Vulcain Cricket (S2315A cal.120)

[swiss2k]

Hello everyone,  

 

I would like to present to you my latest project, a Vulcain Cricket (yes, another Cricket), model S2315A. I always wanted a Cricket, and it looks to me that Vulcain has made a lot of different variations of dials, watches etc. Cannot really find much info on the one I have. 

 

Initial condition overall: is running, but definitely needs servicing. It has a lot of DNA allover the place. Also, the watch came with its original bracelet (I wonder how that will turn out).

Movement: looks to be a cal.120. Not 100% sure as googling for this caliber brings different results. What do you think? Also had tested it on the timegrapher, results on the picture.

Crystal: needs a new one, as the original is cracked and has oxidation on the tension ring.  

Dial: looks pretty clean.  

Case: gold plating has some ware. Honestly not sure what to do as I have no setup of my own yet. Is it worth sending for replating?  

 

I am a newbie in the trade so any thoughts or suggestions are super welcome!

 

Thank you! 

[Steveod21]

Definitely Cal.120.....and the later version with incabloc balance bridge.  A nice watch. As to whether it's worth the cost of replating, the value is about 400-500 GBP serviced if sold in the UK 'as is' but could rise to 700-900 GBP depending on how the restoration of the case turns out.  

I've owned and worked on a few crickets and they are lovely little watches.  Recently re-released in a much larger contemporary sized case, they look ungainly to me but of course it's each to his own.

[LittleWatchShop]

I am wearing one now...my first one that I brought back from the dead.  Have saved another one and have bought a running one.  I have three.  But I only wear the one.  They are straightforward to service overall.

[rehajm]

My kind of timepiece!! very nice… we’re up to three in our house- the one I wore today, the new one my wife wanted, and one waiting for me go get the nerve to dive in…

Based on your pics it could be tough call on the case if the dial is great. Wait till you get the scuzz of I’d reckon…

[swiss2k]

8 hours ago, rehajm said:

Wait till you get the scuzz of I’d reckon…

Get what sorry?

[rehajm]

1 hour ago, swiss2k said:

Get what sorry?

…the…ah…organic material 

[swiss2k]

Day 1. Disassembly or what do we really have. 

Crystal: Definitely needs to be replaced. When measuring I have 30.5-30.6mm, in the Sternkreuz Gezamtkatalog G22 there is only one that might fit is XAG306.697 (not sure how tight it would sit though). Also ho idea how it might look... Is it possible anyone knows the a part number?

Case and dial: Well I seen better dials, but also seen a lot worse. Does it make sense to invest in replanting the case? What do you guys think? 

Movement: Looks clean. But someone had laid his dirty little hands on it. The sprint ring, locker ring, on the alarm hand is damaged. 

[swiss2k]

Does anyone know how much does it usually cost to re-plate a gold watch?  Thank you

[LittleWatchShop]

That spring is tough to find and seem to be easy to break.  When servicing: the spring, setting lever, and the unlocking wheel should not be disassembled...just keep together as a unit.  That is my humble view.

You can do gold electroplating yourself, but it is a pretty thin coat...costs under $100.  I have plated a few things. Frankly, I would not try to re-plate yours.

Your dial looks fine--leave it alone.

I have replaced several Cricket crystals but it has been a year.  I cannot recall if I used a Sternkreuz, GS Flexo, or some generic.  Do not use a low-dome crystal.  I seem to remember having an issue with the sweep second hitting the crystal.  Here is a side view of the Cricket I am wearing...OH NO...looks like there is a crack!  I know that I have accidentally whacked this thing a few times--I wear it constantly.

[swiss2k]

Thank you for the advice,@LittleWatchShop. I have found a shop near me that could plate the watch for around 150$, and the thickness is around 10microns. Also, they could do more.

So, I guess if doing it yourself is 100$ then 150$ with better results totally makes sense? 

[LittleWatchShop]

21 minutes ago, swiss2k said:

So, I guess if doing it yourself is 100$ then 150$ with better results totally makes sense? 

Yes...and it will be done by professionals!

[Neverenoughwatches]

On 10/14/2022 at 6:06 PM, swiss2k said:

Day 1. Disassembly or what do we really have. 

Crystal: Definitely needs to be replaced. When measuring I have 30.5-30.6mm, in the Sternkreuz Gezamtkatalog G22 there is only one that might fit is XAG306.697 (not sure how tight it would sit though). Also ho idea how it might look... Is it possible anyone knows the a part number?

Case and dial: Well I seen better dials, but also seen a lot worse. Does it make sense to invest in replanting the case? What do you guys think? 

Movement: Looks clean. But someone had laid his dirty little hands on it. The sprint ring, locker ring, on the alarm hand is damaged. 

Eyup matey thats a nice timepiece that gets a nod from folk in the know. I would leave the dial alone its ok, it looks like a thin coat lacquer that might lift along with some lettering if you try any restoration on it. Good luck with the plating it will be a cracking watch if it restores and polishes up  well.

[swiss2k]

Update. 28 Oct. part 1.

From my last post I was searching for the spring that holds the alarm arm wheel. I did find a replacement. A word of advice, do not ever remove it, literally never. Only if its broken, other wise God forbid. Putting it back is such a pain. 

Update. 28 Oct. part 2.

Movement. I am pretty sure everyone has this problem once in a while. When you ask your self if watchmaking is really something you want to spend your time on. 

Well this one really really tasted my patience. I had it assembled and disassembled back and forth 3-4 time. Was not running no matter what I do. Turns out the problem was in the balance wheel, with out its jewels it would rattle allover the place and not take up momentum (others that I worked on didn't behave that way).

 

So, from Rate +73, 167 Amp. and 1.5 Beat Error I have the following (check picture). 

 

Now it runs more or less stable, but some times speed up, some times slows down. Why?

Beat error. I could make it 0, but! if I do the balance speeds up so fast that adjusting to max slow position still doesn't help it. It runs +30-50s per day. What are my options? 

Edited October 28, 2022 by swiss2k

[LittleWatchShop]

Where did you find rhe spring so quickly??

[swiss2k]

2 hours ago, LittleWatchShop said:

Where did you find rhe spring so quickly??

I assume that's sarcasm, or maybe not. But I couldn't even find a part number for that thing. So I contacted Vulcain, and ordered a couple from their newer models. Turn out they fit older models.  

[LittleWatchShop]

2 hours ago, swiss2k said:

I assume that's sarcasm, or maybe not. But I couldn't even find a part number for that thing. So I contacted Vulcain, and ordered a couple from their newer models. Turn out they fit older models.  

No, I was not sarcastic...truly questioning. 

Vulcain appears to be in somewhat of a revival state.  I have a sneaking suspicion that they are still using the Cal 120 platform.

Next question...will they sell parts to anyone??  It would be great if they did.

If I may inquire...what did they charge for the spring.  I bought one in 2021 for 20 Euro.

[swiss2k]

@LittleWatchShop " ... Cal 120 platform" - may be. New movements do look like the old ones. 

"... will they sell parts to anyone??" - yes they do, but from new series. They do not support old ones, I guess I just got lucky with the spring.  

"... 20 Euro." - yeah, that's more or less exactly what I payed. 

 

Any thoughts/advice on the issues I've motioned (with the beat error and balance wheel going fast then slower)? Thnx

Edited October 28, 2022 by swiss2k

[LittleWatchShop]

14 minutes ago, swiss2k said:

@LittleWatchShop " ... Cal 120 platform" - may be. New movements do look like the old ones. 

"... will they sell parts to anyone??" - yes they do, but from new series. They do not support old ones, I guess I just got lucky with the spring.  

"... 20 Euro." - yeah, that's more or less exactly what I payed. 

 

Any thoughts/advice on the issues I've motioned (with the beat error and balance wheel going fast then slower)? Thnx

Can you post a readout from the timer?

[swiss2k]

2 problems.

1. When I adjust beat error to 0, rate goes to +50-60 and not adjustment helps. 
2. Amplitude jumps from 250 to 290 back and forth, witch affects rate. Does that on its own. 
 

Edited October 29, 2022 by swiss2k

[mikepilk]

1 hour ago, swiss2k said:

2 problems.

1. When I adjust beat error to 0, rate goes to +50-60 and not adjustment helps. 
2. Amplitude jumps from 250 to 290 back and forth, witch affects rate. Does that on its own. 
 

That doesn't sound right !

How does the hairspring look at the regulator pins? Are the pins correctly spaced, is the spring pushing against one of the pins, is the hairspring vertical (not twisted) at the pins?

[swiss2k]

@mikepilkFrom what I can tell, looks normal. 

Edited October 30, 2022 by swiss2k

[mikepilk]

Yep, looks fine to me. 

It doesn't make sense that adjusting the beat error 1ms makes such a difference in rate - 1ms is only an angular movement of 2°. 

And the amplitude jumping around so much is odd.

I've had similar odd behaviour, and it turned out to be either a loose hairspring collet, or loose roller or jewel. Unlikely as your balance looks to be in original and excellent condition. But worth a check !

[swiss2k]

What if there is some oil between the forth wheel and the escape wheel, and that oil is just on one side of it, I thought. What if its sticking on one side? 

I took off the escape wheel, the pallet fork and the forth wheel. Cleaned them one more time. Removed any oil that might have been on the pallet forks jewels (leaving the pallet fork unoiled). And assembled it all back. 

Results: Amplitude now is jumping from 300 to 320 (I assume that's because the pallet fork is now snappier)... Meaning I was partially right (about the above mentioned), but the problem still persists, only difference its in a higher range  

 

 

Edited October 30, 2022 by swiss2k

[LittleWatchShop]

I would carefully observe the escape wheel and pallet fork and see if it is mis locking or skipping a tooth now and then.

I would also test a known good watch to be sure your timer is operating properly.

[swiss2k]

@LittleWatchShoptried other watches, timegrapher seem to work fine.