Workshop tools requirements for watch group certification

[Jjver]

Hi all,

I was wondering if somewhere on the world wide web there are documents floating with all the required tools for starting up a certification process with a big watch brand like Swatch Group or Richemont. A smaller more independent brand would also be nice.

 

I'm talking about all the required tools that are generic. Like screwdrivers from Bergeon, full Horia Set, Steiner/Horia Jacot, etc. Not yet the brand specified tools they require you to buy (dependant on subbrand/models you would like to service).

 

Thanks in advance!

[AndyGSi]

I've never looked into this but I'd expect the first port of call would be Certification as a watch repairer rather than tools.

I'd also expect during the training you'd have to pick up all the tools required as a matter of course.

[watchweasol]

Hi.  I think that as an independent watch repair agent wanting to get certification from a manufacturer you would need to have a decent workshop and be open to inspection from the manufacturer . not to mention training on the manufacturers product should you pass the inspection stage.  A comprehensive set of tools to cover all cases not necessarily Bergeron but not rubbish either. There will probably several more hoops to jump through like membership of the BHI OR SOME OTHER BODY as proof of your competence in watch repair.  All in all quite an undertaking and most likley not a cheap one.  Good luck.

[Jjver]

On the one hand I'm just interested ln what these brands require from an independent watch repairer.

 

On the other hand I want to anticipate when buying my current tools, that they are future proof. The correct quality and the correct type. I like to know in advance what to look out for, knowing a certain tool is required.

[Neverenoughwatches]

Approaching a brand that you are interested in working for might be a good place to start. I'm in a similar position with the next step in my career. Finding out what an employer or contractor actually expects you to be capable of and wants from you shows initiative that you are keen to work for them. If its a big brand then you're going to need to be good at what you do, really good and prove that you can run a workshop and business professionally. No big brand such as Swatch is going to associate themselves with anything but very competent watchmakers with a fully kitted out workshop. So at that kind of level I would have expected you to already own a decent setup with most of the best tools money can buy and not just generic tools. And as WW quite rightly mentions good level qualifications will be required and plenty of hoops to jump through. So I'm kind of confused by this question and guessing you are a long way off from this. Doesn’t hurt to aim for something in life as long as we remain realistic about what we want to achieve. 

[Jjver]

Like I said I'm not asking this to be certified now. I'm just interested what are the prerequisites for a brand like Swatch group regarding the workshop. A lot is probably under NDA, but it's always possible certain documents found their way to the internet in the past (maybe not up-to-date anymore).

 

PS: I think I'm already close to being fully complete regarding tools which can't be bought unless from the brand itself. A personal lathe is still on the planning for the coming year. But I don't have an idea if there are specific requirements for a watchmaker lathe for example. I would find this interesting to learn.

[Jjver]

Just learned you don't need to know how to use a lathe for certification with all the watch brands. Thought they would have followed Wostep.

[oldhippy]

Where I worked we were servicing agents for Longines we also sold them. They supplied all the service manuals. They wanted to know if you were a qualified watchmaker. You had to supply your own tools. I don't think any are going to say you must use these particular tools, you might have to buy different movement holders which some movements require. If you went and worked for a top watch manufacturers say Rolex they provide you with everything.  

[nickelsilver]

1 hour ago, Jjver said:

Just learned you don't need to know how to use a lathe for certification with all the watch brands. Thought they would have followed Wostep.

The industry, who fund WOSTEP, pushed for many years for them to reduce or eliminate a lot of the "making" part of the curriculum. As a result, they offer two levels of watchmaker training now, one where you just work on watches, and another where you still do some lathe work (and filing and so forth), though less than in years past.

 

I don't know the specifics of what Swatch wants equipment-wise to get approved for a parts account, but they are less concerned with what brand of screwdrivers you have, and more concerned that you have a proper cleaning machine, waterproof tester, timing machine, that kind of stuff. No, a 45 year old manual Elma isn't going to cut it for cleaning, nor is an old pump-type wet tester. Maybe they accept some of the Chinese timing machines?- but I think they want you to be able to print out results over x-number of positions. You can even get approved for Omega, but they want you to have some rather expensive Omega specific tools in particular for case work.

 

This is going back over 20 years when Rolex still allowed parts accounts for independent watchmakers- but one of the requirements was a decent Jacot tool. Which is odd, as they definitely don't want you touching up pivots, they want you to replace parts. But at one time you had to have a good Jacot to buy parts from them. No longer an issue, nobody outside of certain dealers can get parts anymore.

[Jjver]

Thanks for all the information!

Everything I own is Bergeon/Horotec/Horia/Elma. But the cleaner and waterpressure tester are indeed not the newest. Haha. Only the Elma Ultrasonic is brand new, but the least important compared to the other stuff.

[RichardHarris123]

36 minutes ago, nickelsilver said:

Which is odd, as they definitely don't want you touching up pivots, they want you to replace parts. But at one time you had to have a good Jacot to buy parts from them.

How bizarre. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

3 hours ago, Jjver said:

: I think I'm already close to being fully complete regarding tools which can't be bought unless from the brand itself. A personal lathe is still on the planning for the coming year. But I don't have an idea if there are specific requirements for a watchmaker lathe for example. 

You are already close to fully complete for tools which can't be bought unless from the brand watch maker ? Now I am confused, are you already in contact with a watch brand ? 

[Jjver]

9 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

You are already close to fully complete for tools which can't be bought unless from the brand watch maker ? Now I am confused, are you already in contact with a watch brand ? 

I mean the tools which aren't being sold by for example Swatch for repairing a specific Omega model. With generic tools I meant everything from Bergeon/Horotec/Horia which can be bought by the general public (on CousinsUK etc.).

[Neverenoughwatches]

2 hours ago, Jjver said:

I mean the tools which aren't being sold by for example Swatch for repairing a specific Omega model. With generic tools I meant everything from Bergeon/Horotec/Horia which can be bought by the general public (on CousinsUK etc.).

Its nice to have good quality over the whole range of tools used frequently as well as some specialist equipment. This was an accepted indication of a tradesman's standards on site, a look in his toolbox to weight up his kit. It didn’t always say all that there is to know about him, a good tradesman can make great use of lower quality tools as there are also guys with all the gear, but no idea. I hope all goes well for you seem to have things in hand and ready with your planning.

[nickelsilver]

10 hours ago, Jjver said:

I mean the tools which aren't being sold by for example Swatch for repairing a specific Omega model. With generic tools I meant everything from Bergeon/Horotec/Horia which can be bought by the general public (on CousinsUK etc.).

I'm guessing this means aside from a couple of movement holders, some screwdrivers, tweezers, staking and jeweling tool. For a lot of people the latter two are the "big two". There's _a lot_ of other tools involved. Way outside of a lathe much less Jacot, but some folks use both of those almost (or certainly) daily.

[Jjver]

Yes, there is so much more than the already known essential tools. I'm interested in the little stuff from Epilame bottles, through cyclomats and so much more.

I have for example probably dozens of tools related to balance/hairspring reparation and manipulation. But I wonder if a lot of these are even requested when setting up a workshop because the brands probably just ask you to replace them all with official spare parts.

[Neverenoughwatches]

30 minutes ago, Jjver said:

Yes, there is so much more than the already known essential tools. I'm interested in the little stuff from Epilame bottles, through cyclomats and so much more.

I have for example probably dozens of tools related to balance/hairspring reparation and manipulation. But I wonder if a lot of these are even requested when setting up a workshop because the brands probably just ask you to replace them all with official spare parts.

In your position, which if it were 20 years ago for me, I wouldn't settle for the minimum requirements a  manufacturing brand would want from me. My aim if watchmaking was to be my profession would be wanting to be very good at what I did and own a workshop that enabled me to perform as much restoration as possible. A lathe and milling machine would be early important investments, which meant i could do a lot more including tool making...ohhhhh tool making....to make tools...hmmmmmmmm.....tooooooooolls.

[watchweasol]

akea cold shower.