Waltham Mainspring.

[wudce]

Hoping someone been down this road before. I have a Waltham Seaside pocket watch that's in great shape other than needing a service and a new Mainspring. The old Mainspring the end of it is broke so I order a new one that came in one of them holder. Now I have done one other Waltham pocket watch before it was a size 16 and was able to wind it back in by hand since we know on these watch there a hook that Mainspring hooks on to. My question is can you push the new Mainspring in when it's in that holder or do I need to take it out and wind it in by hand. If I try putting it in using the holder how can I tell if I got it hooked. 

[Waggy]

Hi there, the quick answer is yes, you can just push it in, usually (but not always) if the ring has a colour then the colour should be facing up, but double check. as for the hook, unless it is a 'T' type bridal then you dont need to worry, the spring will rotate on its first wind and locate itself into the correct position. The first wind you may feel/hear a click or slip as the spring does this. After you have finished you'll say ...."hmm that was easy!"

If you post a picture we can better advise you.

Below is an image of the T type bridals so you know if you have one of these, if so then you need to align it with the small slip in the barrel, which can be quite tricky is you have not doen it before:

Edited October 20, 2023 by Waggy

[JohnR725]

On 10/19/2023 at 9:07 PM, Waggy said:

unless it is a 'T' type bridal then you dont need to worry, the spring will rotate on its first wind and locate itself into the correct position.

out of curiosity does this really work for you?

On 10/19/2023 at 2:30 PM, wudce said:

old Mainspring

it's really nice if you would give us a mainspring number so we know exactly what you're talking about as opposed to trying to figure out what you have. Unlike the fantasy up above anything resembling a end that goes into the sides of the barrel like a T  or its variations you can never inserted out of the ring and have it go where it's supposed to be.

On 10/19/2023 at 2:30 PM, wudce said:

Waltham Seaside pocket watch

lot easier if we have a part number but okay I found the part number looks like this is your mainspring

the problem with the hole end Waltham spring is our well maybe I'll be lucky but typically it will never catch on the outer barrel wall. For something like this watch to be honest I would really like to see original spring you can typically find them on eBay considerably less trouble. So your modern spring has to have the right size of hole sometimes they don't because remember these are generic replacement springs are not exact replacement. A lot of it depends upon who actually manufactured it. Then no matter what anything involving a wall from steel barrel if you want the spring the hook it has to have a little bit of a bend at the end or it isn't going to hook.

somewhere in the discussion group we've discussed this before. The Millers I think we have pictures somewhere else

 

[wudce]

Here we go. As I said I done another Waltham before it was a size 16 but same set up. In that case I was able to use the old Mainspring winding it in by hand. There is 4 Mainspring listed for this watch the one I picked was Best Fit JA-729 which crosses over to the factor No 2220. The problem I'm seeing is how you could push this in and be sure it hook properly and or if you could push it in since the hook in the barrel may prevent it from doing so. 

[JohnR725]

7 hours ago, wudce said:

There is 4 Mainspring listed for this watch the one I picked was Best Fit JA-729 which crosses over to the factor No 2220.

this differs from what I found for six size watch which is why in the future it's really good to give us more specifications otherwise we waste our time trying to figure out what you have. But in this particular case it doesn't really matter you have the same problem.

 

 

8 hours ago, wudce said:

The problem I'm seeing is how you could push this in and be sure it hook properly and or if you could push it in since the hook in the barrel may prevent it from doing so. 

that isn't exactly the problem. The problem is the shape of the end of the mainspring has to be right or your chance of catching on the hook is basically almost nonexistence. then of course the hole in the modern spring has to be of the right size occasionally there too small.

let's have an image if you look at the end of the spring you took out should see something like this. There is a little bit of a bend in the spring that forces it into the hook. Then often times you'll see a taper that is to wedge itself into the hook.

 

 

 

[RichardHarris123]

Would it be possible or practical to punch or file the hole to the correct size? 

[Neverenoughwatches]

17 hours ago, wudce said:

The problem I'm seeing is how you could push this in and be sure it hook properly and or if you could push it in since the hook in the barrel may prevent it from doing so. 

It should push in ok as you are putting the spring in wound up so there should be enough space between the spring and the barrel wall inc. the hook. You will know this as soon as you insert the spring into the barrel ready to push out, obviously make sure its the right way up. Will the hook fit in hole ? You wont know until you try. So you might need to reshape the hole, but you'll need to install the spring into the barrel to be able to  unwind it to work on it. I wouldn't fancy unwinding a spring from a supplied insert holder.   

[wudce]

I took the new spring out of it's keeper using a larger barrel since I had nothing to loose since it's not going to work anyway.  As you can see from the new spring (Top) dose not have that back cut on the under side vs the old blue steel one. I would try to file the new one down to match the old one but problem is I have nothing here that small to do the job. Might put this on the back burner for now and work on another that needs my help.

Edited October 22, 2023 by wudce

[JohnR725]

10 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

It should push in ok as you are putting the spring in wound up so there should be enough space between the spring and the barrel wall inc. the hook. You will know this as soon as you insert the spring into the barrel ready to push out, obviously make sure its the right way up. Will the hook fit in hole ? You wont know until you try.

notice the last little bit you won't know until you try is hundred percent correct. Everything is speculation until you try and then if it fails then you have to deal with it up until then it might work maybe it will work.

1 hour ago, wudce said:

I would try to file the new one down to match the old one but problem is I have nothing here that small to do the job.

that is the typical a problem with the small Springs is nothing to file the taper. It's why I usually go to eBay find something it resembles the new old stock purchase that as it should have the band and the proper shaped hole. Otherwise you could try the spring you have who knows it might work I don't think someone would waste there time making a suggestion if they thought it wasn't going to work.

[wudce]

I order a factory spring from E-bay I'm hoping it will work, one thing is at least they don't cost much

[rehajm]

I’m 1-1 on Waggy’s method- close it up and hope for the best.  I was afraid with the Waltham A-11 6/0 B three piece kind where the barrel arbor goes through the donut-

the inside hook is supposed to catch but I was afraid and hooked up both ends then wound it by hand…seemed to work a treat