Tip Of A Stem ?

[frenchie]

Hi everyone,

first let me give Mark Lovick a huge thank you for all the great videos tutorials ! They are superb.

My only previous experience is with a quartz watch that I took apart and put back together (and it worked !!!)

 

So I bought a set of mechanical pocket watches to practice with, and I just finished taking apart the first one, that supposedly doesn't work (nothing to loose :) ), and cleaned it. It looked like someone has spayed the movement  with cooking oil, it was filthy and sticky ! Taking it apart was a breeze, and apart from almost removing the click with the watch fully wound up (I was 1/2 second away from letting go...), it went well. (One of) The reason why I think it was listed as non working, is that there is no stem/crown assembly. Needless to say I had fun unwinding the watch without the stem.

 

From my limited knowledge, I'm pretty sure that the setting lever, yoke and yoke spring, and the 2 pinions that go on the stem are there. When I took the pinions out, they were on what I think is the end of the stem. See the attachment : this is what I believe is the end of the broken stem.

 

Question 1 : is this indeed the end of the stem ?

Question 2 : How do I figure out the size of the replacement stem ? I found a whole bunch of stems online but I'm not sure what to measure to find a correct replacement (I don't have the threaded part....) 

 

Unrelated question : I haven't touched the spring barrel yet, because I don't have a spring winder and I'm not sure I can put the spring back in the barrel without one. Is there a technique to put a spring back in a barrel without tools ? Or is it better to save a bit of money and get a proper spring winder ?

 

Thanks for all the help you can give me !

[SeikoWatch]

First, welcome to this forum Frenchie..

in second position, what is the brand of this Watch ?

If you can put a picture or two from this Watch, it will be better :)...

 

for the rest like the spring, we absolutely need a picture of the movement ;)

[frenchie]

Thanks for the quick reply!

It's a movement from the internet... The dial says : Geniale.

No brand that I can see on the movement itself...

 

Here is a pic.

I'l try to get some more later.

 

[SeikoWatch]

ok no problem.. if you have the missing tip at the end of the crown, you'll have a good idea for the lenght of  the stem ;) but I don't know  ( geniale ) probably made in France

[DJW]

^{That is definitely the remaining piece of the winding stem! It also appears to be a replacement of the original stem. It seems a little Crude compared to the finish of the movement. But, it's actually quite lucky that you have that so that you can compare it to others to replace. Because I have the tools to do it, I would turn a new stem on my lathe while using that piece as a guide. You may get lucky and find a replacement if you can identify the actual manufacturer of the movement, though.}

 

^{As for mainspring winders, I have a set for pocket watches and a set for wristwatches. But, every now and then, I'll be forced to wind the spring into the barrel using my fingers (I know this is frowned upon), but sometimes it's the only way I can get it installed at all! The biggest issue it not to kink or deform the spring in any way. This will have negative effects, causing the spring to bind on the barrel or even break under tension.}

 

^{You will definitely need to invest in a good set of winders...}

 

^Regards,

^Don

Edited February 28, 2014 by DJW

[frenchie]

Thanks for all the replies.

Here are some more pictures.

 

I think my next step is to put the watch back together without the barel that I have to clean to make sure all the parts move the right way. In the meantime, I'll try to find a spring winder and a stem somewhere. Talking about stems, is there a standard for them ? I see stems with a brand (Rolex for example) and stems that don't seem to be branded. I found a chart with measurements and TAP numbers, but I'm nit sure what the diameter if the missing part is... If they're standard, I could get an assortment of stems off the evilbay and one of them has to fit... (right :) )

 

As for the movement brand, or manufacturer, I have no clue. I'm guessing the watch has been taken apart before, there are a couple of pieces with hand marked numbers on them (like someone hand numbered the parts maybe ?). I could find no other marking anywhere... Is there a hidden place to look ?

[SeikoWatch]

Hard to tell you.. no mark no brand... a frankenwatch lolll..have a great day frenchie

[frenchie]

If anything it'll be good practice :gym:

[DJW]

Thanks for all the replies.

Here are some more pictures.

 

I think my next step is to put the watch back together without the barel that I have to clean to make sure all the parts move the right way. In the meantime, I'll try to find a spring winder and a stem somewhere. Talking about stems, is there a standard for them ? I see stems with a brand (Rolex for example) and stems that don't seem to be branded. I found a chart with measurements and TAP numbers, but I'm nit sure what the diameter if the missing part is... If they're standard, I could get an assortment of stems off the evilbay and one of them has to fit... (right :) )

 

As for the movement brand, or manufacturer, I have no clue. I'm guessing the watch has been taken apart before, there are a couple of pieces with hand marked numbers on them (like someone hand numbered the parts maybe ?). I could find no other marking anywhere... Is there a hidden place to look ?

First, I would focus on stems for Swiss pocket watches and not American pocket watches. These are two totally different designs. If you are based in the US, Ofrei.com offers 2 assortments of Swiss pocket watch stems for sale. You might get lucky and find one that works!

 

The tap size has more to do with the size and pitch of threads on the stem (the part you don't have), or the part that the winding crown screws onto.

 

The hand marked numbers could be a couple of things... First, if it is written on a part of the watch that has serviceable parts, then that could be a part number put there by the watchmaker who serviced that watch. This way, the next time the watch comes in for service, the watchmaker would not have to take time to look up the proper replacement part again. The other reason could be a common set of numbers that are inscribed onto every part of the watch during disassembly. This way, when the watchmaker is cleaning multiple watches in a watch cleaning machine at the same time, they can quickly identify and sort all the parts for each watch.

 

Unless there is a stamped number or series of numbers, typically none of these hand written numbers will identify the manufacturer of the movement.

 

Now, if you can identify a part number, say a balance staff or a mainspring part number that may be inscribed on a watch part, then you may be able to cross reference that number to a part catalog, and thus help to identify what that part may fit. for example... If I see a number inscribed in the balance cock like #1901 then I can research this number and possibly find out that this is a factory number for a balance staff to an Elgin Pocket watch. Just an idea!

 

Don

[frenchie]

I'll have to get a set of winders and see what happens...

 

In the meantime, I cleaned all the jewels with a piece of wood, undid the spring barrel and the main spring, cleaned it all, lubrication, and put it back together. By hand :)  My hand was so sore when I was done with the spring, from gripping just with the tip of my fingers... Going super slowly it's doable to put the spring back in a pocket watch. Anything smaller, I wouldn't even try.

I guess I got lucky this time.

 

I put it all back together following the video (minus the winding stem part) and voila, I have a ticking watch !!!!! I feel like a proud daddy right now !! From dead watch to ticking watch !! It probably is not very accurate, but its a practice watch, so I'll probably end up taking it apart again just for **BLEEP** and giggles.

This is really fun.

 

I'll post an update when I get a working stem in there.

[SeikoWatch]

Well frenchie, I'm happy for you because your watch is tickin' now :)... you can accurate your watch by touching the needle on the coq... it takes a couple times but it's not a problem. :)