Collections of unbranded (un 'cal'ed) parts--why??

[LittleWatchShop]

I recently bought a watchmaker's estate.  Among the spoils are bins of unbranded watch parts: balance wheels, third wheels, fourth wheels, cannon pinions, etc. etc.

I can see the value of bins of screws, staffs, crowns, etc. but the rest boggles the mind.  What is the chance that some random third wheel will fit an Elgin 6/0 movement (for example)?

Am I missing something.

[SwissSeiko]

Its possible. One thing I have learned when sizing and cutting wheels, is the module and diameter are very important to get right. I'd like to think that most watch manufacturers had some set size and module they used universally, but I haven't taken the time to measure my assortment of wheels to find out. You could sort them by tooth count I suppose, then move from there. But the entire train is dependent on how many teeth the main barrel has, and its designated beat rate it wants to achieve. Plus the pinion on the wheel will need to match what the watch you're using it for needs it to be.

 

From my understanding, the first thing they do when designing a train, is calculate the tooth counts, then select a module to cut them to. The final diameter is kind of the product of those two. So I'm not sure if two different wheel manufacturers would be the same. Could always fire up the lathe and make on yourself!

[LittleWatchShop]

1 minute ago, SwissSeiko said:

Could always fire up the lathe and make on yourself!

Part of my long term plan, but not sure I will ever get there.  Would love to see your gear cutting setup

[tomh207]

This has the potential to be a really interesting and informative conversation 

 

Tom

[nevenbekriev]

It is often possible to make a wheel that is missing by assembling table from one wheel and pinion from another. You will need to figure (or calculate) the OD and teeth count of the pinion and table and then search the collection of wheels You have. The bigger the collection is - the better.

[LittleWatchShop]

40 minutes ago, nevenbekriev said:

It is often possible to make a wheel that is missing by assembling table from one wheel and pinion from another. You will need to figure (or calculate) the OD and teeth count of the pinion and table and then search the collection of wheels You have. The bigger the collection is - the better.

Interesting...but I will have to count teeth until the cows come home!!

[RichardHarris123]

A couple of dentists on here, they could help counting teeth. 

[mbwatch]

17 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

they could help counting teeth. 

As long as it's fewer than 32 or so.  Escape wheels or pinion leaves.

[nevenbekriev]

28 minutes ago, LittleWatchShop said:

Interesting...but I will have to count teeth until the cows come home!!

Counting teeth is something that I often do. One reason for such counting is to determine the BPH of a movement. Another reason is to determine parameters of missing wheel. Another - when something is obviously wrong with timekeeping and the BPH is correct for the movement - then always gets clear that someone put wrong wheel(s) and messed things up and got rid of the watch... It mus be clear that not only teeth count is important, but correct mesh is needed and coincidence of modules of wheels/pinions. A lot of reverse engineering is needed in antique watches restoration sometimes.

[LittleWatchShop]

8 minutes ago, nevenbekriev said:

Counting teeth is something that I often do. One reason for such counting is to determine the BPH of a movement. Another reason is to determine parameters of missing wheel. Another - when something is obviously wrong with timekeeping and the BPH is correct for the movement - then always gets clear that someone put wrong wheel(s) and messed things up and got rid of the watch... It mus be clear that not only teeth count is important, but correct mesh is needed and coincidence of modules of wheels/pinions. A lot of reverse engineering is needed in antique watches restoration sometimes.

I suppose, when I run into the situation, I will sort by diameter first since it is quick.  Then sort by pinion, and then by teeth.

[RichardHarris123]

Having a box with random parts seems like bad practice to me. Keep a parts movement in tact, place in a  zip lock bag and label the caliber.  Only one part left, do the same. 

[LittleWatchShop]

35 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Having a box with random parts seems like bad practice to me. Keep a parts movement in tact, place in a  zip lock bag and label the caliber.  Only one part left, do the same. 

Agree.  However, somebody thought differently and I now have lots and lots of parts sorted by type (wheels, balance wheels, pallet forks, etc.).