Mainspring winders at an unbelievable price

[Paul80]

Always on the lookout for low cost watch repair tools I stumbled across this listing

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004628144533.html?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_allProduct.8148356.71.174f4787pUZBWU&pdp_npi=2%40dis!GBP!￡36.29!￡36.29!￡36.29!!!!%402100bde716700878353065703e5863!12000029892500559!sh

A set of 10 mainspring winders with steel arbours for a mere £36.29 plus VAT and shipping, these have to be the cheapest set around, anyone tempted  

[HectorLooi]

Thank you. After you. 

[lexacat]

Haha yeah I bought em. I've never had ms winders before so have nothing to compare them to. I'll update when they turn up and I get the chance to use them. 

[spectre6000]

Since you've already volunteered to be the guinea pig... Let us know how they shape up. Very interested.

[aac58]

I recently watched this video about that same winder set. It's really affordable and looks quite good, if only I had the information about the diameter and wind direction of those units...

 

 

[dadistic]

They are for specific calibers, the listing says -

3135/2892/2824/7750/2671/2000/8500-1/8500-2/C07111/2235/8200

So, for instance, ETA 2892, 2824, 7750, Miyota 8200, etc. 

If you wanted to you could probably look up the specs for each movement to get the barrel ID,  and the wind direction. 

[lexacat]

Welp, I got the cheap set in the mail this week, and I also got 4 spare seiko 7009a movements for parts, so a good time to break some more mainsprings.

They aren't bi-directional although I initially thought they were.

As said above, they're definitely made for specific calibers, and the closest I could find for the 7009a barrel was the miyota 8200 set, which is honestly probably too small. There's another set where the winding barrel sat exactly on the mainspring barrel, not inside it, that might have worked, but it seemed like a recipe for disaster.

That said, I managed to obliterate one mainspring through my own inexperience and testing/practising. But the next mainspring I happily got wound up and back into the barrel.

Good enough for a hobbyist I'd say.

Edited December 11, 2022 by lexacat

[Kalanag]

Here the dimensions of the Chinese winders can be found:

https://bhi.co.uk/resources/mainspringwindersjustinkoullapis/

[Paul80]

The 8200 set works fine for the 7009, it's smaller but not too small.

[Chrismin]

Hi all, newbie here.

Could someone who has a set of "value" mainspring winders make a list of diameters and winding directions. Looking at the supplied handles, they all look like RH wind but some of the movements listed would require LH winders.

I work mainly on old Swiss movements as a hobby. I need to decide whether to buy a starter set or 2 or 3 individual Bergeon sizes  in RH and add as I go along. 

Thanks all.

[thor447]

I went with the individual Bergeon components.  1 handle (works for both LH & RH), 1 winder per size (works for both LH & RH), and individual LH and RH arbors for sizes as needed.

The arbors are really the only thing that is truly LH and RH.  The winders and handles can work for either direction.  I've found that 95% of the watches I've worked on thus far (not too many but a good amount for a hobbyist) have all worked with either a 5, 6, or 7 size.  There are a few oddballs along the way where it required a certain size winder, but the arbor was either too big or too small, so I wound those by hand.  For the most part, I find getting individual components to be a much more affordable way of getting good winders without spending the outrageous amount of money it would require for a full set, of which I'm guessing several would never get used by a hobbyist.

[JohnFrum]

1 hour ago, Chrismin said:

Hi all, newbie here.

Could someone who has a set of "value" mainspring winders make a list of diameters and winding directions. Looking at the supplied handles, they all look like RH wind but some of the movements listed would require LH winders.

I work mainly on old Swiss movements as a hobby. I need to decide whether to buy a starter set or 2 or 3 individual Bergeon sizes  in RH and add as I go along. 

Thanks all.

See the section in grey

https://bhi.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/HJ-Mainspring-Winders.pdf

[Chrismin]

Thanks Thor.

That was my thinking. I have checked all the watches that I have currently to work on and sizes 5,6 & 7 would cover them all.

[Chrismin]

On 12/11/2022 at 9:42 AM, lexacat said:

Welp, I got the cheap set in the mail this week, and I also got 4 spare seiko 7009a movements for parts, so a good time to break some more mainsprings.

They aren't bi-directional although I initially thought they were.

As said above, they're definitely made for specific calibers, and the closest I could find for the 7009a barrel was the miyota 8200 set, which is honestly probably too small. There's another set where the winding barrel sat exactly on the mainspring barrel, not inside it, that might have worked, but it seemed like a recipe for disaster.

That said, I managed to obliterate one mainspring through my own inexperience and testing/practising. But the next mainspring I happily got wound up and back into the barrel.

Good enough for a hobbyist I'd say.

Coming back to this again.

Can you tell me if the arbor shafts are interchangeable with the barrel part.        Or, are the bores matched to the shaft diameter for each caliber. I am looking at the diameters of the barrels and, if the shafts were interchangeable, it would give a good selection of barrel/arbor combinations.

[JohnFrum]

3 hours ago, Chrismin said:

Coming back to this again.

Can you tell me if the arbor shafts are interchangeable with the barrel part.        Or, are the bores matched to the shaft diameter for each caliber. I am looking at the diameters of the barrels and, if the shafts were interchangeable, it would give a good selection of barrel/arbor combinations.

The bore diameter is matched to the shaft. 
Overall quality is decent for the price. 
Will still buy Bergeon winders as the need arise (have #1, #6, #7 so far) but this is a nice variety to have. 
I originally bought this cheap set for the smaller arbors, to use with the #1 Bergeon drum. Usable but didn’t solve my problem with winding the 1104A mainsprings. 

[lexacat]

As John says, the cheap set definitely matches bores to shafts. 

I've got a lathe in the shed, been contemplating making some left/right alternative winders for some of these. Mostly just to see if I can...

[Jonno65]

On 2/1/2023 at 4:06 AM, JohnFrum said:

The bore diameter is matched to the shaft. 
Overall quality is decent for the price. 
Will still buy Bergeon winders as the need arise (have #1, #6, #7 so far) but this is a nice variety to have. 
I originally bought this cheap set for the smaller arbors, to use with the #1 Bergeon drum. Usable but didn’t solve my problem with winding the 1104A mainsprings. 

What is your go to source for buying the individual Bergeon tools.  I found the main Winder Handle as they refer to it, but can't seem to locate the individual winders

[SpringMangler]

39 minutes ago, Jonno65 said:

What is your go to source for buying the individual Bergeon tools.  I found the main Winder Handle as they refer to it, but can't seem to locate the individual winders

Cousins have them. 

https://www.cousinsuk.com/category/mainspring-winders

https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/watch-bergeon-arbors-for-winders-by-size

Edited February 13, 2023 by SpringMangler

[JohnFrum]

3 hours ago, Jonno65 said:

What is your go to source for buying the individual Bergeon tools.  I found the main Winder Handle as they refer to it, but can't seem to locate the individual winders

Both Cousins(UK) and Otto Frei (USA) have individual arbors and arbor+drums 

https://www.ofrei.com/page1145.html

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by JohnFrum

[rossjackson01]

On 12/4/2022 at 6:19 PM, aac58 said:

I recently watched this video about that same winder set. It's really affordable and looks quite good, if only I had the information about the diameter and wind direction of those units...

 

 

.

Sizes mm

Left to right top

2000 = 7.2    2671 = 7.1    2235 = 7.8    8200 = 9.8   8500 = 9.0     

Left to right bottom

8500 = 9.3    3135 = 10    CO711 = 10.8   7750 = 12.0    2892 =  10.7

All Right Handed. Left as well if you use brass washers filed out to the same size. insert, then reverse

I purchased some brass washers and have spent some time filing out the innards to fit the outer size of each of the Chinese winders. I now have the facility to place 10 different size springs left or right. It would have been too long to wait whilst I purchased springs of each size. Total cost £6.69p.

Edited March 2, 2023 by rossjackson01

[kd8tzc]

On 12/11/2022 at 8:41 AM, Kalanag said:

Here the dimensions of the Chinese winders can be found:

https://bhi.co.uk/resources/mainspringwindersjustinkoullapis/

So when you look at the chart, what do they mean when they say Grey Set vs Red set? 

[Kalanag]

On 4/1/2023 at 3:00 PM, kd8tzc said:

So when you look at the chart, what do they mean when they say Grey Set vs Red set? 

The red set has 14 winders

Edited April 3, 2023 by Kalanag

[gpraceman]

I see mention of the Bergeon #5, 6 and 7 being common mainspring winder sizes.  Does this budget 10 piece set cover those sizes?

 

On 3/2/2023 at 4:57 AM, rossjackson01 said:

All Right Handed. Left as well if you use brass washers filed out to the same size. insert, then reverse

I purchased some brass washers and have spent some time filing out the innards to fit the outer size of each of the Chinese winders. I now have the facility to place 10 different size springs left or right. It would have been too long to wait whilst I purchased springs of each size. Total cost £6.69p.

I don't follow you on the brass washers.  Do you have a photo?

[rossjackson01]

7 minutes ago, gpraceman said:

I see mention of the Bergeon #5, 6 and 7 being common mainspring winder sizes.  Does this budget 10 piece set cover those sizes?

 

I don't follow you on the brass washers.  Do you have a photo?

Here you go.

On the box above the holders are the washers I purchased. I filed them out to fit each individual wider and have inserted them on the winder.

Edited April 23, 2023 by rossjackson01
more information

[gpraceman]

39 minutes ago, rossjackson01 said:

Here you go.

On the box above the holders are the washers I purchased. I filed them out to fit each individual wider and have inserted them on the winder.

I like the cheat sheet.

You've still got me puzzled on the washers.  How do those let you do left handed?