Ting Tang?

[RogerH]

Hi, I've picked up quite a nice mantle clock with a twin strike Junghans movement - see pics below before cleaning - it's in quite good order and just needed a good strip, clean and oil (I use Windles OH as per your recommendation)

The clock works fine and keeps good time but I'm wondering if I've managed to get something upside down! I believe this could be classed as a Ting Tang clock (Bim Bam for our American cousins) as it strikes the quarter past and quarter two with both chimes one after the other but it strikes the half past with a single chime (twice) and the hour with both chimes ting tanging out the hours. Is this right? or have I somehow managed to put something in back to front? Should this type of movement strike the quarters with a ting tang and the hour with just the one chime? and if so, what could I have possibly done wrong?

Every day is a school day!

[oldhippy]

It’s a German ting tang 8 day duration.

The sequence should be this

A quarter past One ting tang

Half past two ting tangs

A quarter two three ting tangs

On the hour 4 ting tangs followed by the strikes to whatever hour.  

[RogerH]

How interesting. so there must be a mechanism which controls all this? and is it possible to fit it 30mins out of sync? The hours strike the correct time.

I'll get it back on the bench and see what I find.

 

[watchweasol]

Hi  A nice clock good quality plates,  The bit that governs the strike is the snail cam, when the rack is released its tail drops on to the snail cam and the hammer/s are released. The rack is then counted back  untill it is locked and stays that way untill the next release. Old Hippy has given you the sequence. Its just question of going through the sequence and watching the operation.

[RogerH]

Thanks Watchweasol, the Snail appears to be ok as it strikes the right time and the rack moves as it should. It looks as if it's the part that moves the individual leavers is out of sync.

[oldhippy]

One thing with any strike or chiming clock, when it goes into its warning none of the hammers should start to lift. The wheel next to the flywheel with the pin on it needs to be around the 10 o'clock place that you have on a clock dial.   

[RogerH]

Result! I had a good look at this and found there is a lift lever which aligns to the snail cam and it was pretty much 180 degrees out. with a bit of adjustment I was able to set the timing up so that as the clock goes into the warning phase it starts to lift the lower hammer arm allowing only the upper one to strike the hour. It now works as it should......much to the wife's annoyance as you can't turn it off and it's really loud! But a good lesson learned.

[oldhippy]

I would say it's about a tooth out because the hammer shouldn't lift on the warning.  

[RogerH]

Thanks OH I'll check it. Suffice to say the hammer is being held off during the chime so it may be ok or, as you say, a tooth out.

[Cloxhibhition]

Sorry "old Hippi" peace brother,  but the Bim Bam'a do only the full and half hour strikes. The three train clocks does the quarters.

This is clearly two train,and it goes Bim Bam that is a strike more then a chime.

The only clock that has both Chime at every quarter and a Bim Bam strike on the full hour is the Odo with the Gai and Westminster  Chime.

There is one clock made by HAC/HAU a double Arrows it is a two train clock with the the Westminster chime on the first, second, and third quarters  just like any other Westminster Chime clock, however on the full hour you only have the hour strike without the full Westminster Chime.

It is commonly known as the three quarter Westminster Clock.

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Cloxhibhition

[oldhippy]

I think I said quarter past one bim bam, half past two bim bams. a quarter too three bim bams. On the hour foum bim bams plus the number of strikes depending on what the hour hand is pointing at. Hope that clears it up for you.  

[RogerH]

As OH said is does one Bim Bam....although I prefer Ting Tang but we all get the point...on the first quarter, two on the half past, three on the quarter to and then, in this instance, just chimes the hour without any bim bams or ting tangs. I sold it sometime ago now and it's still going strong.

[Cloxhibhition]

Nope Hippy, you got it wrong again, nothing on the quarters,  it is Bim Bam on the full hour and the half.

The Bim Bams are  the strike on this clock and there is nothing else.

To have it on the quarters and the full hour together with the strike you require three train and I have never seen Bim Bams do that ever, only the chime clocks do that.

This clearly is a two train clock and what you are saying even if there is a very remote possibility of such a clock I haven't seen, it  is impossible because of  the two train, you require three train to do that.

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Cloxhibhition

[watchweasol]

I am afraid Old Hippy got it right. ting tang Ist quarter, and so on. It does not need a third train to accomplish this. The control is from the rack, The first three teeth are on different arcs from the pivot point, the first tooth lets the rack fall allowing two strikes the next tooth three, third etc.  the canon pinion has four lifters, when the first pin lifts at the quarter only one tooth on the rack falls and we get ting tang. At the half hour there is a higher lift allowing two teeth to fall giving two sequences of ting tang. The third quarter is triggered by a higher lift allowing three teeth of the rack to fall and we get three sequences. At the hour the lift is even higher blocking one hammer and releasing the other to strike the hour. the snail cam is modified to cope with the different teeth profiles and care must be taken when re fitting the hour wheel.

So check the profile of the rack and the snail cam also the canon pinion.

[oldhippy]

1 hour ago, Cloxhibhition said:

Nope Hippy, you got it wrong again, nothing on the quarters,  it is Bim Bam on the full hour and the half.

The Bim Bams are  the strike on this clock and there is nothing else.

To have it on the quarters and the full hour together with the strike you require three train and I have never seen Bim Bams do that ever, only the chime clocks do that.

This clearly is a two train clock and what you are saying even if there is a very remote possibility of such a clock I haven't seen, it  is impossible because of  the two train, you require three train to do that.

 

You need to study that movement. You do not need three trains. A bim bam or if you wish a ting tang movement such as this type the strike side works both the bim bam/ting tang as the hourly strike.  

[RogerH]

Trust me, it's my clock and I can definitely confirm it strikes the quarters.

[oldhippy]

12 minutes ago, RogerH said:

Trust me, it's my clock and I can definitely confirm it strikes the quarters.

[watchweasol]

Hi  you aboloutly right Roger, I did a Winterhalder/Hofmier a while back and it did strike the quarters as endorsed by Old Hippy.  They are different in operation and a nice clock to work on.  I suggest the OP takes Old Hippys advice and studys the manuals and the clock.