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Any hope to restore 6139B central chrono wheel??

jguitron

By jguitron
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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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Hello everyone and happy new year!

I'm working on a beautiful 6139B that I bought not working. The first thing I noticed was there was a missing intermediate minute recording wheel which I just got. The second thing was the central chronograph wheel complex.

I've done some looking around and unfortunately I have come out empty-handed in terms of any ability to repair the wheel. The tech-guides have limited recommendations other than replacing it when damaged.

Here are a couple pictures from it where you can see that the disc between the Chrono and the wheel is way out of flat.

2a7c210aec5e680ffe20832f766ff508.jpg

3ebab140f148b9bf77e81048d49b9ee2.jpg

d3bab51892ddfdf4f908174851b7d37c.jpg

Once assembled the watch will run pretty well with the chronograph activated. When The chronograph is stopped the train comes to an abrupt stop with it. I figure the damage wheel is not contacting the mechanism when activated.

Anyway, I was hoping to hear the experience of anybody trying to repair this part.

Cheers to 2017!

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rogart63 Distinguished Member

rogart63

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Good luck :unsure:. Never ever heard or seen that done? Maybe just maybe you could try put it in a staking tool and put some pressure on the top and very gentle try to bend it back. This wheels aren't repairable? Look for a used one on Ebay? Have seen but not sure if any is available at the movement? But no harm trying to straighten it anyway? chronowheel.jpg

 

Edited by rogart63
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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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Good luck :unsure:. Never ever heard or seen that done? Maybe just maybe you could try put it in a staking tool and put some pressure on the top and very gentle try to bend it back. This wheels aren't repairable? Look for a used one on Ebay? Have seen but not sure if any is available at the movement? But no harm trying to straighten it anyway? chronowheel.jpg

 




I have a rusted movement coming but I'm not too excited about it housing a working center wheel but it would be great!

I wonder if it can be put apart of should I give it a go at the risk of damaging another element....

There's a pristine replacement on eBay but for $88 [emoji15]


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rogart63 Distinguished Member

rogart63

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1 hour ago, jguitron said:

 

 


I have a rusted movement coming but I'm not too excited about it housing a working center wheel but it would be great!

I wonder if it can be put apart of should I give it a go at the risk of damaging another element....

There's a pristine replacement on eBay but for $88 emoji15.png


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There are springs inside the wheel that are in tension? If you try to take it apart they will release and you can't put them together again. 

I was thinking of how it could be bent? But probably one of the levers has been on the wrong side of the clutch ring? Bending it upwards.  

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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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I agree with you completely. Either the lever got loose over time and the pusher was forced or when they tried to service it the lever was left on the wrong side and when activated it just bent the wheel.

It's a shame because otherwise he movement is pristine!


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rogart63 Distinguished Member

rogart63

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8 minutes ago, ro63rto said:

Also Adrian over at VintageTimeAustralia. Postage costs are reasonable even to me in UK.

At least he could give you some advise? He is a very helpful guy.  Check Wristsushi out? A forum for Seiko nerds :) 

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Pip WRT Addict

Pip

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"We" are NOT nerds.
We prefer to go by WIS [emoji4]

Quite right! And if we are allowed to mention other specialist forums then as well as Wrist Sushi I'd also have a look at the Seiko and Citizen Watch Forum at thewatchsite.com which is also full of us nerds, oops I mean WIS (although I'm a long way from being able to call myself that!)



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ricardopalamino Distinguished Member

ricardopalamino

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The Seiko 6139B part # for the complete center chronograph wheel is P/N 888612 .

The 6139B comes in a 17 and 21 jewel version . The chronograph finger that sits on top of the wheel is P/N 786610 and can be replaced as these are delicate and have a tendency to break . There is also a part called "Rest of chronograph finger " and that is P/N 787610 . 

I looked up the the the part # for the complete center chronograph wheel for the 6139A , and that is listed as P/N 888610 , although the the "finger' and "rest" are the same P/N for both the A and B versions .

While I was at it I looked up the center chronograph wheel for the 6138 A and B  . That uses P/N 888611 . 

 

I checked my watch parts interchangeability list and the parts aren't listed as interchangeable .

 

I found these complete units on the bay....new and used...

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.05.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.06.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.07.18 PM.png

 

I didn't see Seiko listed on the Old Swiss Watches website , but I would email Sudarson and ask him if he has them .

I would also email Ramon at TheWatchCollector website because I know he has parts .

Good Luck ,...Louis

 

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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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The Seiko 6139B part # for the complete center chronograph wheel is P/N 888612 .

The 6139B comes in a 17 and 21 jewel version . The chronograph finger that sits on top of the wheel is P/N 786610 and can be replaced as these are delicate and have a tendency to break . There is also a part called "Rest of chronograph finger " and that is P/N 787610 . 

I looked up the the the part # for the complete center chronograph wheel for the 6139A , and that is listed as P/N 888610 , although the the "finger' and "rest" are the same P/N for both the A and B versions .

While I was at it I looked up the center chronograph wheel for the 6138 A and B  . That uses P/N 888611 . 

 

I checked my watch parts interchangeability list and the parts aren't listed as interchangeable .

 

I found these complete units on the bay....new and used...

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.05.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.06.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.07.18 PM.png

 

I didn't see Seiko listed on the Old Swiss Watches website , but I would email Sudarson and ask him if he has them .

I would also email Ramon at TheWatchCollector website because I know he has parts .

Good Luck ,...Louis

 




Fantastic! I had come across the 2 used ones but not the last one. It appears to be type B! I've messaged him to confirm.

Thank you for the great info!




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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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On 1/2/2017 at 3:22 AM, ricardopalamino said:

The Seiko 6139B part # for the complete center chronograph wheel is P/N 888612 .

The 6139B comes in a 17 and 21 jewel version . The chronograph finger that sits on top of the wheel is P/N 786610 and can be replaced as these are delicate and have a tendency to break . There is also a part called "Rest of chronograph finger " and that is P/N 787610 . 

I looked up the the the part # for the complete center chronograph wheel for the 6139A , and that is listed as P/N 888610 , although the the "finger' and "rest" are the same P/N for both the A and B versions .

While I was at it I looked up the center chronograph wheel for the 6138 A and B  . That uses P/N 888611 . 

 

I checked my watch parts interchangeability list and the parts aren't listed as interchangeable .

 

I found these complete units on the bay....new and used...

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.05.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.06.46 PM.png

Screen shot 2017-01-01 at 10.07.18 PM.png

 

I didn't see Seiko listed on the Old Swiss Watches website , but I would email Sudarson and ask him if he has them .

I would also email Ramon at TheWatchCollector website because I know he has parts .

Good Luck ,...Louis

 

After trying to repair on the staking tool... I was able to bend the wheel close to normal, I assembled it again and now it runs both with the chrono function on and off, but it grinds to a stand still just before the minute is up.

So, while other information comes to light I've given in and bought one of the ebay options. There's not much out there!

 

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions!

 

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ricardopalamino Distinguished Member

ricardopalamino

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A while back after servicing a 6138 or 6139 , I don't remember which , my chrono second had would stop at the 58 second mark . I did some reading and found out that this was not an uncommon problem and I was able to do the adjustments that are in the troubleshooting section of the 6139A tech sheet . I think the adjustment is for both calibers . As I said , it was a while back . Also I remember replacing part # 893612, the intermediate recording wheel holder . It's a bushing that's attached on one of the plates by a screw .

I have attached some tech sheets in case you haven't seen them .  Checking and adjusting the chronograph mechanism starts about Page 8 on the second attachment and troubleshooting is a little further  back .

This may be a moot point since you bought a new part , but there's some good info in there anyway .

 

  6139B.pdf  

Great One- 6139A.pdf.zip

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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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A while back after servicing a 6138 or 6139 , I don't remember which , my chrono second had would stop at the 58 second mark . I did some reading and found out that this was not an uncommon problem and I was able to do the adjustments that are in the troubleshooting section of the 6139A tech sheet . I think the adjustment is for both calibers . As I said , it was a while back . Also I remember replacing part # 893612, the intermediate recording wheel holder . It's a bushing that's attached on one of the plates by a screw .

I have attached some tech sheets in case you haven't seen them .  Checking and adjusting the chronograph mechanism starts about Page 8 on the second attachment and troubleshooting is a little further  back .

This may be a moot point since you bought a new part , but there's some good info in there anyway .

 

  6139B.pdf  

Great One- 6139A.pdf.zip




Oh this is totally worth it! I will dissect this chrono wheel open and post the results of the autopsy. [emoji1317]




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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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A while back after servicing a 6138 or 6139 , I don't remember which , my chrono second had would stop at the 58 second mark . I did some reading and found out that this was not an uncommon problem and I was able to do the adjustments that are in the troubleshooting section of the 6139A tech sheet . I think the adjustment is for both calibers . As I said , it was a while back . Also I remember replacing part # 893612, the intermediate recording wheel holder . It's a bushing that's attached on one of the plates by a screw .

I have attached some tech sheets in case you haven't seen them .  Checking and adjusting the chronograph mechanism starts about Page 8 on the second attachment and troubleshooting is a little further  back .

This may be a moot point since you bought a new part , but there's some good info in there anyway .

 

  6139B.pdf  

Great One- 6139A.pdf.zip




Oh this is totally worth it! I will dissect this chrono wheel open and post the results of the autopsy. [emoji1317]




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jguitron WRT Addict

jguitron

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A while back after servicing a 6138 or 6139 , I don't remember which , my chrono second had would stop at the 58 second mark . I did some reading and found out that this was not an uncommon problem and I was able to do the adjustments that are in the troubleshooting section of the 6139A tech sheet . I think the adjustment is for both calibers . As I said , it was a while back . Also I remember replacing part # 893612, the intermediate recording wheel holder . It's a bushing that's attached on one of the plates by a screw .

I have attached some tech sheets in case you haven't seen them .  Checking and adjusting the chronograph mechanism starts about Page 8 on the second attachment and troubleshooting is a little further  back .

This may be a moot point since you bought a new part , but there's some good info in there anyway .

 

  6139B.pdf  

Great One- 6139A.pdf.zip




Oh this is totally worth it! I will dissect this chrono wheel open and post the results of the autopsy. [emoji1317]




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rogart63 Distinguished Member

rogart63

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20 hours ago, jguitron said:

After trying to repair on the staking tool... I was able to bend the wheel close to normal, I assembled it again and now it runs both with the chrono function on and off, but it grinds to a stand still just before the minute is up.

So, while other information comes to light I've given in and bought one of the ebay options. There's not much out there!

 

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions!

 

That is probably only adjusting the levers? You will have to look in the pdf how you do that?

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jguitron

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That is probably only adjusting the levers? You will have to look in the pdf how you do that?




I thought so too but I made sure that when the chrono function is on the levers aren't touching the clutch at all and it still stops, I assume when it comes to the uneven portion of the clutch wheel.




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rogart63 Distinguished Member

rogart63

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22 hours ago, jguitron said:

After trying to repair on the staking tool... I was able to bend the wheel close to normal, I assembled it again and now it runs both with the chrono function on and off, but it grinds to a stand still just before the minute is up.

So, while other information comes to light I've given in and bought one of the ebay options. There's not much out there!

 

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions!

At least you have tried everything? Hope an other wheel will work? 

Edited by rogart63
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