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Showing results for 'accutron' in topics.
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Background: Somebody sent me an "Accutron" that was a gift many years ago. Somewhere along the way, the Accutron died and somebody replaced it with an NH35. It, of course was too thick, so they removed the auto wind oscillating weight. Ouch!!! Since the dial feet did not match, they cut them off the Accutron dial and used sticky tabs to attach the dial to the NH35. What a frigging abomination!!!! Anyway, this "somebody" sent me two accutron movements in hopes that I could return the watch to its former glory. OMG, these were hacked up as well. But!!! I was able to make one functioning movement. Cleaned, oiled, and soon to be adjusted. The BIG issue now is the dial. I am pretty sure I cannot solder feet on the dial. I did give it a try. No bueno. Here is my idea. Drill holes through the dial where the dial feet belong. Then insert and glue posts (feet). I checked the visibility of the dial through the crystal and the drill holes would not be visible. Thoughts??
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OK, I am on my fifth or sixth 218 service with great success. Once you establish a methodology, these are relatively easy. I am servicing a 218 D now and it will not hum I have verified the following -drive coils -phasing coil -resistors -capacitor -EB junction, CB junction (have not verified beta) Kind of at a loss. All connections seem to be fine. Wondering if the watch was accidentally demagnetized??? Using a compass, I verified that the tuning fork does have some magnetic attraction. Scratching my head.
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For the time when these were introduced, the technology was truly leading edge. The 218 movement seems solid...not difficult to service. But...and this is a BIG but, Accutron (really Bulova) fails at the non-tech stuff. While I like the two-piece back, the case quality is generally poor. The dials seem fine enough, but the hands are low quality compared to a nice swiss watch. I have one case where the crown interface appears to have been milled incorrectly. Not sure...still investigating.
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I suppose if you like the other PDF may be of like this one. it's not a complete PDF it only has 214 and 218 stuff. Bulova had parts kits a box with a large card that when in the lid and all the envelopes corresponding to the parts and I think they would add empty envelopes. So if you were servicing these at one time it would be smart to have these although I'm pretty sure they were expensive. So somebody kindly scanned them into a nice PDF I had scanned a couple of the cards but this is much nicer it's all in one place. So then were missing all the other watches but typically the majority of the tuning fork of Bulova would be 214 and 218 and the others while popular not as much and I don't think every single other one had a parts kit that was probably at 230 kit and a 221 kit don't think there was a 219 kit may be. Bulova Accutron Parts.pdf
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When I clean the index wheel I put it in the Accutron index wheel holder. What have found is that while holding the arbor, the wheel flops around because the tweezer will not hold it in a fixed orientation. Well, I fixed that!!! I modified a set of 3C tweezers by adding a notch so that the index wheel arbor is held orthogonal to the length of the tweezer and will not wobble. The notch is on both legs of the tweezer but only one is shown.
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fortunately when I post things I usually put them in a particular folder so I can find them for uploading so conveniently they were together. oh and yes you really would need the stem thing if you are installing this for the first time. If it's already in an existing watch it by theory should be much easier to do unless you change the back gasket. In other words on a 214 the location of the crown versus the back gaskets and the movement the back casket will of course move things around. then while I was remembering this that's why I uploaded this to some other group somebody was having a running issue on a 214 with a hack although unless you disassemble you won't actually know if you have a hack or not sort of. So I uploaded to comment on if it has a hack it could be an issue in these would be the issues why. In other words the crown is on the back if dirt gets under the crowd that changes spacing if the back gasket thickness should change. Which unfortunately will occur today as you may not really get original 214 gaskets and they have replacements and of the thickness is different it can be an issue. Oh and then if you are installing this for the first time you'd need the thing on the stems because you would have to change those to get one of the right length. I very distinctly remember when I installed one of these I was a student in school which was quite a while ago and I do not remember being a pleasant experience. Because as you can see with the instructions you have to set everything up and put it all together and if not right then you have to yes they can be a fun experience. I don't think I've ever done a 214 after that that had a hack though Accutron 214 hack.PDF Accutron 214 stems.PDF
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I use M56-b (AKA LGN) for pivots (surprise surprise!). It has a lower viscosity than 9020. Of course there is this craziness from the Accutron service manual. I am taking a shine to servicing these things. Each one gets easier. Still a little tricky getting the index and pawl fingers just right. My cleaning methodology is pretty refined now, using the ultrasonic for the clean and an L&R Master to spin dry between each step as well as dry in the last step. Found the right jars for the job and printed a lifter to lift the basket out of the jars.
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OK, I have recently services four Accutron 218s and disassembled another (my first) which is now a parts watch...lol. Feeling really good about my results and my methodology. Accutron recommends OL-207 for all but jewel settings. OK, if these watches I have serviced were lubricated in this way...I am not a fan! It appears to dry and then flakes everywhere. When confined (e.g., center wheel) it seems to gum up and freeze. I determined not to use it--NO. I am using Molykote for those lube points instead. Shields up--prepared for incoming!
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Yes, on an Accutron the power for the train is actually generated at the escapement, so counter-intuitively that tiny delicate index wheel generates a lot of torque by the time you get to the hands. This is why you see Accutrons still running after decades of no oil, but when you get them apart, you see pivots almost completely worn away and such.
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This 218 Accutron center wheel (which functions like a cannon pinion) is loose resulting losing time due to slipping. Not sure if there is a way to tighten it. Funny thing, I had a donor so I stole the center wheel only to find that it was shorter! Yes, the donor had no date, but the fixing watch is day-date.
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I have a couple of these movement holders for 218 Accutrons. In order to mount the movement, the holder must be splayed ever so slightly and then released when the movement is in place. I have been splaying with a screwdriver, but this morning, I made an add-on tool that does the work for me. I turned a slight conical profile with the initial diameter equal to the hole in the holder in rest position. I turned to a larger diameter enough to open the holder enough for the movement to drop in. Then I tapped the small end and made a threaded button. The tool is mounted in the holder in a semi-permanent way. When you want to insert the movement, press the pin from the inside of the holder and it splays out. Once the movement is inserted, the outside butt is pressed so that the holder collapses on the movement. I made two of these. One is mounted on the holder with a brass button. The other I show sitting alone so that the structure is obvious. The second one uses the brass button--easier to turn and thread.
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My grandfather died back in 2004, and my mom gave me his Accutron. I've wanted to restore it for years, and finally have the experience and confidence to do so. Of course the first thing I did was slip and bend the pawl finger, but at least it's not my first rodeo and I was able to fix that. Not running with an Accu-Cell, but the index wheel is pretty grungy so I took it apart and powered the circuit without the train installed. The fork kicks up, but instead of a hum I get a pulsing vibration. Never seen that before. I checked the electronics, and the resistor reads about 990 ohms instead of the 2,200 ohms we expect. The capacitor reads 197 pF, which is reasonably close to the 220 pF we're looking for. I'm going to give it a thorough cleaning and see if it'll run, but I have a feeling I'm going to be replacing the resistor and capacitor. A much harder task on the 218 than on the 219. Edit to add in some circuit diagrams, in case anyone is here for 218 diagnosis help:
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I have spoke about my remote Accutron repair center (my house in Bryan, TX). Here I will outline the cleaning methodology I will use. 1) the index wheel will be installed into the official Accutron holder (seen in the first picture). 2) the index wheel and holder will be placed in the bottom of an L&R basket and then covered (second and third pictures) 3) the two plates will be placed on top of the separator lid (not shown) 4) the compartmental holder will be where all of the wheels are placed, yoke, etc are placed (no parts shown in the pictures), and the top lid placed 5) the electronics, tuning fork, the pawl are separated out and placed into a petri dish. Using a syringe with needle, I will bath these parts with one-dip. 6) the basket will be immersed into a jar with L&R cleaner (what I show is ammoniated, but I am going to use non-ammoniated going forward (when it arrives). 7) the jar is placed into an ultrasonic machine for a short period (maybe 5 minutes) remove the basket and spin dry using an L&R spinning machine (not shown) 9) place the basket into a jar of L&R rinsing solution (not shown) and run in the ultrasonic for a short period 10) remove the basket and spin dry as before 11) place the basket into a second jar of rinsing solution and run in the ultrasonic for a short period 12) remove the basket and spin dry as before 13) the final step is to move the basket to the drying station of the L&R cleaning machine I would appreciate thoughts on this.
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Bench Testing Seiko 3823 Movement
JohnR725 replied to RickTock's topic in Quartz and Tuning Fork Battery Operated Watches
Yes you're going to have to make a New Year's resolution to get a life and not spend so much time here oh wait, I suppose that means I'd have to make the same silly New Year's resolution of having a life and spending too much time here so just forget about that silly thing everyone has to have a hobby. It's a secret code word you need the secret decoder ring to grasp its meaning. It's a reference to something forbidden at least by a horological Association Which is explained in the paragraphs on the webpage. http://www.pocketwatchrepair.com/catt/pwr-supply.php Here's another example of something similar. Then if you didn't have the Bulova holder for electronics they do make nice small clips that will clip on to the watch itself without a problem. Because that's typically what I do with my power supply just don't have a picture of the clips that I'm using but I see if I find something https://electric-watches.co.uk/accutron-test-meter-mark-3/ Here's what I'm using what I work on electric watches their very nice and tiny and providing you have really lightweight wire that don't pull on anything but basically any of the really tiny microbe grabbing for electronics would work Here's a link to all kinds of places you can buy them from then you do want to buy them into separate colors C keep track your plus and minus so typically that The red and black https://www.pomonaelectronics.com/products/test-clips/micrograbber-test-clip-do-it-yourself-available-ten-colors -
Did you notice the specifications for your 25 µA meter? It's a plus or minus meter it's not a 0 to 25 kind of. EBay is still a nice place to get meters if you're patient anticipating someday I might build a new power supply I managed to get a 0 to 20 µA meter who knows where though it is lurking in the house they purchased a while back. The other source of service manuals for Accutron Is it just download the PDF's as the book is basically a copy of the service manual anyway. The link below has all sorts of interesting Bulova stuff with all of the tuning fork service males etc. found basically at the bottom of the page https://www.mybulova.com/vintage-bulova-catalogs
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OK...more like a "place" than a "center." I will be spending half my time here, so I needed some way to do horology. Since Accutrons need a subset of my tools, and I have about 50 to work on, I decided that I could setup to do just Accutrons here. I still need a cleaning setup...working on that! I have the microscope, test set, and the hand tools. Today, I took an Accutron that was not working, opened it up, adjusted the index and got it running. It needs a cleaning, but I was proving the tool set to see if anything was missing. Hopefully I will solve the cleaning methodology over the next couple of weeks.
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This is an interesting thread. I am trying to setup a methodology solely for Accutrons. Since the manual says to use ultrasonic, I have to deviate from my L&R Master cleaning system that I use for mechanical watches. And I just rebuilt another one for my remote location where I will be doing this work...oh well. The last few days I have been working on two "learner" accutrons. My method is to use the L&R Fine (which is all that I have) in a mason jar and then in my ultrasonic (small jewelry type). I run two short cycles, then do a pre rinse in L&R rinse and then a final rinse in same. Then I take the parts out and set them under an incandescent lamp (60 watt) to dry. I also puff off the parts to accelerate evaporation. I treat the pawl and index fingers separately by dunking them in one-dip. My glass cup is too small for the tuning fork, so I just squirt one-dip with a syringe. A kludge for now. I also dip the index wheel in one-dip. This seems to work. I have ordered some petri dishes that are larger and will allow the tuning fork to immerse fully. I know that some suggest putting all of this in the ultrasonic, but I am not ready for that yet. In a perfect world, I would have jars that accommodated my L&R basket. That way, I could put the parts in that and on the last step, I could use my L&R Master to do the drying. I am looking for the appropriate jar. Am I overthinking all of this. Perhaps. But, I have about 50 of these to repair, so it is worth the effort to design a really nice process. On a side note, the two watches I have worked on had crappy black residue and one had the seep second stuck with the black crap. I think it is the molybdenum disulfide that Accutron recommends...dries up resulting in bad things. I will not use the recommended oil, but will instead use MolyKote for those places. I see no reason why not. I am gonna order some L&R 566 and associated rinse for the long haul, but I used what I had this first round.
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This is the same watch I have posted about under different topics. After assembly, the date does not advance. In the pictures I show the Date Trip Arm and the Date Trip Wheel in different positions. What is happening is that the hook on the Date Trip Wheel is releasing the Date Trip Arm BEFORE it moves far enough to grab the Date Indicator. Everything moves freely and I have lubricated according to the manual instructions. I wonder if the Arm or the Wheel have worn to cause this problem. BTW, before I opened this watch up for service, I noticed that the date was not working. Thoughts?