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Cmmb8519

ETA 2892-A2 Automatic Works - what else can I do?

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Hi all

I just recently finished servicing two Omega Speedmaster Reduced (equipped with the ETA 2892-A2 coupled with chrono module Dubois Dépraz 2020) for a couple of friends and both watches are having the same issue. I'm an amateur and just service watches for family and friends.

The automatic work is not fully winding the movement and both watches are stopping after 6 days of use. Very curious that the two watches are showing exactly the same behavior!!

I have tried everything and I'm not being able to get the automatic work to wind the watches for long period of time without the need to give it a manual wind. What else can I do? People wearing the watches are quite active and don't have the same issue with other automatic watches.

See below a measure of the timegrapher for 6 days of wearing the watch without manual winding (except for first day):

  Rate Amplitude
Day 1 (full manual winding) +20 299
Day 2 +13 280
Day 3 +7 261
Day 4 -23 238
Day 5 -12 211
Day 6 Stopped

 

Some info regarding the service:

- All parts were carefully washed and carefully oiled as per ETA technical chart

- Replaced mainspring with new one ordered from Cousins (GR25341X). I measured both new and old mainsprings and they are they are the same

- Replaced reversing wheel with new one ordered from Cousins

- Checked the oscillating weight and bearing and all seems fine. There is not looseness and it all seems very aligned and in place

- Oiled the oscillating weight bearing with 4 very small drops of Moebius 9010 on 4 of the metal spheres (don't have much experience on this one, hope it is ok)

- All the automatic work seems to work perfectly when I manually tested the rotation of the oscillating weight with the movement out of the case

Only thing I did not replace yet is the bearing of the oscillating weight. I'm reluctant to do so since current one seems to be just fine and I don't to want spend money for a part that seems to be just fine.

What else can I do? 

Many thanks

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Just picked up this thread again. Some auto movements recommend NO lubrication (such as Rolex). Since I have started using only Fixodrop (Epilame)for the reversing wheels I have had no issues. What might be a good test is to remove all mainspring power from the watch and then rotate the oscillating weight a few times and see if the watch springs to life. 

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Thanks all.

I just gave a good clean to the rotor bearing and with no lube on the bearing balls the oscilating weight is rotating much better. I tested while disassembled from the auto work train and it is rotating for 20+sec with half rotation push.

With the watch with no power, the oscilating weight can bring it to life.

Another thing I noticed that i don't know if it is normal behaviour!?
With the movement outside the case, if i move it around to make the oscilating weight rotate, i can have a much more free rotation in the weight if i release some pressure by giving a little manual wind in the crown. It seems that the oscilating weight struggles a bit to give power to the spring when compared with the manual wind. Could be normal behaviour? I'm not sure!

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

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35 minutes ago, Cmmb8519 said:

Thanks all.

I just gave a good clean to the rotor bearing and with no lube on the bearing balls the oscilating weight is rotating much better. I tested while disassembled from the auto work train and it is rotating for 20+sec with half rotation push.

With the watch with no power, the oscilating weight can bring it to life.

Another thing I noticed that i don't know if it is normal behaviour!?
With the movement outside the case, if i move it around to make the oscilating weight rotate, i can have a much more free rotation in the weight if i release some pressure by giving a little manual wind in the crown. It seems that the oscilating weight struggles a bit to give power to the spring when compared with the manual wind. Could be normal behaviour? I'm not sure!

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
 

You get much free rotation of the weight  giving it manual wind, Not a good sign.

 There is a problem in the module as jaycey suspected. Aside from the two reversers check the ratchet wheel's driving wheel, this is the third wheel in the module. No slack of it's arbor in the jewels/ holes when module is installed, just perfect free fit is acceptable. Also check for fault in its gears especially its reduction gear.

Regards joe

 

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With the autowinder installed. Put a dot on the ratchet wheel with a magic marker. Turn the watch to !et the oscilating weight fall under own weight and wind,  turn the watch , do not shake.

The dot  should move indicating, ratchet wheel turning, that is the winder should wind when the weight is falling under own weight, even near full wind.anything less is faulty.

Either the winder, barrel, or both.

While at it, let me explain why lidless. The m/s should not  coil, out of flat/ level. With the lid closed you can only see scratch marks, with lid off you can see the spring coiling. Though strong or new a m/s coiling out of falt is faulty.

Rgards joe

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6 hours ago, Cmmb8519 said:

I tested the oscilating weight (dissassembled from the remaining of automatic works train) to check how much time it rotates. I put it on the vertical and gave it a half rotating push.
It takes 1-2 sec to stop! Does not seem right, does it?

I used basic method of put it in pegwood, but tried to handle it as much as possible in vertical. Even if the test setup is not the best i would assume it would rotate for more time.

I washed the oscilating weight with the bearing installed in the ultra sound machine and after dried put 4 drops of 9010 on the metal spheres.

If it doesn't pass the 30 Second test the video tells you what you need to do. It just doesn't tell you how to actually do it which is replace the ball bearing assembly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kafxnxt0EZY

 

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If it doesn't pass the 30 Second test the video tells you what you need to do. It just doesn't tell you how to actually do it which is replace the ball bearing assembly.

 
All sorted and working fine.

Thanks very much for all the great ideas and changeling thinking.

At the end it was only the oiling of the spheres of the bearing that was creating atriction and stopping the oscilating weight to move with short and slow movements. The 4 small drops of 9010 that I put after assembly were causing this.

After a good cleaning and assembly the bearing without lub it is charging the mainspring well.

Thanks again!!!

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

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