Long Case Clock identification ...

[Endeavor]

Hello All;

I received a long case clock, weight driving pendulum with a strike & time-train. it has a date- & Moon-complication and has two sub-dials; one for the seconds and the other for the moon-position/day.

It is said to be a Danish "Bornholmer" clock; I have so my doubts but it may well be !? Is there anybody who can identify this clock, can put a date era on it, has some information about it? Is it indeed a Danish or more a British design?

Here are some pictures, the first are taking by the owner and aren't the best of quality;

I taped-off the winding barrels, so the gut-wire wouldn't be all over the place when the weights came off;

Here a better view of one of the pillars design, if that would be any use for putting a date on the clock?

Then there is on the bottom of the (front) dial: " Ben Shuck" "forth Difs".

And there are some "engravings" in the back of the dial, two are highlighted with arrows, but there are a few more. The bigger one bottom right says " B RIGHT" or "BRIGHT" and the top-left is a (watch-maker) "unreadable name, Aug 1888". There are other "unreadable names" with dates like 1894, 1898 and on the back of the movement plate there is "HW 1946"

Anybody has some idea's / know-how / suggestion where to look or what this clock may be?

If more pictures, from a different angle or part are required, please let me know .....

 

Edited January 6, 2018 by Endeavor

[StuartBaker104]

A little local knowledge tells us that “Difs” is actually Diss, a town in Norfolk. The “f” has no cross though it and is a commonly seen script form in old English as the first letter “s” in a pair.

Then, given that “forth” has no capital letter it is reasonable to assume it has nothing to do with a place name and is actually part of the maker’s name.

Hence we try a Google search for “Ben Shuckforth Diss” and we find this article by Brian Loomes... https://www.brianloomes.com/collecting/shuckforth/index.html

Ben Shuckforth worked between circa 1710 and 1760 and I wouldn’t doubt the dial hails from that era. I don’t know enough about these old clocks to comment if the movement and case are likely to be original, but take a good look at the way the dial is attached to the movement. Doesn’t seem to match the quality of the rest of the piece.

If you want to know more than you find on here then I would send pictures to Brian Loomes and see if he replies

Edited January 6, 2018 by StuartBaker104

[StuartBaker104]

By the way - slightly envious of this clock. Need one of those one day!

[Endeavor]

@StuartBaker104: That's some amazing Sherlock Holmes detective work Stuart ! What did you say you were doing for a living??

That's fantastic news and it confirms my suspicion that the clock had nothing to do with Denmark ...... it is way too sophisticated and too good ! I starting dismantling the movement and one can see the quality and that all is hand made, a completely different league than the cheap, mass produced American clock ... no comparison.

For sure I'll write to Brian Loomes and ask him whether the whole clock (case / movement / dial) is still an original Ben Shuckforth clock. If he replies, I'll report back to the forum what he says !

39 minutes ago, StuartBaker104 said:

By the way - slightly envious of this clock. Need one of those one day!

Then to think that the clock has been standing still, full of spiderwebs, neglected in a corner for decades until I put my head around the corner and asked "what's wrong with it?" "I don't know, have a look if you want"

Isn't it amazing what can come on one's path !!?? What a find !!

[Endeavor]

@StuartBaker104: I had a good look at the dial and the movement. Nothing conclusive here, but the dial pillars match up perfectly with the only 4x holes in the movement plate. Also the hand-made screws holding the dial ornaments to the copper plate are identical to the screws holding the escape wheel bracket. Again, that isn't conclusive, it may have been a watchmaker who had a whole box full of these screws, but at the moment I don't notice anything which makes me go "Hmmm ........." .

[Endeavor]

Now we know the name of the maker, we can search more "to-the-point". It starts to look like that I'm not dealing with a "cheapy". Here a kind of look-alike, without a moon-complication: http://www.sellingantiques.co.uk/513180/small-green-lacqueredchinoiserie-longcase-clock-by-shuckforth-of-diss/

Things that make you go Hmmm .........

[StuartBaker104]

Great picture on the seller’s own web page showing a side view of the movement which should allow you to do some comparison...

http://www.british-antiqueclocks.com/stock/chinoiserie-decorated-longcase-clock-by-shuckforth-of-diss/

S

[Endeavor]

That's indeed a great picture of the movement and it looks almost identical to the movement on hand. Also the movement / dial combination seems to be the same. Striking works seem different, but the movements are in the same "style".

Movement of the clock for sale;

Clock at hand;

Even the wooden bottom plate seems original, even though the mounting (system) has changed. However the wood has still the two original holes underneath the movement pillars; the way it was originally mounted as seen on the picture "clock for sale".

I had a reply from Brain Loomes; unfortunately he seems very ill with a back problem and can not devote any time to the clock at hand. He writes that he wrote an article in his book about Ben Shuckforth and his clocks are easily identified and are not rare. He wrote an article about him in May 2009 Clocks Magazine. Of course, what "not rare" exactly entails if not clear .... I can't believe that Ben Shuckforth had in 1710-1760 a mass productions-line going. Thank you Brain for your information and wish you a speedy recovery !

 

Edited January 7, 2018 by Endeavor