Wrong oiler ordered

[Zedster]

Hi, guys

Silly me ordered the wrong oiler from Ali. I wanted one to oil cap jewels and ordered the 7719 whereas I should have ordered the 7718. The Ali store is telling me if I return the oiler from the UK they won't receive it, that doesn't make sense, and if I keep the 7719 and order the 7718 they will give me a $5 discount. The question is, would there be any benefit in me keeping the 7719, and for what tasks would the 7719 be good for?

[watchweasol]

Hi from what Ali express are saying  either it won’t get back to them or they don’t want it back so if you try to return it and it gets lost!!!   You end up paying for it any way so best keep it and take the $5 discount of the next one. Not an ideal situation but you still have the oiler.

[Zedster]

Thanks for that. To be honest, I was thinking the same thing and just keep it. For the money I paid for it I may as well just buy another, use the 7718 for the cap jewels and the 7719 for the wheel train although I find oiling them a lot more easier than those pesky cap jewels 

Also, although I've never seen a genuine Bergeon oiler I wouldn't be surprised if they're all the same from the same factory as the packaging, labeling and instruction manual all look to professional to be a cheap clone.  

[watchweasol]

Hi Zedster makes sound sense as the option to return is a no no .

[CYCLOPS]

you will find a use for all oilers, take the discount if going to use ALI...

[Zedster]

Yep I took the discount and ordered the A1 for Jewels. It took a bit for getting used too but got there in the end. As a beginner, handling those jewels is a bit nerve racking and I'd previously had a few pings but manged to find them. I was using a cheap set of tweezers from amazon and even had problems getting the jewels out of the cleaning jar but then invested in a Dumont #3 and these appear to be a lot better, I can even turn over the jewel by rolling the tweezers but I didn't want to push my luck with that technique too often   

[Zedster]

I tried the A2 oiler today with Moebius HP1300 and can't get anything to come out. Either it's a crap oiler or HP1300 is too thick for it, has anybody had success with an A2 oiler and HP1300? I've tried adjusting the concentric screw with no effect. 

[Mercurial]

I’m unable to find the A2 oiler you’re referring to on Aliexpress or elsewhere, but given you’re mention of eccentric screws etc it sounds like you’re referring to an automatic oiler. 

If you’re a beginner, I’d encourage you to stay away from automatic oilers for now, and perhaps permanently.

They have their place in production environments and service shops where you’re repeatedly handling lots of watches with the same movement. 

Outside that environment, and particularly whilst you’re learning, you’re much better off using simple dip oilers.

You will get a feel for picking up greater or lesser amounts of oil depending how you dip them, and have much better control over how much oil you place in each jewel.

Learning to apply the right amount of oil to each location is very important.

The amount of oil a given jewel and pivot requires will vary with the size of the pivot. Fine escape wheel pivots require far less oil than a third wheel, which in turn requires less than the second/centre wheel. 

Too much oil is possibly worse than too little, it will leave the pivot/jewel interface and get drawn away from the setting.

You might see decent performance right after you service a watch, but performance will deteriorate quickly as the oil migrates and the effective service interval will be significantly shortened.

Getting a feel for gathering the right amount of oil on an oiler and using the right amount on each pivot is an oft neglected and important step in learning to service watches well. It is one of the factors that separates professional quality service from some hobbyists.

You won’t learn this with automatic oilers and you will be using too much on some pivots and too little elsewhere, if for example you use one oiler filled with 9010 for all pivots requiring that oil. You can’t correctly adjust the volume of oil dispensed at each pivot as you move through the watch, they’re designed to be adjusted to correctly oil one particular location in one calibre of watch when used in production or brand service centre environments.

You would be better off buying simple dip oilers and spending the money you save elsewhere.

Hope that helps,

Mark

 

 

[mikepilk]

Very wise words from @Mercurial, I agree entirely

Maybe the above advice could be pinned in the forum

"Lubrication Techniques, Oils, Greases, Epilame Treatments" ?

[Jon]

3 hours ago, Mercurial said:

I’m unable to find the A2 oiler you’re referring to on Aliexpress or elsewhere, but given you’re mention of eccentric screws etc it sounds like you’re referring to an automatic oiler. 

If you’re a beginner, I’d encourage you to stay away from automatic oilers for now, and perhaps permanently.

They have their place in production environments and service shops where you’re repeatedly handling lots of watches with the same movement. 

Outside that environment, and particularly whilst you’re learning, you’re much better off using simple dip oilers.

You will get a feel for picking up greater or lesser amounts of oil depending how you dip them, and have much better control over how much oil you place in each jewel.

Learning to apply the right amount of oil to each location is very important.

The amount of oil a given jewel and pivot requires will vary with the size of the pivot. Fine escape wheel pivots require far less oil than a third wheel, which in turn requires less than the second/centre wheel. 

Too much oil is possibly worse than too little, it will leave the pivot/jewel interface and get drawn away from the setting.

You might see decent performance right after you service a watch, but performance will deteriorate quickly as the oil migrates and the effective service interval will be significantly shortened.

Getting a feel for gathering the right amount of oil on an oiler and using the right amount on each pivot is an oft neglected and important step in learning to service watches well. It is one of the factors that separates professional quality service from some hobbyists.

You won’t learn this with automatic oilers and you will be using too much on some pivots and too little elsewhere, if for example you use one oiler filled with 9010 for all pivots requiring that oil. You can’t correctly adjust the volume of oil dispensed at each pivot as you move through the watch, they’re designed to be adjusted to correctly oil one particular location in one calibre of watch when used in production or brand service centre environments.

You would be better off buying simple dip oilers and spending the money you save elsewhere.

Hope that helps,

Mark

 

 

Spot on!

I stay away from auto oilers and learn the hard way, then if so inclined use them once your oiling technique is perfect.

[Mercurial]

On 4/13/2024 at 9:51 PM, mikepilk said:

Very wise words from @Mercurial, I agree entirely

Maybe the above advice could be pinned in the forum

"Lubrication Techniques, Oils, Greases, Epilame Treatments" ?

Whether my post is pinned there or not, I agree the “Lubrication Techniques, Oils, Greases, Epilame Treatments” forum should have a pinned post explaining why automatic oilers aren’t good for beginners, and better suited to production and service environments where many of the same calibre are lubricated regularly. 

There are so many other tools a beginner should buy before automatic oilers, and it’s so important to learn to oil properly by hand.

So many beginners and hobbyists have no idea how to apply the right amount of oil to each pivot, and just put some oil (usually too much) in every designated location and call it good. Not through carelessness, but through not knowing any better.  

Mark