Waltham desk clock disassembly method?

[LittleWatchShop]

Here is a clock from my inheritance.  It still has the customer ticket attached and it appears to have been from the very early days of my dad's business.

It is ticking, but not keeping good time.  I want to service it but am confounded by its construction.

Hoping maybe someone has seen this before and can offer advice on taking it apart.  I dont want to break it through experimentation.

The winding key also functions as the setting key...like a watch, so that means the long stem is mechanically attached to the watch and there is no detent or screw visible to release it.

The sight hole exposes the regulator, so it is not associated with disassembly.

I show front view, bottom view, and back view.

[watchweasol]

Hi First one I have seen looks like a big pocket watch. The peripheral screws on the cover look like the entry point to release the back cover .

[LittleWatchShop]

25 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

Hi First one I have seen looks like a big pocket watch. The peripheral screws on the cover look like the entry point to release the back cover .

First removing the hardware on the bottom as shown.  Then removing the two screws that hold the dial plate (two screws are missing), the whole mechanism should slip out.

That still leaves the issue of removing the stem. 

I am moving slowly so as not to mess this up.

[watchweasol]

Hi LWS  a commonsense approach for sure,  small teps and document what you do just to remond you on re assembly.    good luck

[oldhippy]

To me this looks like a hand made put together movement and case. Unscrew this section and you should be able to remove movement from case. Remove hands and see if the movement is held to the dial by a center screw. 

[LittleWatchShop]

3 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

To me this looks like a hand made put together movement and case. Unscrew this section and you should be able to remove movement from case. Remove hands and see if the movement is held to the dial by a center screw. 

I have found this clock on the web, so it is not a one off. 

You suggestion is my current plan. It is running fine but I am dying to see inside

[JohnR725]

llooks like a weird version of a  Waltham  car clock.  Now is the car clock the back would unscrew off the movement but I can't quite tell from the pictures whether that's going to be true or not..

iif it's the car clock it's just a  really big pocket watch.  A very large pocket watch that I'm not a fan of..  But if it is the car clock you should be able to remove the stem that should come out like a standard pocket watch them.. In the movement comes out however it's mounted and then  you can see how it comes out of the case..

 

[LittleWatchShop]

32 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

that's going to be true or not..

No, because, even though there are three screws that release the cover from the dial, the stem goes through a hole and there is no way for the cover to removed before removing the stem.

The stem locks in two positions...just like a wristwatch, so there is something engaged with the stem so that the movement is not going to just slide away (like on some, or perhaps most, pocket watches).  I just feel like something has to release the stem from the movement.

[LittleWatchShop]

Finally got back to this today.  So trivial.  I just removed those nuts at the bottom and the whole stem assembly slides out.  LOL.

Here is the movement.  I am printing a movement holder for it so that I can work on it today.

On 7/7/2022 at 6:54 AM, LittleWatchShop said:

The stem locks in two positions...just like a wristwatch, so there is something engaged with the stem so that the movement is not going to just slide away (like on some, or perhaps most, pocket watches).  I just feel like something has to release the stem from the movement.

As it turns out, the stem just slides out.  No stem-release required.

[oldhippy]

Look out for wear in the trains pivot holes as its not jeweled and the pivots too for roughness.  

[LittleWatchShop]

Big difference working on this compared to the hamilton ladies watch I fixed the other day.

[JohnR725]

4 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Look out for wear in the trains pivot holes as its not jeweled and the pivots too for roughness. 

you have to be careful with this watch because as pointed out it is basically a seven jewel movement. Then it has two really huge mainsprings driving a intermediate wheel and then that drives the center wheel. it basically is a very peculiar watch but despite all that power the seven jewel version can definitely have running issues.

[LittleWatchShop]

13 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

you have to be careful with this watch because as pointed out it is basically a seven jewel movement. Then it has two really huge mainsprings driving a intermediate wheel and then that drives the center wheel. it basically is a very peculiar watch but despite all that power the seven jewel version can definitely have running issues.

Yeah, those mainsprings, have not figured out how they work together, but I haven't tried to analyze it yet. A new adventure! I love this stuff

[LittleWatchShop]

Oh yeah, I see.  The two mainsprings are running in parallel.  Interesting.  I guess this was somehow better than one larger, more powerful, mainspring.

This movement has no jewels.

---------

I think the first time I took power off, one of the wheels (not pivot) got bent a little.  I have corrected it for the most part. 

There is no easy way to take power off on this movement.  The click is hidden, and because the two springs are in parallel and not equal, there can be tension on one and not the other.

Edited October 8, 2022 by LittleWatchShop

[JohnR725]

6 hours ago, LittleWatchShop said:

The two mainsprings are running in parallel.  Interesting.  I guess this was somehow better than one larger, more powerful, mainspring.

This movement has no jewels.

I have a friend who clicks military timepieces so I ended up working on the occasionally and to be honest I absolutely despise us. They're basically to deck watches over very common and that's the one by Hamilton which has a really big mainspring it's about 3 feet long and then there's Waltham and one big mainspring like Hamilton has so much better than this arrangement. but for Waltham it's a popular design they were found in car clocks military timepieces your clock they made a law to use of these.

then there is no jewels on the gear train but there is the standard seven jewels.

 

[LittleWatchShop]

OK, it is done and on the shelf below the goofy digital clock

[oldhippy]

So it just needed a service. Now to check for good timekeeping.