Trying to gauge the quality of my services because i'm being offered my first paid gigs. How's this reading look for a 7s26 movement?

[Birbdad]

I feel like this is pretty damn good for this movement? I got a delta of 6 on this same 7s36b before it took a dive on concrete and broke. Reshaped the hairspring and reserviced it and this is what I got now.  I've only done two hairspring jobs but this one was utterly trashed from the fall and i got it i think about as close to perfect as i could.

I'm curious because I have a couple people from watchuseek basically begging me to service and adjust their 7s26's and offering me decent money to do it because they can't find a competent watchmaker. I"m just a hobbyist but i'm thinking of taking them up on it as i get results at the very least far better than the factory after my services on this movement.

The rebuilt hairspring in case there's any room for improvement and the watch in question because we all like watches. 

[Waggy]

All looks good, just to give you a yard stick and put things into perspective I think the rate on a new Seiko is like 20 seconds/day (someone correct me if I'm wrong), so you are better than factory spec in all orientations. Like the finish too, all edges are still crisp and not over rounded/ over polished. Especially like the red seconds hand. 10/10 with a gold star

The bit I always struggle with is pricing... How will you decide what to charge?

See below from Seiko website:

[Birbdad]

20 minutes ago, Waggy said:

All looks good, just to give you a yard stick and put things into perspective I think the rate on a new Seiko is like 20 seconds/day (someone correct me if I'm wrong), so you are better than factory spec in all orientations. Like the finish too, all edges are still crisp and not over rounded/ over polished. Especially like the red seconds hand. 10/10 with a gold star

The bit I always struggle with is pricing... How will you decide what to charge?

See below from Seiko website:

 

All my services have been exponentially better than factory specs. I guess what i'm curious about is how my service stacks up to a professional who was just doing a basic cleaning and service of this movement. the professionals elsewhere i hear keep saying basically seikos are crap, the amplitude is 240 on a good day and i consistently get into the high 270's to low 290's on them.  My oldest service is something like 2 years old now and it's still running well over 270 So i feel like i must be doing something right.

As for the case, i never polished it. that's probably the next thing i'm gonna try to learn as all my cases could use it, that's the factory finish plus some swirlies and some unfortunate dings from the fall. 

AS for pricing i dunno. I'm meticulous and confident in my work but very slow. One guy offered as much as 200 not including any parts. I probably won't make a stellar hourly on that but it might challenge me to speed things up a bit. 

Apparently seiko charges 140 for a "service" aka, just swapping the movement. This guy wants the original movement repaired and cleaned and serviced. People elsewhere have told me a professional would charge 300 or 400 dollars for a service and repair for what i'm told is wrong with it. I'm also gonna warranty the work for 3 years. Apparently this watch has sentimental value and he wants to keep it intact

 

[Kalanag]

21 minutes ago, Birbdad said:

AS for pricing i dunno. I'm meticulous and confident in my work but very slow. One guy offered as much as 200 not including any parts.

These 200 are the minimum you should charge. For full service of an automatic watch a professional wants to see 300 at least (plus spare parts) afaik.

[Birbdad]

18 minutes ago, Kalanag said:

These 200 are the minimum you should charge. For full service of an automatic watch a professional wants to see 300 at least (plus spare parts) afaik.

Yeah, for a first paid gig I think the minimum is reasonable, at the same time i'm not entirely sure how the service you see there would stack up with the results a professional would get. This isn't exactly a high accuracy movement and i feel that's a solid timing.

[Kalanag]

28 minutes ago, Birbdad said:

…i'm not entirely sure how the service you see there would stack up with the results a professional would get…

Are you kidding? Most of us have seen results provided by so called „professionals“. You are more than competitive!

Edited January 20 by Kalanag

[Birbdad]

4 minutes ago, Kalanag said:

Are you kidding? Most of us have seen results provided by so called „professionals“. You are more than competitive!

Well that's good to hear! I just keep hearing form professionals what crap these movements are and i'm thinking "I keep getting REALLY good results out of them..."

[rehajm]

2 hours ago, Birbdad said:

I just keep hearing form professionals what crap these movements are and i'm thinking "I keep getting REALLY good results out of them..."

…this has been my observation as well. The ‘crap’ part often is referring to lack of finish or economical fasteners and shortcuts. I’ve had many that adjust well in positions, like yours…

[tomh207]

I would watch the warranty you are offering, any independent I have priced up is 12 months limited warranty. There is always pitfalls in long warranty if you don’t have a healthy stock of parts.

 

Tom

[Birbdad]

7 hours ago, tomh207 said:

I would watch the warranty you are offering, any independent I have priced up is 12 months limited warranty. There is always pitfalls in long warranty if you don’t have a healthy stock of parts.

 

Tom

That's good advice. Thanks.

[Neverenoughwatches]

15 hours ago, tomh207 said:

I would watch the warranty you are offering, any independent I have priced up is 12 months limited warranty. There is always pitfalls in long warranty if you don’t have a healthy stock of parts.

 

Tom

To cover something that can be subject to misuse and abuse for 3 years seems a long time. 

[thor447]

I found this thread really informative.  I too have struggled trying to figure out a reasonable rate to charge.  I've become known (in my small local circle) as the guy who works on old Seikos.  While that sounds a bit dull, there is some truth to that statement.  I have a soft spot for those old 6138 & 6139 Seiko chronographs from the 70's and have done a number of them (along with other watches of course) for myself and friends.  With friends, it's always been a 'handshake' type deal where they pay me a few dollars for my time and cover any parts costs.  They are also not in any rush to get their watch back (as I do this work during my off-hours).  I have had several people ask me to service their old Seiko chronograph, or other type of watch.  I am very comfortable with those movements and do not have any fear of taking on the work, but I honestly do not know what a fair rate would be.  I've always done them for my own enjoyment or for friends who've begun to appreciate those watches more as they've seen my past projects.  

Edited January 21 by thor447

[watchweasol]

Hi. With cars and other electrical items you purchase an extended warranty after the original twelve months has passed, with repairs etc I would offer three months as not all clients are truthfull. Case. Having had the watch serviced etc he wears it for twelve months, when drilling with a hammer drill the watch stops so under the warranty in your case three years he returns the watch saying it keeps stopping . Upon your inspection you find a bent pivot or at worst a broken balance which may cost you several pounds to replace or a staff the same. You are duty bound to fix it under the warranty. Even the professionals only give three months. Some years back my brothers Omega Seamaster was serviced by Omega and three months warranty in respect of parts fitted.  So charge a fair price and three months.   When I do batteries I tell the client he has twelve months warranty on the battery should it fail within that time I replace F.o.c. And I have had very few back. Reason is that you do get rogue batteries even though I only use top quality RENATA.    What you do is your own affair and with your consience

[tomh207]

1 hour ago, thor447 said:

I found this thread really informative.  I too have struggled trying to figure out a reasonable rate to charge.  I've become known (in my small local circle) as the guy who works on old Seikos.  While that sounds a bit dull, there is some truth to that statement.  I have a soft spot for those old 6138 & 6139 Seiko chronographs from the 70's and have done a number of them (along with other watches of course) for myself and friends.  With friends, it's always been a 'handshake' type deal where they pay me a few dollars for my time and cover any parts costs.  They are also not in any rush to get their watch back (as I do this work during my off-hours).  I have had several people ask me to service their old Seiko chronograph, or other type of watch.  I am very comfortable with those movements and do not have any fear of taking on the work, but I honestly do not know what a fair rate would be.  I've always done them for my own enjoyment or for friends who've begun to appreciate those watches more as they've seen my past projects.  

Here in the UK basic Watch service starts around the £150 mark, chronographs from £300 and up, both plus parts.

 

Tom

[Birbdad]

Well i already offered him 3 years but that was just on the service itself. I now know that was bad. My main concern is that while i am VERY confident in my services, this is my first paid gig, so far almost 2 years out i think my earliest services have only improved slightly with age but i keep hearing that a bad service can rear it's ugly head often after 2 or 3 years whereas a good service will last 5 or more.  

I would feel bad if i wasn't as good as i feel like i am and his watch started running like crap after a year. 

I'll probably clarify to him this covers the service, not broken parts or anything so if something happens and he sends it back to me and i find a broken pivot or something he can either pay me to fix it and service it again or i'll close it up and send it back.

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, watchweasol said:

Having had the watch serviced etc he wears it for twelve months, when drilling with a hammer drill the watch stops so under the warranty in your case three years he returns the watch saying it keeps stopping .

Haha i was trying to think of examples where a customer would not consider he had damaged the watch. I came up with playing golf, my next was a genuine case of me drilling out a door lock for somebody that had lost their key. I was wearing a timex that i had just repaired, it stopped halfway through the job. The impulse pin had jumped over the fork slot through excessive vibration, an easy fix but i should have known better than to wear it and use a drill.

15 minutes ago, Birbdad said:

Well i already offered him 3 years but that was just on the service itself. I now know that was bad. My main concern is that while i am VERY confident in my services, this is my first paid gig, so far almost 2 years out i think my earliest services have only improved slightly with age but i keep hearing that a bad service can rear it's ugly head often after 2 or 3 years whereas a good service will last 5 or more.  

I would feel bad if i wasn't as good as i feel like i am and his watch started running like crap after a year. 

I'll probably clarify to him this covers the service, not broken parts or anything so if something happens and he sends it back to me and i find a broken pivot or something he can either pay me to fix it and service it again or i'll close it up and send it back.

 

Customers can be funny people, with some if its stopped working then its stopped working and they dont care why. Might seem over the top but if its to be a regular thing then a simple detailed written warranty will cover your back. Any new watch i have bought was only guaranteed for one year.

[Birbdad]

32 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Haha i was trying to think of examples where a customer would not consider he had damaged the watch. I came up with playing golf, my next was a genuine case of me drilling out a door lock for somebody that had lost their key. I was wearing a timex that i had just repaired, it stopped halfway through the job. The impulse pin had jumped over the fork slot through excessive vibration, an easy fix but i should have known better than to wear it and use a drill.

Customers can be funny people, with some if its stopped working then its stopped working and they dont care why. Might seem over the top but if its to be a regular thing then a simple detailed written warranty will cover your back. Any new watch i have bought was only guaranteed for one year.

We'll see. He's my first paid gig. he's taking a chance on me. I bet if this turns out well i'll get other gigs. I'll be a bit more cautious with them.

[tomh207]

36 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Haha i was trying to think of examples where a customer would not consider he had damaged the watch. I came up with playing golf, my next was a genuine case of me drilling out a door lock for somebody that had lost their key. I was wearing a timex that i had just repaired, it stopped halfway through the job. The impulse pin had jumped over the fork slot through excessive vibration, an easy fix but i should have known better than to wear it and use a drill.

Customers can be funny people, with some if its stopped working then its stopped working and they dont care why. Might seem over the top but if its to be a regular thing then a simple detailed written warranty will cover your back. Any new watch i have bought was only guaranteed for one year.

Having worked in IT for the majority of my working life I suspect watches will be considered the same, “I done nothing “  and “you were the last person to touch it so it’s your responsibility for life”

I can think of lots of ways “normal “ use would break a mechanical watch by the uninformed/unthinking.

”it stopped while I was washing the car and it all steamed up, I haven’t had time to get it back to you for the past 6 months “ cue @Nucejoe ‘s shares in coke going up

 

Tom

[rehajm]

1 minute ago, tomh207 said:

cue @Nucejoe ‘s shares in coke going up

That’s funny but…when he says soak it in coke overnight he means coca-cola? 

I’ve been doing it wrong …

[RichardHarris123]

7 minutes ago, rehajm said:

That’s funny but…when he says soak it in coke overnight he means coca-cola? 

I’ve been doing it wrong …

I tried the smokeless fuel, it didn't work at all.  Hehe. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

13 minutes ago, rehajm said:

That’s funny but…when he says soak it in coke overnight he means coca-cola? 

I’ve been doing it wrong …

The movement would run and run and run and run and run and run and run and run and run and run and run ...............

[Klassiker]

53 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Any new watch i have bought was only guaranteed for one year

The legal minimum manufacturer's warranty on new goods is two years. For the first 12 months, any faults are assumed to have been there from the date of manufacture, unless they are obviously the result of abuse. In the second year, the burden of proof transfers to the consumer, i.e. you might have to prove that the fault came from the manufacturer. Often, manufacturers don't make this distinction and repair on warranty up to two years after purchase no questions asked. 

[watchweasol]

Hi @Birbdad  He may well be your first , and you are confident in your abilities to do a good job but there is not a professional watchmaker out there who will warranty a watch for three years. It’s bad business practise. You in the first instance know how he wears his watch and what he doe# when wearing it . Golf for instance is a great wrecker of watches.  When asked how it broke the answer just a game of golf.

once the watch has left you know matter how good you are you have no control over what happens. A good client will willingly accept three to six months as it’s either the same ot more than the usual warranty.  The fact that you are giving this is warranty proves to the client you take pride in your work, very rare have I had one back under the warranty I give including batteries. Do not sell yourself short. You have put the hours in learning the job invested in tools oils etc. It ts not a cheap hobby by any means.

 

[Razz]

Seikos are not crap! This is crap (see below). I picked this at a car boot (swap meet or flea market here in the states) for $5. I showed the seller that it was fake and we had a brief conversation about why would someone fake a Seiko? I could not help but posting it here because I think the OP's watch is what this watch is trying to be. An interesting aside is that the quartz movement is a Sunon SP28 and has 4 beats per second and so kind of looks like it "sweeps" like a mechanical. I may cross this into another case as the movement is worth more than the $5 as is the case...

[RichardHarris123]

I didn't know that any quartz ran at 4 beats per second.  Leant something new.