Jump to content
Tmuir

Tame Side Fusee Clock in need of TLC

Recommended Posts

Six or so years ago on a trip to UK I bought myself a Tame Side Fusee Clock.

I was actually after a more traditional English Fussee clock, but all the good ones I saw were a bit out of my price range and then I stumbled across this one in Edinburgh.

My family is from Newburgh in Fife which for those that know the population of Fife is only around 2000, so finding a clock that was obviously made for someone that had a business in Newburgh was too much to pass up on.

On returning home I had it serviced by a person that had a very professional website and talked the talk as a professional watch repairer. This was before I started to learn Horology.

When I got the clock back I was never happy with the clock and when I questioned what he had done he got a bit shirty with me and basically tried to tell me I didn't know what I was talking about.

At this point I just gave up and adjusted it the best I could which was the clock running fast by 10 minutes on the first 3 days and back to within a minute or 2 by 6 days, if I left it to the 7th day to wind it, it would be miles slow.

 

I stopped winding the clock 2 years ago and decided to leave it until I was ready to service it myself knowing it already needed a new suspension spring as it had a small kink in it and despite me asking the repairer to replace it he didn't telling me it was fine and I was wrong it needed to be replaced.

I have since learnt this repairer has a notorious reputation of ruining clocks and have also seen many examples of clocks butchered by this person, he had previously applied to join a professional association for watch and Clock Makers, but has been refused as he did not meet the associations guidelines for quality and ethics.

Long story over this is my clock.

I had already removed the movement when I realised I didn't have a photo of the case and dial, so the hands are just sat on the dial so you can see them, nice Scottish theremed hands with Thistles on them.

dial.thumb.jpg.c2409b84bd7cf13d8da5ff987d0bb3ab.jpg

 

Back of movement this photo was taken years ago before I had it serviced, notice the kinked suspension spring, it came back like this to me, also in this photo the spring appears to be held in place correctly by a screw, but it came back with a bent taper pin jammed in place of the screw.

movement1.thumb.jpg.c3a4a7c3d3ab1854115e4d8cc4d5f460.jpg

This is an odd fussee movement in that it has no ratchet and click for the mainspring barrel. It just has a brass plate that is screwed onto the plate after the barrel is tensioned up and as far as I can tell this is original. (We will get to the solder)

movement4.jpg.1b584e85f423a0b5e0452f69d59aca88.jpg

This is a photo I just took tonight with the front plate removed, notice the oil all over everything. I've yet to dismantle the mainspring barrel and clean it, but from what I can see under all the oil it looks like he cracked the edge of the barrel so the cover would not click back in, so soft soldered it in. I will find out for sure once it is cleaned but it looks like I may need to make a new mainspring barrel which is going to be an interesting exercise to say the least. I fully expectthe spring to be set too as I know he also did not replace it. Fun times aheadmovement3.thumb.jpg.6b9b8db481821814daebb501dec616fd.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Tmuir said:

Six or so years ago on a trip to UK I bought myself a Tame Side Fusee Clock.

I was actually after a more traditional English Fussee clock, but all the good ones I saw were a bit out of my price range and then I stumbled across this one in Edinburgh.

My family is from Newburgh in Fife which for those that know the population of Fife is only around 2000, so finding a clock that was obviously made for someone that had a business in Newburgh was too much to pass up on.

On returning home I had it serviced by a person that had a very professional website and talked the talk as a professional watch repairer. This was before I started to learn Horology.

When I got the clock back I was never happy with the clock and when I questioned what he had done he got a bit shirty with me and basically tried to tell me I didn't know what I was talking about.

At this point I just gave up and adjusted it the best I could which was the clock running fast by 10 minutes on the first 3 days and back to within a minute or 2 by 6 days, if I left it to the 7th day to wind it, it would be miles slow.

 

I stopped winding the clock 2 years ago and decided to leave it until I was ready to service it myself knowing it already needed a new suspension spring as it had a small kink in it and despite me asking the repairer to replace it he didn't telling me it was fine and I was wrong it needed to be replaced.

I have since learnt this repairer has a notorious reputation of ruining clocks and have also seen many examples of clocks butchered by this person, he had previously applied to join a professional association for watch and Clock Makers, but has been refused as he did not meet the associations guidelines for quality and ethics.

Long story over this is my clock.

I had already removed the movement when I realised I didn't have a photo of the case and dial, so the hands are just sat on the dial so you can see them, nice Scottish theremed hands with Thistles on them.

dial.thumb.jpg.c2409b84bd7cf13d8da5ff987d0bb3ab.jpg

 

Back of movement this photo was taken years ago before I had it serviced, notice the kinked suspension spring, it came back like this to me, also in this photo the spring appears to be held in place correctly by a screw, but it came back with a bent taper pin jammed in place of the screw.

movement1.thumb.jpg.c3a4a7c3d3ab1854115e4d8cc4d5f460.jpg

This is an odd fussee movement in that it has no ratchet and click for the mainspring barrel. It just has a brass plate that is screwed onto the plate after the barrel is tensioned up and as far as I can tell this is original. (We will get to the solder)

movement4.jpg.1b584e85f423a0b5e0452f69d59aca88.jpg

This is a photo I just took tonight with the front plate removed, notice the oil all over everything. I've yet to dismantle the mainspring barrel and clean it, but from what I can see under all the oil it looks like he cracked the edge of the barrel so the cover would not click back in, so soft soldered it in. I will find out for sure once it is cleaned but it looks like I may need to make a new mainspring barrel which is going to be an interesting exercise to say the least. I fully expectthe spring to be set too as I know he also did not replace it. Fun times aheadmovement3.thumb.jpg.6b9b8db481821814daebb501dec616fd.jpg

 

  those "now it all" guys are everywhere ! out a bounty on um.  vin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clock has now been stripped down, inspected and cleaned.

I think I have got lucky with the mainspring barrel. The soldering on the cap had been badly done as the parts hadn't been cleaned correctly so the solder hadn't flowed into the gap between the cap and the barrel wall. This allowed me to gently hold the the barrel in a vice and with careful application of my MAPP gas burner directly to the soft solder allowed me to melt it and wipe it off without heating up the whole barrel. I am not going to try and wet and dry off all the soft solder as I'm worried it will damage the lip of the cap so it won't refit. Once I have a new fusee wire I guess I will find out if it will go back together again. The mainspring is good and not set, although it was dry with no sign of oil or grease on it which is probably one of the reasons it didn't keep good time.

A number of the pivots have been badly burnished in the past giving me tapered pivots so once I have fixed this I am likely need to fit 3 or 4 bushes to the main plates.

When I went to dismantle the fusee for cleaning I found another issue, the keyway piece had not been aligned correctly and the screw holding it in place had been put in at an angle damaging the thread on the screw and fusee, so I will need to fit a new screw and either retap the thread in the great wheel or plug the existing hole and drill and tap a new thread.

For those that haven't seen inside a fusee I've prepared a few photos, please note this clock does not have maintaining power for for winding, if it did it would have 2 wheels, a maintaining power wheel and a great wheel, this clock just has a great wheel.

First picture shows the fusee in 3 parts.

From the left we have the fusee cone with the ratchet wheel on the right and the stop piece on the left.

Then we have the great wheel showing the fusee click and spring, unlike a regular clock the has the ratchet outside the plates fusee clocks have them inside the ratchet (They may also have another ratchet on the main spring barrel, but this clock does not).

On the far right we have the keyway piece.

fusee1.png.fae500ecd12ab32ebe6c665439da4631.png

This photo shows the great wheel fitted, the hole drilled in the great wheel by the click in the photo above lets you insert a small screwdriver to hold the click out of the way of the ratchet whilst you fit it on the fusee. At this point there is nothing stopping the great wheel from falling off, notice the slot cut into the arbor, this is for the keyway piece.fusee2.png.e2f55cc673e2f0dcc9de278d65c51704.png

This photo shows the keyway piece in the process of being fitted. You can see a screw hole in the great wheel at about 10:30pm, the keyway piece needs to be rotated around and then pushed home so the screw hole in this aligns with the one in the great wheel as per the second  photo below.

fusee3.png.7cf7bcc85b57da3e3efc9fa446a9d2ec.png

I should add that the keyway piece is slightly domed so that the great wheel fits snugly against the fuse, with no sideways movement, but not so tight that it binds on the fusee. As the thread is damaged on my screw I haven't shown it fitted in the photo, but you would normally fit it now which would stop the keyway piece from being able to slide back out.

fusee4.png.180fb463d6ab91f63a2e612ac281908e.png

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Tmuir   Hello from Scotland.   A classic looking clock and will be well worth the time repairing, Its a pity some of the so called "professionals" bodge stuff up, I think its a profit thing time to them is money (forgive the pun) , We hobbyists have plenty of time no rent or overheads so can take as long as we need to do a good job. Like you I have come across some horrors , Bad attitude unforgivable.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What absolute disgusting work by that person.  A few who are only after your cash and have no pride in their work.

I’m sure you will make a good job and put right the bodged up crap by that person. From reading your decryption of the clock, you know how it works and what the parts do. When it comes to fitting a new line, I suggest you buy the nylon-coated line, make sure it seats nicely in the groves of the fusee

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do have a question for you though about the line oldhippy.

This clock just has solder blobs on the end of the lines to stop them slipping out on both end and the barrel only has 2 slots not 3 so was not tied in as per the regular way. It just went in one slot and out the next and the solder blob stopped it from pulling back out. Although now I need to make a new barrel I will be looking at using 3 holes to do it the traditional way.

But back to the solder blobs, from what I've read on the cheaper fusee movements made after 1900 this was a common way to fit the wires, and on the fusee end I think I will need to do this again. I'm assuming this will make it not possible to use the nylon coated wire if I need to make a solder blob on the end.

Have you ever worked on fusee clocks that used this method to stop the wire pulling out and if so is there any trick to making the solder blob, or just melt some solder on and don't add too much?

The fusee is now fixed, I redrilled the screw hole to take an 8BA thread, tapped it and reamed out the keyway piece hole for the screw head to fit the slightly larger size screw head.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It sounds as if you would be happier with the line and solder, that is a good way and very safe, just make sure the blob sits in snug. With the nylon, you just burn it back until it seals its self into a mould.  I have restored many with this type of movement. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, just working out my parts order now.

Besides the parts I also need a couple of new broaches as the mainspring barrel bush will require broaches larger than my biggest size.

Cousins sells the larger cutting broaches, but doesn't do any smoothing broaches over 6mm.

Even M&P look not to do any bigger than 8mm, its not the end of the world if I cant find a large smoothing broach, but do you know anywhere that sells them up to just over 9mm?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I couldn’t get them. I would add a little oil when cutting that does the trick. The finest crocus paper is also very good wrapped around a very large rat tail file. If you have a lathe that can take the barrel mores the better, you can insert the file into the hole and polish.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes I've got a pretty much fully kitted out workshop, previous to learning how to repair watches and clocks I used to collect and restore toy live steam engines and I would usually have to manufacture parts for them hence my workshop with a Chinese lathe, Sherline lathe, X2 mill, drill press, cold cutting bandsaw, bench grinder etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For those interested here is a photo of the cracks in the barrel wall, you can see them extending out from both slots for holding the wire although the crack on the left side is not as visible it is cracked through the barrel too, hence why I Need to make a new barrel.

My order of brass tube and 1.5mm brass sheet arrived today, as the biggest cost is the postage I ordered more than I need, enough to make 2 more barrels.

I've got to wait for a cool day as its too hot to work in my workshop at the moment.

I've never made a barrel from scratch before so it will be an interesting learning experience.

1490701718_barrelcrack.jpg.31e866937060de4b144f79283ea12569.jpg2037704002_barreltube.jpg.f0f9238397c00606bf2b4cd37449f370.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • I have this vintage Seiko digital LCD watch from around 1985. The "dial" seems to be very dirty and I'm wondering how I can go about cleaning it. It looks like its mostly dirt and grime. What can I use to clean it? I tried looking around for a NOS dial with no luck...
    • Another mistake.. bent the spring the wrong side... i had to cut it off and bend it again however it seems that I fixed the mainspring and the clock started to work. Yes it is shorter now by 10-15 mm but it works. I am really happy. VID_20190221_231500.mp4
    • You can replace acrylic crystals on a lot of vintage watches with just a clawed crystal lift tool. Nice and compact, cheap too. https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/round-glasses-superior
    • Your Seiko Watch is considered a very inexpensive watch by even Seiko standards. We recently had discussions on Seiko watches and timekeeping there is an exact procedures Seiko recommends for timing. Casually your numbers are super good for a watch of this grade. Then tech sheets are really handy because this watch is using what's known as the etachron system. This is why I quoted something above on a normal watch you can push on the spring to get things in alignment but with this system both the stud can be rotated and you can rotate the regulator pins. You're supposed to have a special tool but you can do with tweezers. That makes it considerably easier to get things in alignment it also makes it much easier for those not paying attention to get things out of alignment. Then this " smart phone regulator " Thing you're talking about does it tell you if your watches in beat or not?  
    • Normally changing a battery is really simple so if somebody sells you A watch just needing A new battery because they were too lazy to do it, that is strange? Just think you put the battery in the watch is running it increases in value dramatically so maybe they weren't telling the truth? Then we need the model number of the movement telling us that it is a Tissot PRS516 Isn't super helpful because according to link below and it's more like a series of watches. So there should be a model number on the back side of the movement itself.  AndyHull Gave you some good starting answers. 101 make sure you have power to the watch. But there are some additional electrical checks once you verify that Then there is the mechanical aspects. Just because the watch looks clean doesn't mean by quartz watch standards that it's going to function. Mechanical watches have lots of power things aren't quite right they might not run right but they will usually run through all this things that aren't right. The quartz watches are really critical on how clean things are lubrication one speck of dust in the wrong place depending upon the watches enough to stop it almost. So their way less tolerance for mechanical Issues which you can't worry about it until you verify the electronics is working. https://www.tissotwatches.com/en-en/shop/all-our-watches/t-sport/tissot-prs-516.html
×