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HAC mantle clock question

MKC

By MKC
in All Things Clocks

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MKC Member

MKC

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Hi!

A lovely HAC clock came my way and it runs and strikes and was fine at first, but then started fall behind and suddenly the minute hand literally fell backwards, completely loose. When I took the movement out of the case there seems to be an issue with the hour and minute wheel. In front of the minute wheel there is a washer that appears to be there to keep the wheel it place and together in the lantern pinion of the hour wheel. This washer is held in place with a taper pin. However, this washer has so much slack/movement away from the minute wheel that it allows the minute wheel push off the lantern pinion of the hour wheel (not sure if that is the right terminology) and that makes the hour wheel fall off the gears as well. This causes both the hour and minute wheel to spin freely and I am assuming that this is why the minute hand literally fell when I must have just tilted the clock a bit. Only a small movement makes the gears slip out of place. What should I do to make the wheels stay in their positions? Sorry if this is a totally stupid question, I am a complete novice to mechanical clocks. Im new to the forum. I'll add an image of the problem area too if I can figure out how. Thanks for any suggestions!

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MKC

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5 hours ago, oldhippy said:

There looks to be a lot of space between the washer and pin. Try a thicker washer. 

Great! I will try that! Are there standard washers only to be used in clocks or can I just try to find find something at the local hardware shop? Should the space between the pin and washer be completely snug?

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9 hours ago, oldhippy said:

There looks to be a lot of space between the washer and pin. Try a thicker washer. 

Alas. It would have been too easy if adding two washers would have solved the problem. The gears are now staying in place now, but there is definitely still not enough friction somewhere because the minute hand cant climb up but flops down around 8 on the dial. Is it the minute hand arbor that probably has the issue then? And what would I look for? Thank you so much for your patience and help!

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10 hours ago, oldhippy said:

There looks to be a lot of space between the washer and pin. Try a thicker washer. 

Ok, so I have now gathered that there is a spring on the left side of the hour wheel and that looks bent somehow out of shape. It also gets stuck at 4 o'clock and 10 o'clock when the minute hand is moved and when the hand is moved it clicks like it is in the wrong place. Between 6 and 9 on the dial the minute hand has no hold at all but flops down. What is the correct shape this spring needs? It seems to be underneath the brass colored lever near the hour wheel and that is point in which it "sticks" when the minute hand is moved. How should that spring be positioned? Can those springs be bent back to correct shape? The first image shows the spring area where the spring looks wrong when compared to the one spring that is higher and seems to bent to a correct angle. The second image points the area where the spring is getting stuck at the brass lever. Sorry for the long ramble, I have no idea of the right terminology 😞

HAC clock3.jpg

HAC clock4.jpg

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1 hour ago, watchweasol said:

Hi.  I will have a look at my clocks as it’s late  and check on the spring,  most clocks have different ways of doing the same thing so it needs a clear look at, 

Thank you very much! I could not find any images or anything on this online so I really appreciate any help. No rush! 🙂

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oldhippy Distinguished Member

oldhippy

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That spring should be on the top of the lever and on the bottom of it. It acts to give a spring effect so the lever doesn't get stuck when lifting. As far as I can remember as its a long time ago that I retired from watch and clock making.  

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watchweasol Distinguished Member

watchweasol

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Hi the lifting piece is operated by the canon cam, as yours is a two train it’s lifted directly and initiates the sequence,the clock goes into warning and the strike is released when the lifting piece drops. The spring holds the lifting piece downwards and is compressed as the canon cam lobe lifts it. Once the operation is complete the spring returns the lifting piece to its starting position  untill the next sequence.

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6 hours ago, watchweasol said:

Hi the lifting piece is operated by the canon cam, as yours is a two train it’s lifted directly and initiates the sequence,the clock goes into warning and the strike is released when the lifting piece drops. The spring holds the lifting piece downwards and is compressed as the canon cam lobe lifts it. Once the operation is complete the spring returns the lifting piece to its starting position  untill the next sequence.

That makes total sense, thank you! Should the top spring then go over the top lever? It is now just sitting on the side of the top lever, idle it seems

9 hours ago, oldhippy said:

That spring should be on the top of the lever and on the bottom of it. It acts to give a spring effect so the lever doesn't get stuck when lifting. As far as I can remember as its a long time ago that I retired from watch and clock making.  

That makes sense, thank you very much!

8 hours ago, RichardHarris123 said:

I know next to nothing about clocks but should the spring go over the stud?

Screenshot_20240216_085551_Chrome.jpg

That would seem like a logical thing! Thank you!

7 hours ago, watchweasol said:

Hi the lifting piece is operated by the canon cam, as yours is a two train it’s lifted directly and initiates the sequence,the clock goes into warning and the strike is released when the lifting piece drops. The spring holds the lifting piece downwards and is compressed as the canon cam lobe lifts it. Once the operation is complete the spring returns the lifting piece to its starting position  untill the next sequence.

And also, does one just twist the spring to position it on top of the lever or how is that done?

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oldhippy Distinguished Member

oldhippy

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Be very careful you do not want to break it. From the picture I would say you just need to lift it up and put it on the lever, if it's one sided then just bend it slightly so it is in the middle. 

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MKC

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48 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

Be very careful you do not want to break it. From the picture I would say you just need to lift it up and put it on the lever, if it's one sided then just bend it slightly so it is.

Great! Thank you! I will try that 🙂

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