is their local fireman, and a trained watchmaker, and I'm 1000% sure he could show up with brownies and croissants for the whole workshop and no parts.

[RichardHarris123]

18 minutes ago, nickelsilver said:

avoid these at all cost! They really aren't pleasant to work on, and the absolute unavailability of parts

Why are they difficult to work on? Why are parts unavailable, same reason as the Swatch group, Rolex  et al? 

[nickelsilver]

17 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Why are they difficult to work on? Why are parts unavailable, same reason as the Swatch group, Rolex  et al? 

Unlike Swatch, who will sell you something if you pass their requirements, or Rolex (who used to be the same, but-) if a pro there's always a friend or friend of a friend who can get it, or at least Ebay, DD has simply never sold parts. If you have the right security clearance with the brand using their module, you might get the entire module, but that's that. I've never had to resort to it so no idea even what the whole module costs, but c'mon, they really are the worst of the whole bunch.

 

A. Lange & Sohne, 50K watch, yeah I get they don't want to sell a winding stem to Joe Schmo. But DD is commodity level mass produced stuff. Which I think is actually the issue- they would have to employ probably several people full time to deal with the logistics of taking orders and filling them for parts. Hmm. Imagine if someone at DD realized they could charge 15 bucks for a spring that they cost out at 0.30CHF in a module... Nah, while the Swiss do like money, they like being stubborn more.

 

They are difficult to work on because of how they are constructed. Which is to the lowest possible price point. Lots of spindly long springs that have to be situated just so, no real logic to it if unfamiliar, and of course the stress of knowing if you can't get it back together you're hosed.

 

I have worked on lots and lots of chronographs, and still see stuff that is new to me, and I would bet that even if presented with a complete unknown chrono completely disassembled, I would get it together in a reasonable amount of time. All bets are off with DD. I know some folks are actually familiar with them so probably not a big deal, but DD makes Seiko and Citizen chronos look like world class Swiss stuff from 1940 in comparison. (And I don't really like those either, haha.)

Edited April 1 by nickelsilver

[nevenbekriev]

DD modules...

I have 'adopted' some watchmakers who i have to save from time to time. For example, now I have an AP movement on my bench that needs to make new winding pinion and one of winding gears for it, this is for a young watchmaker that I am trying to teach and will not want to dissappoint him...

I have newer worked on a DD module, but I have repivoted two times for different watchmakers the small pivot on the back side of center seconds (4th) wheel of 2892 that has break while pressing the gear on top of the wheel. I know from them that the modules are real pain and they need a special holder that holds all the buttons pressed, othervice almost not possible to assemble them.

[Delgetti]

I have a different view to the DD module world. I began watchmaking for one main reason: To understand and enjoy complicated mechanisms. So when I already had some years of experience with several ETAs, PUWs, Rolex I entered the chronograph business step by step. Landeron 248, Valjoux 7734, Valjoux 72, Buren 12. And while working on the last one I came across a picture of the DD2020 without cover plate and had only one thought: Wow! Freaky! How the hell does this thing work? So I bought a Omega Speedmaster Reduced just for the sake of disassembling, reassembling and understand that thing. I wrote a little article on the r-l-x-forum about this (not a service-walkthrough as this is not a watchmaker-forum, but just a description how it works):

https://www.r-l-x.de/forum/showthread.php/197912-Konstrukteure-auf-Speed-–-das-Omega-1140-mit-Dubois-Depraz-Chrono-Modul

There is a lot of information on the internet which guided me, especially Marks videos about his Breitling for Bentley service and the Omega 1140 tech sheet availiable on watchguy UK:

https://watchguy.co.uk/cgi-bin/files?showfile=Omega/Omega 1140.pdf&filename=Omega 1140.pdf&dir=Technical Manuals&action=documents

I am not familiar with the DD4500 but after a look at this article

https://www.thenakedwatchmaker.com/decon-dubois-depraz-chrono-big-date

I am quite sure that in the area of the chronograph there are a lot of levers and wheels which are identical to the DD2020. Of course this doesn't change anything on the situation that parts are not availiable (when I worked on the DD2020 I was lucky that no module parts where worn).

I like the DDs as they are freaky mechanical stuff, interesting challenge for advanced amateurs with lots of time. If I was a pro and had to do a service in a short time at reasonable costs maybe I would get to a less positive judgement.

[Jon]

I turned away a job last week for a ETA 2892-A2 chronograph because it has a bolt on chrono module. As others have already said, parts aren't available for the module, so if it is disassembled and a part is needed, a lot of time has gone into something that is now unserviceable and then you have to then explain to the customer why you can't do the work and why you have wasted their time.

If the module needs no parts, that's great, but it isn't worth taking the risk in my experience

[SwissSeiko]

I do believe in one of the manuals I saw for the 2892 DD module, you could unscrew it from the 2892, and submerge the whole thing in your cleaning machine as a single unit. I havent tried that yet, but when I was having issues with my Omega 1140, I got lucky and found a brand new one in Poland, and ordered that. So, if someone needs parts from an 1140 Omega/2892, I have the chronograph module in my parts bin, although its disassembled.