A lathe with indexing that won't break the bank?

[JohnR725]

1 hour ago, tomh207 said:

You also have another potential issue with head and tail stocks, in my research it would seem that for the American style lathes the head and tail stocks were bored as a pair

One of the problems we would have with a watchmaker's lathe is they were made over considerable span of time and manufacturing in the early days probably wasn't as good as it was today. Then if you look at the older catalogs typically it was just the head a few collets and something to rest graver on. So basically a basic lathe with over time things acquired but acquired things may or may not fit. Order today you purchase a used lathe that all kinds of nifty bits and pieces from a seller that acquired from?

1 hour ago, tomh207 said:

indexing is again not so straightforward for a watchmaker lathe, at least not as I have found so far. Often a lathe will come with basic indexing which is limited to 60 positions. The full index plates do come up at times for eywatering prices. It is very possible to do that electronically.

This would come back to that the basic watchmaker's lathe was used for basic watchmaking like turning things with a hand graver.

Then limited indexing is fine because you can make things like stems Which don't need a whole bunch indexing

 

1 hour ago, tomh207 said:

https://imakewatches.com/projects/MillingAttachment.html
 

In the link above the word vector is mentioned and at the link below you can purchase one. Then of course you're going to need the motor that's a little bit extra for the price.

https://www.hswalsh.com/product/lathe-vector-watchmakers-48-collets-hl11.

That you're going to need some bonus parts like these found this picture online show the classic way of classic gear cutting.

 

The lathe could have a much bigger indexing disk but it has to be mounted close to the edge. Otherwise you're going to have a whole bunch of smaller disks like this which I think has notches rather than holes.

Then as wonderful as these pictures look actually cutting a gear with this is not entirely fun. Look at all is belts all pulling on things and this is a watchmaker's lathe lightweight with lots of bits and pieces attached. It would make more sense if you actually cut a gear with something like this and it tends to be it's not really the best way to do it looks nice on paper but it is not the best way to go.

Reality for cutting watch parts would be a bigger machine is much better. Than getting rid of all those belts and pulleys also good.

Here is an interesting channel I would've liked of found a different video but this was nice and short if you look at his video as he uses a stepping motor and worm gear assembly for the indexing plate. In this particular video it gets attached to the lathe at about one minute and seven seconds and it looks like it's hiding looks like he has a Sherline. I do know he's had other stuff you'll just have to go through his videos to find it. Then at about one minute and 22 seconds you find out if you set up things appropriately. It's always bad we end up with half a tooth at the very end.

Then you will note big lathe yes he's getting a big gear but you could easily cut a watch gear with the setup. And it definitely way more stable than a watchmaker's lathe.

 

 

 

 

Oh here's a company they been in business since 1911

http://www.fwderbyshireinc.com/

 

[LittleWatchShop]

3 hours ago, coreymsnow said:

For example, a Sherline mill would appear to be either a separate piece of gear or an attachment/expansion to their smaller lathe. When you say you have a WW lathe and a sherline mill, can you say exactly what devices you have?

I posted pictures earlier in this thread. My lathe and mill are two separate instruments. I think I have seen examples of putting a milling head on a lathe bed...but not certain.

[caseback]

9 minutes ago, LittleWatchShop said:

. I think I have seen examples of putting a milling head on a lathe bed...but not certain

I believe @nickelsilver has a setup like that.

[coreymsnow]

Y'all are very helpful, I can't thank you enough for the insights.

 

[ChrisInOz]

You might like to see the contraption that I made for indexing on my Chinese lathe.   This is a 4 inch rotary table with dividing plates that I attached to my lathe mandrel using a drawbar.  It is completely manually operated. No electronics or computer needed.  I have used it to make a 60 tooth clock wheel.

I use a Sherline headstock on a vertical slide to drive the gear cutter.  The wheel blank is mounted on an aluminium "superglue arbor." This is the modern equivalent of a shellac chuck,  and allows the wheel to be centre bored, trued and the teeth cut in a single setup,  ensuring that concentricity is maintained.

 

The finished wheel after crossing.

I have not tried to make small watch parts on this lathe.  The runout on the mandrel bearings may be too high for that.  I won't know unless I try.

 

 

Edited 15 hours ago by ChrisInOz
more info

[tomh207]

@ChrisInOz your not Chris as in Clickspring are you? looks similar to some solutions I have seen him do.

 

Tom

[nickelsilver]

12 hours ago, caseback said:

I believe @nickelsilver has a setup like that.

I have a little milling attachment for my WW lathe, but very rarely use it and not for wheel and pinion cutting. For that I use a small Sixis 101 milling machine. I normally do direct dividing, but sometimes have to do an odd count and use the universal index which also fits on the Sixis.

 

Back in the day when I didn't have a mill, I would cut gearing on my Schaublin 102. It has a universal dividing attachment which fits the back of the spindle. Both it and the one for the Sixis are 60:1 ratio, and with the set of 4  index plates I can do almost any division. When I've had to do a strange high count prime number, I print a disc with the needed division and just place the plunger on the dot. Any position error is reduced by a factor of 60 so still plenty accurate.

 

The machines are a mess in the pics as I'm in the process of making a batch of barrels for a wristwatch .

 

This is the Sixis. The head can also be placed vertically, as can the dividing spindle.

 

Dividing plates. The smaller ones fit another dividing spindle.

 

Universal divider for the Sixis. I put it together with parts from an odd Sixis spindle that takes w20 collets, like the Schaublin 102, and a dividing attachment from a Schaublin mill.

 

 

The dividing attachment for the 102. The gear fits in place of the handwheel at the back of the headstock.

 

And the little milling attachment for the WW lathe. I just set it on the slide rest to illustrate the size, you can see from the dust on it it really doesn't get used much. I think only when I change bearing in the head, to kiss the collet head seat (grinding wheel still in the milling attachment).

Edited 8 hours ago by nickelsilver

[GuyMontag]

On 4/24/2025 at 10:25 AM, coreymsnow said:

Thank you all for the tips and insights. I'm looking carefully at the Sherline lathes with a milling attachment. I need to figure out exactly what I'd need to get in terms of the base lathe and attachments to be able to fabricate basic parts and learn how to fabricate some of the less basic ones- like a cannon pinion.

Thank you again.

This guy (Minimachining) has a playlist of him setting up and using various attachments on his Sherline lathe.

 

On 4/24/2025 at 3:26 AM, LittleWatchShop said:

I own too many WW lathes, as well as two sherline lathes and a sherline mill with a cnc indexing rotary table. The majority of my experience is using the WW lathes to make staffs, screws, and stems.

Recently, I have been experimenting making a pinion on the mill using the indexing table. It works. So, if you want to cut wheels, get the Sherline mill and indexing table...imho

I know nothing about CNC machines but had a question about making screws. Watchguy.uk has a section on his website where it allows you to enter parameters for screws and wheels and then 'generate code'. Is it as simple as that sounds, can you 'tell' the CNC machine to cut you a screw (or stem) by giving it the code for a particular screw or stem and it happily makes one for you?