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  1. Sorry for the multiple threads. I'll be honest--I just noticed there was a separate forum for tuning fork watches So I'll keep my posts here. I don't have the 344 silver oxide cells yet, so I'm adjusting with the 1.35v Accucell and the model 700 test set, per the service manual, to get a feel for how things work and to have a good starting point. This is really a learning experience. The index pawl is even more sensitive to tension than I expected. So the first question is regarding the last few steps in the process: I'm a little confused on the momentary hesitation part. Are they saying it's permissible while rotating the cam after it stops the first time, but before it continues to run consistently? The other thing I'm wondering about is trueness of the index wheel. I noticed that the one on this movement is noticeably out of true at the rim. Is that normal? I did my best to take a close-up video, and you can see the index and pawl jewels moving back and forth. Edit: I was also using Henny Frystack's excellent video on the 214 here as reference, but it looks like the actual phasing part is cut out of it. He talks about the theory of it, but the practice seems to be cut off at 43:00. Anyone know if the rest of it is out there on the internets?
  2. Accutron train bridges are very easy to assemble because the jewel holes have something like a funnel to guide the pivots in. Just put the the bottom pivots into the bottom holes, gently drop the top plate on and tap the holder. The plate will just drop in. It's really satisfying. I suspect it's because your bottom holes have pegwood in them that you can't get the plate on.
  3. There used to be somebody out there that didn't do this but I think he got overloaded and work and doesn't do it anymore. Then when you're making a machine for winding coils about a machine to make index wheel's. Then I figured out where I put the information on phasing for silver cells. I'm attaching a PDF on that. 1996-08-web horological times Accutron silver cells phasing.pdf
  4. So first of all: yes, I'm a dummy. Yes, I learned my lesson. While cleaning my Accutron I pegged out the jewel holes as usual, but realized too late there were burnished-in cap jewels on the other side and managed to get bits of pegwood trapped between the hole and cap jewels. I was able to clean one out through the hole jewel with a sharpened oiler, but the other is not budging. I've been soaking the bridge over night in hexane, but it's no better this morning. I'm worried about chipping the edges of the jewel hole if I keep it up. Any other suggestions on what might soften/dissolve pegwood?
  5. The service manual calls for only 2 lubricants: Moebius OL219 - Synta Visco Lube Moebius OL207 - Special Lubricant with Molybdenum Disulfide I understand that they are now Moebius 9020 and 8201, respectively. Unfortunately, I don't have either in stock. I do have 9010, 9104 (HP1300). For greases I have 9501, 9415, and Kluber P125. The manual recommends OL219 on the train jewels where I'd normally use 9010, and looking at Moebius' lubrication chart that seems reasonable. In Mark's chronograph course he also notes that 9010 can be an acceptable substitute for 9020. The grease is a little more tricky. The manual uses it in some places I'd normally use 9104, like the minute wheel post, but also where I'd use 9501 like the stem and sliding clutch. I thought the Kluber P125 might be a reasonable substitute for the 8201, but I think the Kluber is thicker. Basically I'm wondering if there's a compelling reason to buy the lubricants specifically called for, or if I can use what I have here. I don't mind spending the money if I really should, but if I can get away with what I've got and not have to wait with parts on my bench, I'd love that too.
  6. Is that a 218 movement? 218s are a good starting point to learn Accutron repair. They are infinitely simpler than 214s. The uA are an indication of the amount of current drawn. It should be within the current range for the movement. An abnormally high current could indicate a faulty circuit, a dirty gear train or a high amount of pressure of the pawl/index fingers on the index wheel. A high current draw will result in short battery life. The adjustments to the index finger that we are talking about here are incredibly small. My 218 just died on me after two years. I found that it's due to an open cell coil. Looks like it's time to build a jig to do coil rewinding as working coils are getting really hard to find.
  7. I finally feel like I have the confidence, tools, and fine motor control to tackle these tuning fork movements. I've got my 700 test meter here (in beautiful shape with the original box, I might add!) and it seems to work as it's supposed to, at least with one of those 1.35v diode batteries in it. I'm planning to phase the watches for silver oxide cell voltage at 1.65v, so what I'd like to do is use my low voltage power supply to supply the test meter, and so I don't have to keep buying cells. I feel like I saw a thread where someone made a dummy 343/344 cell with power leads on it. Anyone have pictures or a link to that?
  8. Thought I'd share a picture or two, since I was cleaning up today in preparation for finally getting to work on all these Accutron 218 movements I have waiting for love. Hence the power supply over there.
  9. That is an Accutron tuning fork watch. I wouldn't advise a newbie to attempt this. The repair would require a microscope, an Accutron tester, a multimeter, a variable power supply and specialized tools. There are a lot of articles and videos on the web explaining the inner workings of an Accutron. Absorb everything you can and then decide if you are ready for it. If you are looking for a battery watch to dabble with, perhaps a modern quartz watch would be a good starting point. Or an electromechanical watch like a Timex Electric, Hamilton Electric, Dynatron, Cosmotron.
  10. Last week, I bought a bunch of stuff from an NAWCC member. Lots of junk quartz watches, but a few accutron tuning fork watches and some accutron quartz watches. I think whoever worked on this accutron quartz accidentally switched out a solid gold back where a gold filled one probably was. I have seen lots of accutrons where the wording on the back says "gold filled" whereas this one just says "gold." I think it is 14K solid gold. Opinion?
  11. I have both 2X Barlow and 20X eyepieces, but I don't use either for watchmaking. Accutron movements seems like a good application for the eyepieces, and I'm sure there are occasions when you really want (though probably not strictly need) to get as deep on a mechanical movement, but that seems like a wait until the need arises sort of thing. That scope looks like it's from the same factory as the AmScope, et. al., so I wouldn't worry about inexpensive eyepieces getting hard to find any time soon.
  12. Try it out for yourself. Do you find 22.5x sufficient to oil a pallet jewel? Is 3.5x wide enough to see the whole watch? Like I said, the only time I need higher magnification is when working on Accutron watches. Possible upgrades that you might want to consider are a led ringlight for shadowless lighting and a tiltable microscope mount, so that you won't need a step ladder.
  13. I think most of us use a 0.5 barlow lens, giving a magnification of 3.5 - 22.5 X. The 0.5 barlow lens halves the magnification but doubles the working distance. When I want higher magnification, I use a 20X eyepiece. This gives a magnification of 14 - 90 X, but at a more useful working distance. The only time I wished I had higher magnification is when working on Accutron watches. The teeth on an Accutron index wheel are so small, that even at 90X magnification, they are still hardly visible. But higher magnifications with optical microscopes become impractical because of the shorter working distance and shallow depth of field. I'm still trying to convince myself to get an industrial digital microscope with a magnification of 200X.
  14. I have an Accutron Railroad (218) somewhere that has two hour hands, like a Gmt. No way to adjust the difference aside from resetting them on their pipes. Always found that weird. Now here's one with two crowns and no GMT. Weird.
  15. If you look carefully it's not your normal screw back as you're already noticed. Typically you see similar things on Accutron Bulova watches where there's an outer ring that screws on. But this ring doesn't look like it's screws it looks like its locked into tabs four of them on the case. The problem with outer rings are ideally you should have a special wrench. Another was it fits into the notches and then you can turn. In the case of Bulova they do have a special wrench. You can use your standard case wrench except. Normally with a standard case wrench to tighten it up and hold the back tightly when you rotate it you do not want to grab the back itself tightly as typically it's held in place with a tab or something in its physical location. So all you want to do is rotate the ring Only.
  16. I thought that was the spare crown in case the primary crown fails you can use the spare crown? Interesting that it doesn't have the other hand or even a bezel to rotate? Then I'm attaching a supplement that covers the thing is that the other crown can do. Bulova-Accutron-2185-Manual.pdf
  17. Whats the other crown for? I cannot tell by looking at the movement. @JohnR725
  18. From Esslinger website: This special purpose Moebius grease contains Molybdenum disulphide to enhance it lubricity and resistance to pressure. It is designed for use on automatic mainsprings, to ensure proper functioning of the bridle. It is also recommended for use on the Bulova Accutron watch movements. Moebius 8201 natural watch grease lubricant Contains Molybdenum disulphide -------- I use this.
  19. Howdy, y'all, from sunny South Carolina! I'm just starting my horological adventure, inspired by a 50-year-old Accutron (218D) purchased for my 50th birthday last April. There was a sentimental consideration when selecting a family present for a my semi-centennial celebration: What's more appropriate than a historically significant timepiece that has been ticking as long as my own ticker? (OK, before my fellow Accutron brothers and sisters speak up, it hums not ticks.) Before that, my interest in watches was strictly practical and job-specific. As an outdoorsman and Scout leader, my "collection" consisted of G-Shocks, Suuntos and Garmins, with a smattering of analogs from Fossil (yes, I know). Since that fateful birthday, my interest in "real" timepieces has exploded. Who knew one could spend hours window-shopping online for watches on eBay, or watching repair videos on YouTube?! I purchased a second, non-functioning Accutron (N3-218D) with the goal of learning how to repair it. Then came from Amazon shipments of tweezers, loupes, movement holders and all of the accoutrements necessary for the task, as well as the skeptical looks from my lovely wife... I found a source for the appropriate coil that seems to be the most common culprit and stripped the movement down to individual parts. And then ... Without a 20+ power microscope, I'm stuck; thus, the wait continues as I source an affordable microscope that won't draw more severe looks from the love of my life. I've started a small, thought-out and affordable collection of watches, including a new Seiko 5 sport (4R36) and a Tissot Chemin Des Tourelles (Powermatic 80) dress watch. And just this week, I received two vintage (can't believe I'm saying vintage) 80s- to 90s-era Seiko 5s from eBay: a functioning 7009-876A and a non-functioning 7S26C (from which the balance cock screw is currently hiding in the berber carpet of my home office). Along the way, I dragged my teenaged son into this new world. One of his 15th birthday presents was a simple Orient Bambino, and on his own volition and using his neighborhood lawn-mowing earnings, he purchased a beautiful Seiko Presage dress watch for church. I suspect I will be tapping into the vast experience of this forum often as I semi-ignorantly dive head first into this new adventure, and in advance, I thank you for your patience and guidance! -Mattutron (North Augusta, SC)
  20. Any chance someone has technical information on this Bulova 2453.10 conversion? It replaced the 218 that was originally in a 1965 Accutron. If no one has a technical manual (I checked the internet for it, Cousins, etc. with no luck), does anyone know the seconds hand size? I'm replacing the hands with something closer to the original and was able to measure the hour and minute (1.2 and .7 respectively) but can't get an accurate measurement of the seconds hand. The original seconds on the 218 is .18mm and I think the conversion is smaller, but I'm not sure. Here is a photo of the conversion: Thanks!
  21. I normally just use a little rodico and leave them alone but these are almost covered in oil. What is a safe way to clean? I have a watchermaster ultrasonic for parts and a regular ultrasonic for cases and bands also lighter fluid and onedip.
  22. The Accutron Bullova Caravelle case parts catalog doesn't seem to have that number listed, it could be the watch was released after the last catalog was printed (1979).
  23. When I first started being interested in watches, mom passed on her dad's Accutron to me. He died back in 2004 and was a huge part of my life growing up, so this is a treasure to me. So I put it in a drawer and didn't touch it until I felt ready. I bought several other 218 movements to practice on, as well as the Accu-cell 1.35v battery. I've got the Model 700 test kit, the service manual, and watched all of Henry Frystack's videos, so I feel like I'm ready to dive in. Today I thought maybe start with putting a fresh battery in--looks like an old mercury cell is still in there--and see what happens. Then I put it under the microscope and found clouds of gunk on the index wheel and pawls and decided against it. Guess it's time for a cleaning!
  24. I just got this non-working Bulova Quartz this week. It houses a Bulova 2426.10 movement. When power was applied, the motor just twitches. My Bulova meter showed that the pcb appears to be functioning. A resistance check of the motor was around 640 ohms. When 1.5V was applied directly across the motor contacts, the rotor only twitches. This is something that another member, @PastorChris, experienced a couple of months earlier. I decided to cut open the motor to investigate. The pivot of the pinion was so brittle that it snapped off the moment I pulled on it. The spot weld of the top cover was so weak that my razor blade cut through it with one tap and went straight into the coils, thus cutting it. The lower cover took a bit of bashing to remove it. I discovered a couple of metal filings across the leaves of the magnet. That was probably shorting out the magnetic field and the cause of the twitching. This is a really brilliant design but probably very expensive to produce. I'll be on the lookout for another similar movement.
  25. Hello @VWatchie, If I understand your situation (and I am not sure I do), I believe what you are experiencing is a timepiece that is not providing the expected isochronous timekeeping that you seem (I think) to feel that a fine watch "should" provide: https://www.google.com/search?q=isochronous+meaning (please forgive me if you are already well-accomplished in this aspect of horology) One of the reasons why time pieces are tested in (typically) six positions (DU, DD, PU, PD, PL, PR) is the very real fact that their consistency of their timekeeping (isochronism) is heavily constrained by certain expected physical characteristics and demand requirements, one of which is that the time piece must at least satisfy minimum Display requirements. In other words, the watch needs to enable the observer to be able to "tell the time" - which, interestingly, is one of the criteria that you mention in your above message as being almost trivial...considering your access to both digital and atomic time keeping. A design expectation for watches is that the Display must offer a minimum visibility to the wearer when they need it and are looking at it. In the modern era (and especially with respect to wrist watches) the movement is not in the position we typically need it to assume when we want to "tell the time". For most people, the device is mounted on the wrist in such a way that you need to raise your arm to look at its Dial, at which point the device (hopefully) tells you the accurate time. Your beef is that this is not happening. You are not getting "the accurate time". This is a claim (I think) that the isochronism of your mechanical wristwatch becomes unreliable when you are vigorously moving about. Most wrist watches are not designed to handle situations you are putting your wristwatch in, where it is being subjected to the kind of physical forces that you might generate in while working out. Interestingly, I have read recently about how sub-par isochronism might be somewhat self-cancelling through the random motions we generate as we move through the day. Obviously that is not happening for you. Part of this is the rhythmic and regular motions that a workout might produce. This will certainly wind an automatic watch. It may also be affecting the supplementary arc of your movement in ways you do not desire, amplifying the beat in one direction suppressing it in another. According to my understanding, Breguet came up with the Overcoil in an attempt to enhance isochronism, and I would also classify his Torbillon as another attempt to make the isochrononism of split balance time pieces more reliable, and of time pieces in general through another degree of mechanical isolation. In my studies, I have not (yet) seen a mechanical escapement designed in such a way as to be isochronous in an environment characterized by high-G. Temperature - yes. Humidity - Yes. High-G? Not yet. My suspicion is, if that research was ever performed, it would have been performed with escapements that are not purely mechanical in nature due to the inherent limits placed upon us by the Swiss Lever (and others) escapements. My instincts tell me that electro-mechanical escapements have a natural advantage in both high-G and No-G environments. This may help to explain the presence of the Accutron "Tuning Fork" movement in various facets of the Space Program (SR-71 control panel, Apollo control panel, Satellites & Astronaut watches). If you wanted a High-G/No-G resistant isochronous movement, my suspicion would be that it would need to be mounted somehow on a gyroscope - and I do not know personally how well a gyroscope handles instantaneous changes in direction. My guess is the gyroscope would fail. I also believe that there are serious limitations to the use of the Archimidean Spiral in High-G/No-G environments. I welcome any observations and insights from other members regarding the above. But you have a happy alternative: Buy yourself a Timex Ironman Triathlon, which seems to have been purpose-built for your design question. I myself used them for over a decade while engaging in armored combat, which is a very high-force and very fun pastime. My examples kept time just fine. I just had to change them yearly because the case eventually broke due to being rained with blows...even through the armor. But they still kept the time. As you can probably guess, I find this aspect of Horology fascinating, and I could go on further - but I've not got the time (right now) as I am working on a project that uses extremely high-precision clocks to instantaneously determine the origin of specific sound signatures in an urban environment in a Public Safety context. g. ---
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