Balance wheel Omega cal 269

[JohnR725]

44 minutes ago, whathaveidone said:

It's not pretty and probably crazy out of time but it's oscillating. 

Now that we have pictures we have a problem?

 

On 9/7/2023 at 10:28 AM, whathaveidone said:

Is it the wrong balance bridge for the movement? 

Then yes this is not the right balance bridge for 269 movement.

Maybe I just didn't ask the right question in the first place? The balance bridge in the picture is designed for over coil hairspring. Although it is missing the tail end of the regulator? But the regulator pins are in the right place for the over coil hairspring which corresponds to the balance wheel you have and it all seems to be oscillating. So maybe a better question would be what movement do you have? Why did you think it was a 269 in the first place?

[whathaveidone]

On 9/10/2023 at 9:51 AM, JohnR725 said:

Yes that is very impressive hairspring work were seeing isn't it. But if it really was in over coil and he puts it back the way he found it, it still is the wrong balance wheel and hairspring for the watch because this watch needs a balance wheel with no screws and a flat hairspring.

 

Even after getting the spring back to "normal" something is preventing the balance wheel from advancing the pallet fork. Appears the impulse jewel arch is too wide - hence not the right wheel.  The impulse jewel will enter the pallet fork but won't advance the fork, just stops.  I used a spare balance wheel from a cal 491 to test and it worked - the impulse jewel entered the fork and advanced it as expected.  Thinking I could use that wheel I removed the hairspring from the incorrect wheel and placed on the 491.  You guessed it - didn't work.  The pivots aren't long enough and i think smaller diameter.  Overall good practice on replacing hairsprings.  Now searching for a cheap 269 balance complete.

[JohnR725]

2 hours ago, whathaveidone said:

Thinking I could use that wheel I removed the hairspring from the incorrect wheel and placed on the 491.  You guessed it - didn't work.  The pivots aren't long enough and i think smaller diameter.  Overall good practice on replacing hairsprings.  Now searching for a cheap 269 balance complete.

One of the things important to help us out is to upfront tell us what you're doing. In other words I had the impression you were restoring well let's see something

On 9/7/2023 at 10:28 AM, whathaveidone said:

Restoring a cal 269

Yes that's what you're restoring you didn't mention anything about its and pieces of other watches which now I'm suspicious of for the entire discussion. Then it's really helpful if you make use of a website with cross-references from parts rather than just making wild guesses like for instance let's go to 491 since I happen to be there and look at the balance complete

So from the link it looks like 490 and 491 and 500 and I don't see 269 at all may be if we had a hydraulic press or something maybe that would work

http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=[^[D^IV

Now let's go back to 269 and see what we get

http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=OME_269

Yes 269 there's only two balance wheels

2 hours ago, whathaveidone said:

Even after getting the spring back to "normal" something is preventing the balance wheel from advancing the pallet fork. Appears the impulse jewel arch is too wide - hence not the right wheel.  The impulse jewel will enter the pallet fork but won't advance the fork, just stops.  I used a spare balance wheel from a cal 491 to test and it worked - the impulse jewel entered the fork and advanced it as expected.  Thinking I could use that wheel I removed the hairspring from the incorrect wheel and placed on the 491.  You guessed it - didn't work.  The pivots aren't long enough and i think smaller diameter.  Overall good practice on replacing hairsprings.  Now searching for a cheap 269 balance complete.

Now let's start for the beginning your definition a restoring a 269 is what exactly? In other words was this a complete watch in the first place or you buying bits and pieces off of eBay and trying to make it 269 it's confusing for the people helping you. Now on a modern watch which is why gave you the link if it says the parts should work it should work. If this was of vintage like an American pocket watch even if the list says the part will work it probably won't especially if it's related to escapement components but this is a modern watch there shouldn't be an issue unless you're just randomly trying parts out hoping to work then that will be a problem

[whathaveidone]

23 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

One of the things important to help us out is to upfront tell us what you're doing. In other words I had the impression you were restoring well let's see something

Yes that's what you're restoring you didn't mention anything about its and pieces of other watches which now I'm suspicious of for the entire discussion. Then it's really helpful if you make use of a website with cross-references from parts rather than just making wild guesses like for instance let's go to 491 since I happen to be there and look at the balance complete

So from the link it looks like 490 and 491 and 500 and I don't see 269 at all may be if we had a hydraulic press or something maybe that would work

http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=[^[D^IV

Now let's go back to 269 and see what we get

http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=OME_269

Yes 269 there's only two balance wheels

Now let's start for the beginning your definition a restoring a 269 is what exactly? In other words was this a complete watch in the first place or you buying bits and pieces off of eBay and trying to make it 269 it's confusing for the people helping you. Now on a modern watch which is why gave you the link if it says the parts should work it should work. If this was of vintage like an American pocket watch even if the list says the part will work it probably won't especially if it's related to escapement components but this is a modern watch there shouldn't be an issue unless you're just randomly trying parts out hoping to work then that will be a problem

@JohnR725 thank you for the information - very helpful.  I can tell by your tone that you are growing impatient with me.  I'm new and learning and will continue to do silly stuff like use part 500.1327 instead of 269.1327 until I can source one.  If that frustrates you I suggest removing yourself from this thread.  If you choose to stay and give guidance, which I would appreciate, I need it to be less patronizing.  Cheers friend.  

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, whathaveidone said:

@JohnR725 thank you for the information - very helpful.  I can tell by your tone that you are growing impatient with me.  I'm new and learning and will continue to do silly stuff like use part 500.1327 instead of 269.1327 until I can source one.  If that frustrates you I suggest removing yourself from this thread.  If you choose to stay and give guidance, which I would appreciate, I need it to be less patronizing.  Cheers friend.  

Hi whatav, there is no tone,  this is just how things are explained with John, only by trying to iron out the confusion and simplify matters, will it be better understood. Without all the correct information it can be difficult to diagnose an issue. Trust me  you will find no one better qualified to help you you with this, John has an extremely good track record. 

[JohnR725]

1 hour ago, whathaveidone said:

I can tell by your tone that you are growing impatient with me.  I'm new and learning and will continue to do silly stuff like use part 500.1327 instead of 269.1327 until I can source one.  If that frustrates you I suggest removing yourself from this thread.  If you choose to stay and give guidance, which I would appreciate, I need it to be less patronizing.  Cheers friend.  

If you would like a more friendly place at least that was the premise of this there is a location to do that. I circled the location that's where you should've asked your question originally rather than out here.

 

24 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Hi whatav, there is no tone,  this is just how things are explained with John, only by trying to iron out the confusion and simplify matters, will it be better understood. Without all the correct information it can be difficult to diagnose an issue. Trust me  you will find no one better qualified to help you you with this, John has an extremely good track record. 

Yes the problem of correct information. The problem is what exactly are we doing here today? Often times I will relate learning watch repair is similar to learning to become a doctor. Ever noticed were doctors say they're practicing what are they ever really get into the game? Well never like doctors were all practicing were all learning. The watches those are patients and like human beings at least mechanical watches share common things But?

Let's look at something let's quote something

On 9/7/2023 at 10:28 AM, whathaveidone said:

Help with balance alignment. Restoring a cal 269 and the balance wheel sits off-center compressing the spring.  The spring itself appears centered.  Is it the wrong balance bridge for the movement?

Let's look at the above quote somebody's restoring a 269 the balance wheel doesn't look right the spring doesn't look right and it's not right we figured that out but ideally on a conversation like this like when you go into the Doctor they ask you all kinds a silly questions you can't just walk in and say I need surgery on my they would like to do little background history why do you think you need surgery or in the case of a doctor where's your insurance policy and maybe your credit card. But here we need or should have some background information like where to the watch come from what was its condition and when you received it did you have any pictures why do you have the totally wrong balance wheel in this watch and why does it seem to fit the balance bridge in a 269 when it shouldn't? There seems to be a communication problem here at a communication problem of what problem you're trying to solve is conflicting with well to be honest I haven't purchased my crystal ball yet. Usually for timing machine diagnostics will make jokes about crystal balls or reading tea leaves. You're not the point of timing machines are not elaborate but you are our eyes in the field we need a correct assessment so we can help you otherwise it leads to frustrations.

1 hour ago, whathaveidone said:

If that frustrates you I suggest removing yourself from this thread.  If you choose to stay and give guidance, which I would appreciate, I need it to be less patronizing. 

I know let's think about this I need to run away for a few hours I quoted something up above. If that's what you desire when I come back all you have to do is say yes John stepped back or you would like me to continue to help you either or works for me. So simple answers step back or continue with help.

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by JohnR725

[RichardHarris123]

I hate it when people fall out on here because it is a friendly forum.  No offence is meant and if it is, the moderator's will step in. @JohnR725didn't mean any offence, he just wanted to fully understand the problem, he is invaluable on here.  I hope @whathaveidonecan accept that and value his advice. 

[JohnR725]

3 hours ago, RichardHarris123 said:

he just wanted to fully understand the problem

You know I was thinking about this when I went away what am I being accused of?

5 hours ago, whathaveidone said:

I can tell by your tone that you are growing impatient with me.  I'm new and learning and will continue to do silly stuff like use part 500.1327 instead of 269.1327 until I can source one.  If that frustrates you I suggest removing yourself from this thread.  If you choose to stay and give guidance, which I would appreciate, I need it to be less patronizing.  Cheers friend.  

 

I was thinking about this when I went away today and I'm going to make myself happy and you happy. The problem here is this is a volunteer group we all come for our own reasons. I come to share my knowledge and help people and be honest if you look at my numeric score I think I do a pretty good job of it. But you can't be 100% is bound to be somebody you can't work with an obviously your number three. You join a unique club. If you run the mouse over somebody's name a window pops up on the bottom right-hand side there is the word ignore. If you click the ads a new window pops up exactly like the image I snipped out below. You'll notice I checked everything that means the message board knows that this particular case I just don't work well with you and I apologize I am who I am but apparently that's not what you desire or need and I wish you well in your journeys as this will be the last message we ever exchange.