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Starter tools - what to get, what to skip

LuigiMeister2800
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LuigiMeister2800 Member

LuigiMeister2800

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Hi everyone, 

After a fruitful discussion regarding starter movements and models that resulted in the purchase of my first vintage watch, I prepared another topic that I think could be very helpful for myself and other starters. 

I made a list of tools that I think (or I should say hope) will suffice for basic servicing/repairs. I would also like to take this opportunity to maybe discuss where to go premium and where you could save some bucks and I also have some questions regarding oils and cleaning products. I will also provide example links for products on which I have some doubt.

Thanks in advance for your opinions!

My shopping cart:

I am not sure which grease, oils and cleaning products I should get, any advice on this?

Oils: https://www.beco-technic.com/en/Products/Consumables/Grease-oils-epilams/Oils/

Grease: https://www.beco-technic.com/en/Products/Consumables/Grease-oils-epilams/Greases/

 

Louis

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LuigiMeister2800 Member

LuigiMeister2800

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1 hour ago, tomh207 said:

I started here

https://www.watchfix.com/2019/09/30/essential-day-1-tools/

this is curated by our host Mark Lovick who has a great watchmaker YouTube channel and also creates the courses at watchfix.com

Tom

Yes I saw that page. I was wondering more about like the hand removers, what are your experiences with either kind. Are the screwdrivers fine, not fine enough, too few, too much... 

 

Louis

Edited by LuigiMeister2800
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tomh207 Super WRT Addict

tomh207

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2 hours ago, LuigiMeister2800 said:

Yes I saw that page. I was wondering more about like the hand removers, what are your experiences with either kind. Are the screwdrivers fine, not fine enough, too few, too much... 

 

Louis

I use the basic, cheap hand removers although polished and thinned, of course with plastic to protect the dial. As to screwdrivers, you will likely be modifying them as you go to fit perfectly, we all do, sometimes several times in the one movement. No one size fits all, some folks have bought pretty cheap screwdrivers then put good quality tips in them and are happy, YMMV. There is no perfect screwdriver, I might love one brand but the other folks here might hate them, but even a bad screwdriver with a good blade will be a world of difference.

 

Tom

P.S. Even buying the most expensive tools you will likely still have to fettle them in some way

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LittleWatchShop Distinguished Member

LittleWatchShop

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4 hours ago, LuigiMeister2800 said:

 

 

Louis

 

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spectre6000 Distinguished Member

spectre6000

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On 1/14/2024 at 6:32 AM, LuigiMeister2800 said:

My shopping cart:

I scratched out the two I wouldn't worry about. Lots of additional lists have been thrown out there. Missing is pegwood and pithwood, but those can be handled by other means. Start with a minimalists' toolset, and expand as the need arises. I wanted to get into watchmaking back in college, and a local watchmaker talked me out of it saying it costs (literally) millions of dollars in tooling. Absolutely not the case. This hobby can be as cheap or expensive as you want it to be. The only thing I can think of that's truly expensive that's a must have (once you know you're committed) is a microscope. I think we're down to $400-something on that at this point, so even that isn't going to break anyone as far as big ticket items go.

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Neverenoughwatches Distinguished Member

Neverenoughwatches

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On 1/14/2024 at 1:32 PM, LuigiMeister2800 said:

Hi everyone, 

After a fruitful discussion regarding starter movements and models that resulted in the purchase of my first vintage watch, I prepared another topic that I think could be very helpful for myself and other starters. 

I made a list of tools that I think (or I should say hope) will suffice for basic servicing/repairs. I would also like to take this opportunity to maybe discuss where to go premium and where you could save some bucks and I also have some questions regarding oils and cleaning products. I will also provide example links for products on which I have some doubt.

Thanks in advance for your opinions!

My shopping cart:

I am not sure which grease, oils and cleaning products I should get, any advice on this?

Oils: https://www.beco-technic.com/en/Products/Consumables/Grease-oils-epilams/Oils/

Grease: https://www.beco-technic.com/en/Products/Consumables/Grease-oils-epilams/Greases/

 

Louis

If you are on a budget some of this you can either make or buy cheaper and adjust to make better. Cushions you can make easily, any lid large enough to hold correctly and filled with some kind of foam.  I've made dozens from jar lids and various foam mats. Bamboo skewers or tooth picks can take the place of pegwood. Some pegwood is awful soft and bity,  bamboo is harder but it can have a potential to scratch. I don't see a benchmat on your list, a piece of non soft lino flooring works. Cheaper hand lifters can be redressed if you are handy, which brings us to bench stones, you need something that can sharpen steel tools. Cheaper screwdrivers you can get away with for the time being as long as the blades are good quality. Something you might not want to skimp on and that is tweezers. Although i have bought cheap and made better, cousins actually sell cheap titanium tweezers which are good for the price and dont scratch . You wont need 5 oilers, one or two good quality ones will be better. If you buy 5 , i will guarantee 3 of them will be too big and you will use them for something else other than oiling. Oilers can be made from needles, but buy if you want to save time. Pithwood is useful for mopping up over oiling ( not a fan of rodico ) also for cleaning oilers tips, other tool's tips and watch parts, found inside the branches of the elderberry tree. A note pad is a must for writing down disassembly info such as part location orientation, connection, issues noticed along with something to take pictures to verify notes. A flat sharpend needle for teasing up bridges and cocks. Maybe an electric rotary tool to aid the shaping and sharpening of tools etc. To save more writing you can have an exclusive glimpse of two of my benches, pick out something that spikes your curiosity. In the pictures are just multiples and sizes of basic hand tools, pin vices, files,pins, broaches, brushes etc really just different things that hold, grip, poke, shape, drill, size, clean small bits of metal ( a big part of watch repair is just about ) 1st bench looks overcrowded but i very rarely ping anything, i think only once in 2 years i have had to clear it looking for something, but too many tools on your main working disassembly/assembly bench isn't really a good idea, i just like most used tools within good reach ( habit ). All other clever little adjusting devices  and bigger things like staking and jewelling tools, lathe etc are in draws. A lot of these small items are old tools bought from here and there. I seem to know if just one of them is out of place and a new one has to discover where its going to live . Its all Heath Robinson style and does me for the time being and is quite cosy, new watchroom is in the planning this year in a bigger bedroom 🤗

 

 

 

 

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Edited by Neverenoughwatches
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rehajm Super WRT Addict

rehajm

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If we’re still compiling the list I’d like to argue mainspring winders could be omitted. When I started out they seemed to me one of the tools beginners rush to acquire. Depending on what projects you’re doing just plan to replace- a new spring is inexpensive if you have economical access to a supplier. New is good for amplitude. My first projects all had broken and/or carbon steel anyways. OR…try your hand at hand winding. Yah yah you’ll bend it and blah blah watch won’t run etc etc…if your project is inexpensive why not first try the most inexpensive solution? Most likely worst case is you get assembly practice with a movement you’ve assembled before…

…I also experienced that the cheap Chinese winders are so cheap they aren’t cheap at all…

Staking set is the first expensive tool I’d invest in.

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eccentric59 WRT Addict

eccentric59

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I am going to reinforce @Neverenoughwatches suggestion of sharpening stones. Especially if you buy less expensive screwdrivers and tweezers, it is essential to keep the sharp and properly dressed. If you don't you'll be pinging, dropping, bending, scratching, gouging and every other -ing that's detrimental to small delicate parts. You don't need a specialty sharpener, just some good flat stones of coarse, medium and fine grades. And I'd suggest a holder for sharpening, too. 

 

https://www.esslinger.com/watchmakers-screwdriver-holder-for-sharpener/?gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1JajexWqvKIjFQrsuO2OMvee9an0JvvIYyKhq39izoZeFhkvA7AKoxoCMDwQAvD_BwE

 

 

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Neverenoughwatches Distinguished Member

Neverenoughwatches

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22 minutes ago, rehajm said:

If we’re still compiling the list I’d like to argue mainspring winders could be omitted. When I started out they seemed to me one of the tools beginners rush to acquire. Depending on what projects you’re doing just plan to replace- a new spring is inexpensive if you have economical access to a supplier. New is good for amplitude. My first projects all had broken and/or carbon steel anyways. OR…try your hand at hand winding. Yah yah you’ll bend it and blah blah watch won’t run etc etc…if your project is inexpensive why not first try the most inexpensive solution? Most likely worst case is you get assembly practice with a movement you’ve assembled before…

…I also experienced that the cheap Chinese winders are so cheap they aren’t cheap at all…

Staking set is the first expensive tool I’d invest in.

I wouldn't argue with that and i bought some old winders very quickly, i really shouldn't have bothered, i think I've used the set of 9 winders maybe half a dozen times now. I learnt to hand wind and also made a little jig to help me do it better and safer. I have more winders now and use them for ease but occasionally they dont fit so i get a little refresher course in hand winding. After a good amount of practice I dont bend, kink or twist them inappropriately when i do one. What may happen is the spring will take on a helix shape, but that can happen with the removal of it as well. There is the possibility that the spring will rub on the barrel inside if its has a helix form and I'm sure it happens, thing is you dont know if it is or not until you remove it again and find evidence of rubbing. So that kind of leaves me on the fence with the whole handwinding thing. But if its already formed a helix shape on removal, coiling it up in a winder doesnt remove the helix, ive tried it and it doesn't . I have managed to remove some by pulling it through itself but only from the inner coils or on an old spiral only spring. 

14 minutes ago, eccentric59 said:

I am going to reinforce @Neverenoughwatches suggestion of sharpening stones. Especially if you buy less expensive screwdrivers and tweezers, it is essential to keep the sharp and properly dressed. If you don't you'll be pinging, dropping, bending, scratching, gouging and every other -ing that's detrimental to small delicate parts. You don't need a specialty sharpener, just some good flat stones of coarse, medium and fine grades. And I'd suggest a holder for sharpening, too. 

 

https://www.esslinger.com/watchmakers-screwdriver-holder-for-sharpener/?gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1JajexWqvKIjFQrsuO2OMvee9an0JvvIYyKhq39izoZeFhkvA7AKoxoCMDwQAvD_BwE

 

 

Flat diamond steel plates are ideal and can be cheap. In fact i just had a 3000 4" diamond disk delivered it was a fiver from china, intended to put on top of a grinding wheel to go in a bench grinder to sharpen gravers. I was expecting a poor quality generic grade of grit that could have been anything from 400 to 2000. It was i guess bang on 3000 as its so much finer that a well graded 2000 plate i have.  Disks like these are perfect for making micro diamond files from and as we discuss here an 1" x 3" sharpening plate for tweezers and drivers, the sharpening plate doesn't need to be a big 8x3 . You can even make up your own sharpening stone from a lollypop stick or metal stick and emery cloths. They dont last forever but just an example of what its possible to manage with. 

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Neverenoughwatches Distinguished Member

Neverenoughwatches

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3 hours ago, rehajm said:

 

Staking set is the first expensive tool I’d invest in.

Edited 1 hour ago by rehajm

A staking set is a good step up for a beginner and no doubt the first watches that are encountered would have need of one. But for me, I'm next to hopeless when i use a loupe, i can inspect with one but little else, maybe some disassembly. Clear use of both my eyes which permits better depth perception than when using a loupe is mega important to me. I started with big magnifying glasses and that soon evolved to a binocular microscope before i even knew they where used in watch repair. If i was starting again and know what i know now i would change many things, but getting a microscope quickly is one thing i wouldn't change. When searching inside a movement i constantly strive to get the best light and the best magnification in there with me, its a healthy threesome 😉

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