Anyone familiar with this staking set?

[gpraceman]

I have been looking for a staking set and found this one from a retiring watchmaker.  He says the only markings on the staking tool itself is Pat. 1911.  The case latch says Eagle Lock, Terryville, CT.

Looks a bit unusual, with the two staking positions.  Not sure of the advantage of that.

He indicates that one of the knobs will rotate the table and the other will lock it down.

I hadn't seen one like it in my browsing around online.

He indicates that it is the best staking set that he has used.  He's asking $425 for all of this.  That's rather more than I was wanting to spend, but I thought that I'd get some feedback on this to see if it is something that I should grab or to just keep looking.

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, gpraceman said:

I have been looking for a staking set and found this one from a retiring watchmaker.  He says the only markings on the staking tool itself is Pat. 1911.  The case latch says Eagle Lock, Terryville, CT.

Looks a bit unusual, with the two staking positions.  Not sure of the advantage of that.

He indicates that one of the knobs will rotate the table and the other will lock it down.

I hadn't seen one like it in my browsing around online.

He indicates that it is the best staking set that he has used.  He's asking $425 for all of this.  That's rather more than I was wanting to spend, but I thought that I'd get some feedback on this to see if it is something that I should grab or to just keep looking.

Thats a nice set , with a few extra bits and bobs. Looks to me like a Marshall.  The extra height allows you to use the stakes from underneath.  

[JohnR725]

2 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

with a few extra bits and bobs

Yes the interesting bits and pieces. I wonder if they were thrown in there or whether they came with them not originally but whether the watchmaker who previously used it used these items?

Two relatively modern Swiss type roller revolvers. One vintage pocket watch type remover and one balance staff remover. Oh and all of those are missing their punches hopefully in the package there is the punch for the staff remover otherwise it's in the assortment someplace if you're lucky. For the roller remover the punches are usually really short that go in the base therein there would be three of them in the middle.

Then there's the interesting brass thing we need better pictures of that. Definitely looks vintage and not sure exactly what it is

Interesting that you have two punches simultaneous staff removal? Plus there's two knobs on the base are they independent of each other or is it just one knob?

Then anything interesting looking assortment of the punches in the base from staking set. Looks like you have some cylinder tools but if you're in your right mind to just leave them where they are because nobody in the right mind should work on cylinder watches but it does look like you have those and a quick look I don't see the punch for the staff knockout tool it does look like in the package should be the instructions for the staff knockout tools you can see what the punch looks like.

[gpraceman]

22 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

Yes the interesting bits and pieces. I wonder if they were thrown in there or whether they came with them not originally but whether the watchmaker who previously used it used these items?

Two relatively modern Swiss type roller revolvers. One vintage pocket watch type remover and one balance staff remover. Oh and all of those are missing their punches hopefully in the package there is the punch for the staff remover otherwise it's in the assortment someplace if you're lucky. For the roller remover the punches are usually really short that go in the base therein there would be three of them in the middle.

Then there's the interesting brass thing we need better pictures of that. Definitely looks vintage and not sure exactly what it is

Interesting that you have two punches simultaneous staff removal? Plus there's two knobs on the base are they independent of each other or is it just one knob?

Then anything interesting looking assortment of the punches in the base from staking set. Looks like you have some cylinder tools but if you're in your right mind to just leave them where they are because nobody in the right mind should work on cylinder watches but it does look like you have those and a quick look I don't see the punch for the staff knockout tool it does look like in the package should be the instructions for the staff knockout tools you can see what the punch looks like.

The way he descried the knobs was that one turns the die plate to the desired hole and the other locks it in place.

Good observation on the stakes for the balance staff remover.  Maybe in the plastic bag? 

The stakes seem rather on the short side.  Looking that the top row, they don't seem to be into much wood and don't stick as far out of the wood as I would think.

Not sure what some of those accessories are, like the brass tool, the gray tool with the clips on it, nor what the red knob handle goes to.

[JohnR725]

This is interesting? Normally the editor if I accidentally close a window keeps my text this time I kept the images but did not keep the text so I will start again quite annoying

Let's start with the miscellaneous stuff this is your standard modern type war remover usually doesn't work for pocket watches

Here's the balance staff knock out tool we do not get a picture of the punch though I'll go back and look carefully at the staking set see if I see it looking it might be in the Ziploc with the instructions which are the yellow thing

As you can see especially remember this if you're purchasing them they come in different heights and you can unscrew the top part like it shows the image of using it to put pressure on the balance staff that silly and docket out depending upon things and how you feel about this you may not hopefully damaged the balance on. I had to put the disclaimer and there can somebody will come along and tell me what a horrible tool it is it does work but you have to be careful like everything in watch repair but if you are purchasing one you want to be careful you get the right size because we get the really short while you're sticking cents big enough it might not do its thing of

Oh and then I believe there's different diameters  there's a reference to B. In other words the hole diameter that goes over the balance pivots one is slightly bigger than the other and the punch that goes through the center has to be sized right.

Then because I'm sniffing images out of a lecture I think I'll just expand things a little bit give you some bonus things like here is what are your roller movers but there's a image of a whole bunch of other stuff also

No notice for yours it only shows one punch there are three of them the diameter is small it will not be mistaken for a regular staking set punch. But I've was a box of miscellaneous stuff somebody probably would have zero idea what it is for there's also that problem. Plus there's the other problem at least with mine all of the ends are broken so usually I have to use a staking set punch anyway

Here's an example of the truly use this is a Hamilton 992B. It say to peace roller table the roller table and safety are separate which can present a challenge for removing because first you have to remove the lower one and you can't actually remove it because the safety roller is preventing that that's where this tool becomes really handy for doing this is enough depth to get everything off

Okay I will make a guess this may be for Re-pivoting. If so it's missing a lot of bits and pieces otherwise it might have some other purpose we really need to see it up close and looked up the bits and pieces that you do have.

Still not seeing the punch for staff knockout we really need a sideways view. Visits hard to see stuff looking straight down plus it's really very misleading. Because to me the punches look like they're all smaller in diameter than what is in the staking set itself. I'm assuming that's an optical illusion

 

 

 

 

5 hours ago, gpraceman said:

Eagle Lock, Terryville, CT

Not very helpful but it is a famous company and its history can be found here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Lock_Company

I suspect they just purchased the lock for their box.

 

[rehajm]

That seems a very fair price for everything offered and in that condition. Resale of some of the kit after you learn what you use and ehat you don't will offset the upfront, too...

Edited September 16, 2023 by rehajm

[gpraceman]

7 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

Here's an example of the truly use this is a Hamilton 992B. It say to peace roller table the roller table and safety are separate which can present a challenge for removing because first you have to remove the lower one and you can't actually remove it because the safety roller is preventing that that's where this tool becomes really handy for doing this is enough depth to get everything off

Okay I will make a guess this may be for Re-pivoting. If so it's missing a lot of bits and pieces otherwise it might have some other purpose we really need to see it up close and looked up the bits and pieces that you do have.

Not very helpful but it is a famous company and its history can be found here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Lock_Company

I suspect they just purchased the lock for their box.

 

Thanks for the pics.  I wouldn't have guessed that the grey tool with the metal clips was a roller table remover.  I had seen that other style.

The brass tool is still a mystery.  I asked the seller on that, but hadn't received a response as of yet.

The lock may mean that the staking set is from an American company, but it just may have been something added later.  I did see a K&D set with an Eagle Lock, but I don't think that this set is from K&D.

[watchweasol]

Hi judging by the pictures and what’s on offer for the price, grab it. Condition looks good and the fact you can look at it in person makes all the difference, GO FOR IT.

[gpraceman]

This set just popped up on eBay.  https://www.ebay.com/itm/374934434329

It doesn't clarify too much, other than the stakes are really short.  There's got to be some type of holder for the stakes.  Maybe it's that brass topped rod (which is not in that eBay listing).

Just now, watchweasol said:

Hi judging by the pictures and what’s on offer for the price, grab it. Condition looks good and the fact you can look at it in person makes all the difference, GO FOR IT.

Well, he's a few states away from me, so I'm just going by his description and photos.

[JohnR725]

56 minutes ago, gpraceman said:

The brass tool is still a mystery.  I asked the seller on that, but hadn't received a response as of yet

The brass tool is interesting because there's a variety of things that it could possibly be but I still have a suspicion of what it is. Taking a quick search online gives me this discussion and notice the similarities

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/4474-look-at-that-a-new-toy-diy-pivot-drill/

28 minutes ago, gpraceman said:

It doesn't clarify too much, other than the stakes are really short.  There's got to be some type of holder for the stakes.  Maybe it's that brass topped rod (which is not in that eBay listing).

Okay that also explains my thought that the punches themselves seem like that too small in diameter. I decided it was an optical illusion but maybe it's not maybe they do well obviously they do because are too short. It's still those interesting staking set I have a sizable book on watch tools and what I get a chance much later today a look and see if we can find this is definitely unique enough that it should show up somewhere on the planet perhaps. There is the other unfortunate problem of watch repair having lots and lots and lots of tools and a lot of room have basically just slid under the radar because they just didn't make a big quantity of them.

 

[watchweasol]

Hi when you add up what he is offering  it’s good.  The brass tool is a pivoting tool, a K&D balance staff remover, a multitude of good stakes , punches and roller removers x 2  value wise it’s good.

[gpraceman]

7 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

The brass tool is interesting because there's a variety of things that it could possibly be but I still have a suspicion of what it is. Taking a quick search online gives me this discussion and notice the similarities

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/4474-look-at-that-a-new-toy-diy-pivot-drill/

Okay that also explains my thought that the punches themselves seem like that too small in diameter. I decided it was an optical illusion but maybe it's not maybe they do well obviously they do because are too short. It's still those interesting staking set I have a sizable book on watch tools and what I get a chance much later today a look and see if we can find this is definitely unique enough that it should show up somewhere on the planet perhaps. There is the other unfortunate problem of watch repair having lots and lots and lots of tools and a lot of room have basically just slid under the radar because they just didn't make a big quantity of them.

 

Got a reply back from the seller.  There is a holder for those small stakes.  That's an interesting setup.  It would be hard to find any replacement stakes, it would seem, if needed.  Though, they are 4.7mm in diameter, so K&D stakes would be compatible.  He does have a couple of regular stakes with the set, marked 7E and 9F.

The frame has a couple of patent dates on one of the knobs.  A patent search on those dates didn't turn up anything.  Maybe not US patents.

He says he used the brass tool for poising.

He's not sure about the red knob crank, other than it came with the set.  The eBay listing on that other set also has that same crank, so it has something to do with that set.

[JohnR725]

I have a rather interesting book of horological tools unfortunately it seems to have a rather interesting price on Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/Horological-Shop-Tools-1700-1900/dp/0960488804

With literally hundreds and hundreds of pages in the staking set section I didn't see what is looking for. But that's also because of the hundreds and hundreds of pages they have catalog pages scattered through the book there is more than one section of staking sets even though there is just a staking set section about all I really find out is a staking set is relatively modern. It looks like the earliest reference of when it was invented was 1870 and it doesn't start appearing in catalog some books and to at least 1885.