Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted

Thanks guys, I have almost no idea what most of the parts do.

What should I do before re-assembly?

I have it in mind just to put it back together.

Maybe I should buy some oil or give it a clean and new main spring.

The movement was working before dismantling but stopping intermittently.

Would it be frowned upon if I just attempted to rebuild it without any servicing on my first attempt?

Posted (edited)

Given that you are just starting out in this horological hobby and probably don't have specialised cleaning equipment, thoroughly wash the parts in lighter fuel before re-assembly and lubrication. You will have to purchase watch oil, oilers and grease to progress with your task. Make a point of watching Mark's videos where he describes in detail how to lubricate a watch. Oil the pinions and jewels only, nit the gears, and remember too little oil will cause less problems than too much.

I forgot to say that given the inter taint problem that you had, you will probably nor require a new spring.

Edited by Geo
Posted

I believe that for starters it would be OK to use toothpicks (pegwood is customary but maybe this time we can look the other way :)  ) and carefully peg every jewel before cleaning. Inspect them and determine if they are not cracked or chipped. Maybe after cleaning and lubing the problem goes away...or it may need a part replacement?

  • Like 1
Posted

I've removed the barrel bridge to show the mainspring barrel and what I think is called the great wheel(?)

 

step15.jpg

 

Finally I turn the movement back over and remove the winding mechanism and it's finished.

 

step16.jpg

 

I'm going to leave the main barrel closed this time, give the watch a clean and start rebuilding but I'll need some supplies first.

 

I'll use a toothpick as suggested and source some basic watch oil. I have some lighter fluid but really need to study what I can and can't put in it to clean.

 

Am I correct in thinking I shouldn't put pieces with jewels in the ligher fluid because of the glue or have I got two pieced of info mixed up?

Posted

Lighter fluid is fine (I use it to clean all the parts). Alcohol is what can melt the shellac that holds some the jewels in place (on the balance wheel and the pallet fork especially I believe).

Posted

I have a good look at the bare parts and noticed this hook. There are two of these on each side of the movement. 

 

During the dismantling I never touched them, what are they for?

 

Also there is a stamp H873 - I expect this is the movement no.?

 

hooks.jpg

Posted

They hold the dial in place, you should have pushed them outwards to release the dial. Before fitting the dial hinge them outwards, position the dial, then press them back in to grip the pins.

Posted

Now I can see the new pictures! Excellent documentation PhilB! The toothpick is for pegging, you still need an oiler to oil the movement. I suggest the smallest one, usually the black Bergeon which is not to expensive (for a change).

 

 

post-253-0-76175300-1409749217_thumb.jpg

Posted

They hold the dial in place, you should have pushed them outwards to release the dial. Before fitting the dial hinge them outwards, position the dial, then press them back in to grip the pins.

 

The dial just clips on with two pegs, I can't see how these hold it on tbh.

Posted

Now I can see the new pictures! Excellent documentation PhilB! The toothpick is for pegging, you still need an oiler to oil the movement. I suggest the smallest one, usually the black Bergeon which is not to expensive (for a change).

 

Thanks, I'll have to gather a list of things need to get it back together and place an order.

 

Oil and oiler I think.

 

I'd like a x4 + x10 magnifier.   I'm using a x20 and it's a bit too close.

Posted

The dial just clips on with two pegs, I can't see how these hold it on tbh.

Look for my video on how to service a quartz watch. It has the same kind of dial fittings.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Posted

Got it. 

 

It would have been handy to know before I prised the face off. Oh well you live and learn.  :unsure:

 

I also now know why, when I went to put the face back on, it was a bit  difficult.

Posted

Got it. 

 

It would have been handy to know before I prised the face off. Oh well you live and learn.  :unsure:

 

Thats what its all about :) keep at it - you are doing great!

Posted

Fantastic write-up Phil ... well done!

 

As for being concerned about parts falling out un-noticed, as you said "Photos" ... I take HEAPS of them for just that reason.  Even though I'm getting much better at identifying each part, I never get complacent about taking reference photos, and on more than one occasion it has been invaluable for identifying the correct location for springs and gears.

 

Also Phil, one thing that I also do is download the Tech Document, and name each part as I remove it, verbally to myself.  I also make a point of naming each part properly in my write-ups to reinforce it in my brain.  It may sound a little silly, but for me, it has fast tracked me remembering all the parts of a movement and where they go.

Posted

 I also make a point of naming each part properly in my write-ups to reinforce it in my brain. 

 

I also name the parts, most are called Dave, so I get really confused......... :unsure:

  • Like 1
Posted
Legarm, on 04 Sept 2014 - 3:46 PM, said:

I also name the parts, most are called Dave, so I get really confused......... :unsure:

Geo, on 04 Sept 2014 - 5:34 PM, said:

I've come across a few whatsits and the the thingamajigs in chronographs!

 

ROFL!!  :lol:

Posted

Hello guys

 

I want to put this back together, and so have watched Marks videos 

 

How to service a mechanical watch. Part 2 and 3.

 

Mark uses  Moebious 9501 Grease and Moebious D5 Oil.

 

I don't want to spend too much on my first build so is there something cheaper?

 

Phil

Posted

Do you want to put it back together and make sure it works, then take it apart again and so on... ? Or do you want to put it back together to wear it ?

If it's for practice, I say use basic oil to practice oiling properly, to make sure it's lubricated enough to run a bit, but don't use it for long periods of time. I'm probably going to get smacked for saying this.... 

 

If it's for good, then, you have to invest I'm afraid... And it might seem expensive, but this little tiny container of oil will last a looooooonnnng time. Do you have an oiler yet ?

 

How did you end up cleaning it btw ?

  • Like 1
Posted

I just want to get it running as an test to see if I'm capable and wouldn't mind stripping it again and doing it with good quality oil.

 

Cheap oil it is, for test purposes only.

Posted

I used this oil for my first couple of watches, because l didn't know if I would be any good at watch repair. That was about three years ago and they are still running OK and keeping good time. I now use Mobeous oil.

Posted

Hello guys - I've started rebuilding this movement but I'm having some difficulty replacing this cover plate.

 

As far as I can see, I need to fit the plate while making sure the top stems of these 4 cogs are correctly fitting in their jewels.

 

The first wheel on the left (great wheel) is completely hidden under the cover plate making it impossible to align.

 

Any tips to improve my chances?

 

I haven't installed the crown wheel and winding mechanism.

 

4pivots.jpg

Posted

Remove the balance wheel and escapement lever, these should be fitted last. This will now allow you to fit the main bridge more easily, and also allow you to see if everything is running freely. Once you have achieved that, fit the escapement lever and do not oil the jewels that it oscillates in. Now wind the watch 1-2 turns and check that the escapement levers flicks sharply from side to side by gently pushing it with a dry oiler or tooth pick.

If all is well, fit the balance wheel. Make sure that you position the balance jewel correctly in regard to where the the end of the lever. Looking down on the lever, if it lying to the right, ensure that the balance jewel is even further to the right when you drop the balance into position. Vice versa if the lever is lying to the left. As you turn the balance cock into the correct position the watch should start running.

Posted

Agreed - as a general rule you should never fit the train wheels after the escapement is in place - you will find it very hard to locate the escape wheel as it will keep fouling the pallets - and you could even chip the pallet jewels.

 

Take the balance and pallets back off then you will be able to fit the train bridge with not problems and importantly check the free running of the train as Geo said.

 

The wheels are correctly orientated as far as I can see. But I would also remove the ratchet wheel which will give you better access to locate the pivots.

 

Good job so far! :)


  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • One of the problems with trying to Photograph Phils things are that his enjoyment was building these things so they tended to E falls on what will see if I can find some earlier pictures or any pictures I wasn't even sure because I was looking for that specific picture for somebody else and even it got the last version and that would have been the last version. You will note that he put the indexing on something that he could unscrew it or whatever and it can slide back out of the way so the rest of the lathe can be used as a lathe. With the lathe cut are actually coming down from the top I was there once where he demonstrated how to cut a pivot with the setup it was really beautiful. Older set up if I remember it's not a worm gear assembly in the thing in between the stepping motor and the holding block I believe this particular one was like a 100 to 1 gear ratio. Earlier version with watchmaker's lathe. Even looks like he is the watchmakers bed and then switch to something he made. Then I do have other pictures and things of the rotary stage in use. In the raw so if you tube videos here is an example of one were somebody's mounting a three jaw chuck. At one time there were available on eBay they were not cheap but if you're patient like I was I found one cheap on eBay. After you watch the video it look at his other videos he is a whole bunch of other examples of the same rotary stage. That I do know there are other pictures examples and possibly videos you just have to track them down. One of the minor issues of finding this particular tech sheet for the unit is I believe it was a custom manufacturer and the company change their name but I remember the new name here's a link to the company https://www.ondrivesus.com/rino-mechanical-components                
    • Escapement adjusting always interesting and depending upon the reference always confusing. Okay maybe it's not always confusing but it does lead to confusion. I have a PDF below it's actually a whole bunch of separate stuff including a hand out that came from a lecture that's on you tube. Then from that we get this image Consequences of doing things especially if you do things out of order or you do things for the wrong reason. Oh and even if the watches working I made the mistake one so showing my boss how tweaking the banking pins on a full plate on the timing machine made the amplitude get better and now he thinks that's what they're for and I don't think a fully grasped exactly what horn clearance means. Consequence of doing things. Notice what it says about opening and closing the banking pins and total lock? So yes I've had that on a full plate where it won't unlock at all and that's the banking pins or a combination of things basically. So banking pins unfortunately get moved. One of the ways to tell if it's been moved is the look straight down at the end of the fork with the balance wheel removed. Power on the fork push at the one side look at it push it to the other side also look at it and compare anything with the center reference the balance jewel and see if both sides of the same. No guarantee after the same there in the right place but at least are the same typically when people play with things one side will be way off from the other because they had no idea what they were doing at all because of course it's a full plate and you really have to paying attention and even then there's still hard to do. Then the other thing that comes up like it shows below is people often adjust the banking pins to do all those other things as opposed to horn clearance which is all that it's therefore and maybe bonus Guard pin clearance although you're supposed to deal with the guard pin is a separate thing like single roller gets bent in Or out or sometimes physically gets moved in and out. Some full plates older escapement's typically pallet forks held together with screws and you can actually unscrew and move the entire assembly in Or out more complications to deal with.     Escapement handout wostep nscc.pdf
    • If he was much younger and some sort of sports player it wouldn't be a problem. They would be in there and doing surgery and he'd be back on the field in no time. Unfortunately when you get older little things are bad and big things can be really bad so not good at all.
    • Where I work everything incoming watches whatever detailed descriptions are taken entered into a computer program and photograph of each item. Then ideally although it depends on who's doing the paperwork detailed descriptions can be quite good other times there lacking. Like I really like it with pocket watches if they would record the serial number it avoids confusion later on. Then when watch repairs are completed that is also entered in. It's one of the amusements I learned when I was in school instructor had a shop and commented about the important aspect of keeping detailed records of repairs. Because oftentimes a customer who got a new crystal will come back later on when the watch doesn't work and expect you to fix the entire watch for free. Then you can remind them that they just got a crystal. Strangely enough that keeps coming up or occasionally comes up where I work now. One of the problems of using the service marks on the case is that in the case of pocket watches oftentimes that's not the original case. Then case marks? What I was doing warranty work for a company I used to describe a code number in the back of the case and it would tell me the next time I see the watch that basically what I did I made no attempt at keeping track of customers because we had literally thousands of them I think they sold 30,000 of these watches and they would come back by the hundreds because they had a lifetime warranty. Yes that's a story all of itself but I would put a code number that would reference what was done to the watch the last time and think I had a date in there somehow so it did tell a story if you knew the code. Another shop I once worked out the number would reference the page in the book. So other than knowing we had been in there you would have no idea what happened because you have to go look at the page in the book to see what happened. Then the problem of how you examine a watch you should examine the watch in detail every single time to avoid complications. Although on vintage watches and this is a of amusement I have at work when people ask something and I say of the watches done when it leaves. This is because on vintage oftentimes problems won't show up until the watches much farther into the repair like it's now running and you discover things that you can't discover before because it wasn't running to discover them that also become sometimes difficult to have exact rigid prices are estimates of repairs or in the case of a pocket watch you may not find out if a casing problem to later on when you case it up in the watches running. I was just thinking for all those people that would like to leave a mark maybe you should learn to do what some of the past watchmakers did? Leave a mark but leave it in such a way that no one will ever find it? Typically not done for repair purposes but done for other reasons like identifying it's legit. I have a friend with a Gruen watch and one of the Roman numbers the bottom line that just looks like a line under extreme magnification actually says Gruen watch company or something equivalent. So here's a link showing how to mark your watch without being seen although that's not the actual title. So if you can learn micro engraving you can engrave the watch someplace probably just about any place you just have to remember where you put it. https://cnaluxury.channelnewsasia.com/obsessions/how-to-prove-if-watches-are-authentic-secret-signatures-182516  
    • I have acquired a Citizen Leopard 36000 watch. My reason for purchasing it was my desire to own a timepiece with a 36,000 BPH movement, and the price was reasonable. Another motivating factor was gaining hands-on experience with the mechanism. The watch is in good condition, but I intend to fully disassemble it for maintenance. First and foremost, if anyone has prior experience with this particular model, I would greatly appreciate their insights. I do not have access to Citizen’s specialized lubricants and will need to use the ones available to me, such as 9010, 8000, and 8300 grease. Additionally, I do not possess the appropriate oil for the pallet jewels and will only be able to clean them.
×
×
  • Create New...