Handy little extinct vise from our friends across the pond in the Uk

[AshF]

20 hours ago, Plato said:

but the jaws aren't perfectly lined up

I think you got a dud.  Mine is pretty good.

[Plato]

Yeah, yours seem to have been milled flat. 

[MechanicMike]

17 hours ago, jdm said:

I have checked my same from Cousins, one jaw is slightly higher on a side but in my case that is less than 0.10mm.

 

Mine came in humble cardboard, I also believe it's made in India.

 

From testing with a file they're not hardened, which makes sense considering that are meant for light use and one may want to cut grooves to hold round parts or others.

 

Unless there is a current patent (and I don't think there is, or it has expired), one can copy it down to the smallest detail. For example the jaw anti-lift feature of the american Kurt vices is called ANGLOCK®, which is a fully registered name, not a patent. Their vises are universally copied, sometime the Chinese call them "Accu lock".

I was guessing about the copyright stuff only because I read somewhere that the locking plates between the two are not interchangeable. 

I wonder if the Bergeron vise jaws are hardened?

[MechanicMike]

9 hours ago, Plato said:

Yeah, yours seem to have been milled flat. 

JDM said the jaws are soft and his are slightly off too. Time for some draw filing! 

[MechanicMike]

Well it arrived today. The pics don't do it justice it's a terrific little piece and extremely well made. I thought I might have to get after it with my dremel and emory cloth but really didn't have to. Made from tool steel and hardened to a nice gunmetal patina. I took some 3000 lightly to the jaws, added a drop of oil on the threads and that's about it. Snug the clamps down and it is SOLID. Jaws are 1/2 x 1" limited in capacity so I'm happy to report that YES, I'll be getting the 2nd vise added to the collection eventually! 

I really like this one!

[oldhippy]

There are so many good well made small bench vices I don't know why you have to go with the bergeon one which I think is a waste of money or it's look alike which is poorly made. 

That G clamp on your hand is tiny. Hope it comes in handy for you. 

[jdm]

On 7/4/2021 at 7:54 PM, Plato said:

The vice is Horotec, I had to gamble a little in assuming it was the same vice sold by Bergeon. 
Must be a 3rd party that makes the same vice for both companies. 

I got curious about this vise as it's actually a machining "precision type", the slots on sides are for clamping to the table of a mill or machining centre. I don't know who actually makes (or copy) them but are also sold by companies like Hitec, Farnell, etc, with 15mm, 25, or 35mm wide jaws and the other dimensions proportionally sized.

1714004.pdf

One visible difference is the  knob. I think that the prices I've seen of €155 for the smaller is too much for the watchmaking hobbyist, but in line with the the cost of industrial products made in Europe or the USA.

 

1 hour ago, oldhippy said:

There are so many good well made small bench vices I don't know why you have to go with the bergeon one which I think is a waste of money

Which ones? Are you talking about Ebay or other used ones?

 

Quote

it's look alike which is poorly made. 

As mentioned above, It is not poorly, and good value for the money.

[oldhippy]

7 minutes ago, jdm said:

Which ones? Are you talking about Ebay or other used ones?

I'm talking New. 

[Plato]

4 hours ago, MechanicMike said:

JDM said the jaws are soft and his are slightly off too. Time for some draw filing! 

Yup, that's what I'll do. I need to practice that type of work. 

[jdm]

On 7/9/2021 at 10:52 AM, oldhippy said:

I'm talking New. 

Please share. Vices (with a c not an s) are popular!

On 7/9/2021 at 10:53 AM, Plato said:

Yup, that's what I'll do. I need to practice that type of work. 

Any old hand will tell you the same : "the first thing I was forced to taught was filing flat and square, for 3 years". That happened to me 1st year of technical school, age 14. I kind of hated it as it's messy, difficult, and unforgiving work. My friend instead was very good at it (he was from a family of craftsmen), and helped with my work too. He was one of the few decent chaps in the class, the others being bullying gangsters. Anyway, for a decent result you will need to use at least a straight edge and machinist blue. Get it machined unless you like the experience.

[MechanicMike]

2 hours ago, oldhippy said:

There are so many good well made small bench vices I don't know why you have to go with the bergeon one which I think is a waste of money or it's look alike which is poorly made. 

That G clamp on your hand is tiny. Hope it comes in handy for you. 

Me? I'm not buying a Bergeon. Too expensive. The one Plato, JDM and I believe Ash have are more my speed and even then I'll be looking for used if I can find one.

Yes its tiny for sure even for watch repair standards but it was just too cool to pass up and I can use it for other stuff hence the reason I'll still be looking for a regular small bench vise or vice. Must be a euro/american spell thing I guess. I must have a vise vice! Lol 

[jdm]

6 hours ago, MechanicMike said:

I'll still be looking for a regular small bench vise or vice. Must be a euro/american spell thing I guess.

Buy American or at least shipped from there, you guys have so many choices. In Europe, I have these two on my list

https://www.fine-tools.com/schraubstock.html
Cheap for the quality, but no vertical rotation. The entire website is a danger for the wallet.

https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B00AJNRHH2
Same style but with vertical rotation and pipe holder, bargain for the price. 

 

[Plato]

53 minutes ago, jdm said:

Get it machined unless you like the experience.

I need the experience and I think I can get it machined if I f**k it up, and, I'll practice with some annealed tool steel first. 

[oldhippy]

Is this a copy from you know where. I can't find where it's made apart from it says UK stocked. 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164711248162?hash=item26598e3122:g:WW0AAOSw55NgLvLE

[Plato]

2 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Is this a copy from you know where. I can't find where it's made apart from it says UK stocked. 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164711248162?hash=item26598e3122:g:WW0AAOSw55NgLvLE

I think there are a few different 'replicas'. The one in the link seems slightly different to mine, in the position of where the jaws are screwed in at least.

Edited July 9, 2021 by Plato
Misspelling

[Plato]

On 7/8/2021 at 2:23 PM, AshF said:

I think you got a dud.  Mine is pretty good.

There is a bit of adjustment if you loosen the jaws... I've got them pretty close now:

[MechanicMike]

16 hours ago, Plato said:

There is a bit of adjustment if you loosen the jaws... I've got them pretty close now:

Now, draw file to make em flat and parrell! Grab a stick of welders chalk and "dress your file" it'll help with finish and keep your file sharp and make it easier to clean out the swarf and crud when you do. Then dress it again before putting it back in your tool box. Keeps rust at bay. 

[Plato]

I'm not sure I need that level of accuracy, I can use the Eclipse for very detail work.

Here's the vice (vise!) on the workbench plus the jaws of the Eclipse:

[MechanicMike]

11 hours ago, Plato said:

I'm not sure I need that level of accuracy, I can use the Eclipse for very detail work.

Here's the vice (vise!) on the workbench plus the jaws of the Eclipse:

Nah, you don't buddy. That's just me lol draw filing can be alot of work and a pain. I don't do it very often at all. It was taught a long time ago and is rarely required anymore. Yours look great. If mine are that close when I do get mine I'll be letting it go as is for sure. I think there are soft jaws available out there for vices vises too. Get yours mounted yet? Did you see the fold away block that Cousins had available for these? I think Horotec makes them. 

What I want to know is why does everyone's work bench look so nice and clean/organized and mine always seems to look like like a disaster area? I clean organize put stuff away and within say 30 minutes of a new project, it looks like a cat got loose up there.

[MechanicMike]

On 7/9/2021 at 5:44 AM, jdm said:

Cheap for the quality, but no vertical rotation. The entire website is a danger for the wallet

Took a look-danger to the wallet indeed. 

[Klassiker]

8 hours ago, MechanicMike said:

Took a look-danger to the wallet indeed. 

Did you see the section "Workbenches made by our Customers"? Wow!

[Plato]

13 hours ago, MechanicMike said:

What I want to know is why does everyone's work bench look so nice and clean/organized and mine always seems to look like like a disaster area? I clean organize put stuff away and within say 30 minutes of a new project, it looks like a cat got loose up there

I tidied up for the photos! 

[oldhippy]

14 hours ago, MechanicMike said:

What I want to know is why does everyone's work bench look so nice and clean/organized and mine always seems to look like like a disaster area? I clean organize put stuff away and within say 30 minutes of a new project, it looks like a cat got loose up there.

My bench was always in a mess. I was proud of my filthy bench, bits and parts all over the place. My boss always would say how can you work in such a mess.

[MechanicMike]

On 7/11/2021 at 2:16 AM, Klassiker said:

Did you see the section "Workbenches made by our Customers"? Wow!

I DID! I can't look at it again...that is some amazing creations!

[MechanicMike]

On 7/11/2021 at 6:19 AM, Plato said:

I tidied up for the photos! 

apparently, I've become lazy and forgotten what tidy up means

hey did I hear you correctly before that you had traded for stuff on the 'Bay? can you do that?