1960's Rolex precision (Cal 1210). Damaged small seconds pivot and missing second hand.

[Vacheron7]

Hi again guys, 

While I am waiting for my third wheel for my mums watch to arrive from Cousins which I posted about earlier (thanks watchweasol)! I thought I''d return to another project. This time it a a 1960's Rolex which was given to my grandfather for long service who gave it to me.

The movement is a Rolex Cal 1210 (which is the 1200 base with modifications for a small seconds hand). Unfortunately there are two issues I have identified with the watch (at the time of writing at least!) 

Firstly it is missing the seconds hand, secondly the extended pivot which holds the second hand is noticeably bent. My grandfather worked in heavy engineering and my dad says that he had probably tried to fix it himself at some point but had "a touch like a baby rhino" which probably explains the damage and the resultant abandoning of the watch into the back of a drawer!

So my questions for today are:

• Does anyone know where I might be able to obtain a replacement wheel (Rolex ref 7480)
  (I have ordered a replacement crystal from Cousins but they show the Rolex wheel as a "manufacturer restricted" part, and there is no way I am paying Rolex service prices to have them supply and fit one for me!)
   
• Failing the above, it may be possible to straighten the pivot as I have seen Mark do in his video restoring the damaged Heuer triple date but I appreciate it is risky.
   
• Does anyone know where I might be able to source a replacement small seconds hand as I have no idea where that has gone, probably into my grandads' carpet some time between 1960 and 1980! :)

I have attached photos of the wheel with the bent pivot and a photo from the internet of the same model watch to show the layout and hands design.

Thanks again:
Paul. 

[clockboy]

It might be possible to straighten the pivot. To straighten the pivot it must be supported such as staking tool hole and gently gently try and bend it. If it brakes it could be re-pivoted if you have a lathe.  Cousins sell hands so that might be possible to replace too. The bottom line is repairing vintage watches is difficult due to parts not being available. 

[watchweasol]

Hi  Staightening pivots is not for the faint hearted , They can be straightened using a pulling /stroking action along the length of the pivot. It all depends on the hardness of the pivot in question some are pot hard and brittle aka french clocks and others not so bad. There is a tool by Seitz for doing the job bt they are expensive.

[nickelsilver]

Every pivot straightening can potentially end with a broken pivot. For one like that, I like to stick the pivot out of a lantern in a Jacot tool, then use stout nickel (or brass) tweezers that have been warmed in an alcohol lamp flame until almost to hot to handle. Turn the wheel by hand and locate the direction the pivot need to go and coax it with the hot tweezers. Keep going until it's straight. The hot tweezers really really help; they aren't hot enough to affect the temper (not even close) but the heat is key.

[Vacheron7]

Thanks very much for the responses everyone. 

I'm afraid my skill level is still a long way from justifying lathes and Jacot tools, but I think the heat and coaxing method with heat could be worth considering. I accept that they may be brittle, but for someone at my level, I guess there is only one way to find out! :-)

Due to the risk, my first thought is probably to re-assemble the movement and see if the thicker part of the pivot which sits in the top plate jewel is straight (it looks like it is), then, if everything else is working OK  I might simply re-assemble it without the second hand fitted (providing the pivot is not fouling on the dial) and see how well it runs while I look for a replacement wheel, however these do seem to sell for £40-£50, and I haven't seen one for sale anywhere at present. 

Everything else seems visually OK now the rest of the movement has been stripped and cleaned, but that 60 year old dry oil was murder to get off!   

Edited April 27, 2020 by Vacheron7

[rodabod]

On 4/23/2020 at 11:34 AM, nickelsilver said:

Every pivot straightening can potentially end with a broken pivot. For one like that, I like to stick the pivot out of a lantern in a Jacot tool, then use stout nickel (or brass) tweezers that have been warmed in an alcohol lamp flame until almost to hot to handle. Turn the wheel by hand and locate the direction the pivot need to go and coax it with the hot tweezers. Keep going until it's straight. The hot tweezers really really help; they aren't hot enough to affect the temper (not even close) but the heat is key.

Nick, does it really make a difference to have it heated like that, even if it is sub-tempering temperature? I always thought that the only option was to change the temper slightly. Interested  to know. 

[nickelsilver]

Nick, does it really make a difference to have it heated like that, even if it is sub-tempering temperature? I always thought that the only option was to change the temper slightly. Interested  to know. 

Totally, it's a night and day difference.

[rodabod]

Thank you. I will need to give it a shot on a scrap wheel. 

[Vacheron7]

Hi everyone. Just an update to let you know the outcome. 

I re-assembled the movement with the pivot still bent initially to see how it went.

My hope was that the pivot would sit in the jewel at the shoulder area marked in blue, however the pivot sits in the jewel in the area marked in green and that has limited to the bend until it protrudes through the jewel (red).

This is good because the pivot still sits and rotates well In the jewel, but bad in that any attempt to straighten the pivot which resulted in it snapping at the shoulder would mean that the watch would be rendered inoperable until I could source a replacement wheel.

For that reason I have decided to continue to search for a new fourth wheel while leaving this one as it is (and without the second hand). Then, if I do manage to source one I will attempt to straighten the pivot. If this is successful will then re-sell the new "backup" wheel.

There is only one on eBay at the moment and it is over £100 so I am happy to wait this one out! 

In the meantime however it is running like a charm with great amplitude and between -3 to -1 seconds per day depending on position. 

I have attached a dropbox link of the whole restoration below for anyone who may be interested (no descriptions yet, so didn't want to put it in the walkthrough section).

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/q5u7g8qqzh2jhhp/AADxH3BfwlvPgPuMnbmWWlx0a?dl=0

Paul.

 

 

Edited May 11, 2020 by Vacheron7