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Posted

Hi,

I have  341-021 Hermle wall clock, which stops working when I assemble it in its box with its pendulum. 

1. The spring is working: I removed the pallet mechanism that controls the escape wheel, and used finger to stop escape wheel, wound the key, the escape wheel spun till the whole spring was unwound. 

2. Is the time between tic and toc exactly the same as between toc and tic : This I am not entirely sure off, wasn't sure why this would have changed. I tried the basic way of visual checking but I might be totally wrong.  

With my thread and stone arrangement, the clock keep ticking so my guess is that mechanically its all fine. But the moment I assemble it in its box the pendulum stops with 5-10min of working. Pendulum doesn't keep the same pace and gradually stops.

Regards,

Jeet

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Posted

This clock should have "automatic" beat setting (beat is the eveness between the tic/toc); you pull the pendulum as far as it will go in one direction and release it, and a friction clutch at the pallet shifts as the pendulum's amplitude decreases putting it in beat. It's not a foolproof system, sometimes you need to manually adjust it some more, but if the movement is otherwise in good shape the auto-set should get it running.

 

These modern German movements defy the concept of "German quality". Typically after a decade or so they will need a number of bushings installed and pivots polished* to get them to run correctly. 

 

*many are not even heat treated, just plated, and when the plating flakes off that's about it unless you repivot

  • Like 2
Posted

I tried adjusting the beat in a way you suggested, and so far so good. In a general suggestion, if this clock stops working, is it worth getting it fixed i.e repivotting, As you mentioned that the overall quality of clock is not great in that sense. I suppose it will be more or as expensive as to get a new movement, then getting an old one repaired. Apart from the fact that I love old things and very much love to repair and keep using if I can. Also what are the tell-tale signs of the workout escape wheel ? 

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    • Welcome to the forum, enjoy. 
    • Yes, the specific old tools do exist, but may be having one is not needed as they are not cheap, and also You will be able to do without it well enough. My advice will be to use regular depthing tool and adjust it for the exact distance between pallet fork and escape wheel bearings from the watch. Then remove the shellac from the pallet that now doesn't pass the ew teeth and move this pallet in. Then put the pallet fork and ew on the depthing tool and check how they lock. They should not lock when the pallet is in, but You will little by little move the pallet out and locking will appear. Then move just an idea out for reliable work and apply shellac, then check if things are still the same. You have to observe where the teeth fall on the pallets - it must be just a little below the edge between impulse and rest planes. Then You must check how everything behaves in the movement This Potence tool is so ingenious, but actually, the traditional way to do the things is much more simple. Arrange the parts not on the pillar plate, but on the cover plate. Only the central wheel will remain on the pillar plate, secured by the cannon pinion.
    • There is a tool that was made for setting up and adjusting escapements of full plate watches.  There were two styles, the picture below shows both of them.  The lower tool held a movement plate and the vertical pointed rods were adjusted to hold the unsupported pivots of the lever and escape wheel.  There was also a version of this tool that had 3 adjustable safety centres so that the balance pivot could be supported by the tool :  The other version I’m aware of is the Boynton’s Escapement Matching and Examining Tool came as a set of two or three clamps that gripped the watch plate and held the safety centres for the pivots : These do turn up on eBay from time to time.  For some escapement work, you can set up the parts in a regular depthing tool, with the centres set according to the distance between the corresponding pivot holes on the movement.  I hope this helps, Mark
    • Once you are aware of the problem, you can adjust as necessary. I have a couple of the Omega 10xx, and they are not my favourites. They seem a bit flimsy and not as solid as previous generation Omega. But I think that's true of a lot of movements from the 70-80s. For me, the 50-60s is the peak in watch movements, where the design criteria was quality, not saving the last penny.
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