ETA 2472 low amplitude - impulse jewel fouling pallet horn?

[JohnR725]

8 hours ago, fellerts said:

experiments

I like experiments for instance I currently have a 6497 that a lubricated the entire geartrain with HP 1300 and it actually runs quite decently. Then I use my usual 9020 on the balance pivots and if memory serves me the watch actually runs very nice.

I have seen were Omega recommends the HP oil on the balance pivots if you have too much amplitude. Then of course there is the other thing try the D5 on the pallet fork pivots you should get a decrease their.

Although you will find probably since the beginning of time and watch repair going to a weaker mainspring is preferred. I know the Elgin watch company had weaker mainsprings at one time. Rolex has weaker mainsprings so apparently it's somewhat common you can have your problem and a weaker mainspring would solve the problem.

Oh and if you really want to have fun go for a grease in the pivots if you somehow get it in their. In a classroom situation once I was trying to figure out why one of the watches was acting very bizarre and finally concluded that in the documentation there were places where it said use a grease or D5 and I think the student decided that every place it D5 appeared they could use a grease and they may have conceivably grease the entire watch. So you start using something super heavy in the pivots they will basically simulate what happens if the lubrication all those bad with time of the watch will barely run at all.

But experiments are good just to see what happens like D5 on the pallet fork pivots try that.

 

[fellerts]

On 1/14/2023 at 9:53 PM, JohnR725 said:

Oh and if you really want to have fun go for a grease in the pivots if you somehow get it in their. In a classroom situation once I was trying to figure out why one of the watches was acting very bizarre and finally concluded that in the documentation there were places where it said use a grease or D5 and I think the student decided that every place it D5 appeared they could use a grease and they may have conceivably grease the entire watch. So you start using something super heavy in the pivots they will basically simulate what happens if the lubrication all those bad with time of the watch will barely run at all.

But experiments are good just to see what happens like D5 on the pallet fork pivots try that.

Indeed John, thanks for sharing your knowledge! I did try D5 on the pallet fork pivots, and my quick test suggests that you'll lose around 30 degrees of amplitude compared to using no oil. That's even more significant than using D5 instead of 9010 on the balance endstones in my particular case. I let the movement run for a couple days in my drawer and found that yet another 10 degrees had gone astray at the end of it.

On 1/14/2023 at 5:14 PM, Klassiker said:

That is in the horizontal positions, isn't it? As I recall, you were getting around 90 degrees less in the verticals, which is a big difference. How is that affecting your positional rate variation at full wind and after a night "at rest"? Are you happy with the timing performance on your wrist?

I think the sweet spot for the movement in its current condition is D5 on the whole train + balance, pallet fork pivots dry. I've re-cleaned and done so, and I'll check back in a couple days. Luckily I'm doing this for fun so I've got all the time in the world to get this right, or if I can't, I'll learn a bunch! I'll re-test all positions when the movement has calmed down after today's adventure.

Come to think of it, at some point I should disassemble, clean, assemble and oil a movement several times to ensure that I get the same results every time. If not, my methods need revising.

[Klassiker]

16 minutes ago, fellerts said:

I should disassemble, clean, assemble and oil a movement several times to ensure that I get the same results every time.

That would be a very good test, and I fear my own technique would not stand up to it. I will have to do the same!

[Nucejoe]

On 1/6/2023 at 2:04 PM, VWatchie said:

 

So, joe, do you usually oil the impulse jewel or is it just an idea that you have? What kind of experience do you have?

Apology for my late response. 

As the fault was nearly located to be in the fork horn area ( rough surface where impulse jewel engages with ) .

Oiling the horn would expectedly reduce friction on the rough surface. 

As for my experience, my late friend( watch repairman) gave me a bit of compound he had, to polish parts with, have polished fork horn with it and gained amplitude. 

Best wishes WW. 

Will you give me the link to your weblog or site, please.

Just now, Nucejoe said:

Apology for my late response. 

As the fault was nearly located to be in the fork horn area ( rough surface where impulse jewel engages with ) .

Oiling the horn would expectedly reduce friction on the rough surface. 

As for my experience, my late friend( watch repairman) gave me a bit of compound he had, to polish parts with, have polished fork horn with it and gained amplitude. 

Best wishes WW. 

Will you give me the link to your weblog or site, please.

Correcrion VW .