Revisiting an old hobby

[AndyHull]

I should really be more careful when I go hunting round ebay. All sorts of junk tends to follow me home.

This time it was a Philips (Fluke) PM3295 350 MHz Oscilloscope.

I don't really need another oscilloscope of course (can you have too many oscilloscopes I wonder), but it only cost... (drumroll) 0.01p (plus shipping).

My current 'scope is Metrix 803B 40MHz which I picked up about 10 years back and repaired, so if I can get this running it will be a bit of an upgrade.

I can almost guarantee that the power supply will need some work (although it does have a safety stamp from 2020), but other than that I have to admit, that even when you factor in twenty quid for shipping,  it does look like the best bargain I've picked up in a long time.

A 350Mhz oscilloscope is obviously overkill for fixing watches, but great for any other electronics projects that come along.

[tomh207]

Andy, you’re worse than me mate which is saying summat . Got a mk3? I think AVO8 if you’re interested in adding to your collection

 

Tom

[AndyHull]

20 minutes ago, tomh207 said:

Got a mk3? I think AVO8 if you’re interested in adding to your collection

A very generous thought, but I find that when filling the house with "junk", you have to be careful not to fill it too quickly, lest the "authorities" find out. Otherwise you are liable to spend the next few days in the dog house.

[AndyHull]

For the last couple of evenings, I've been working on an Amida 15 Jewel based on the Amida 500 movement from sometime around 1950.
This is a slightly odd mechanism, as it has the initial appearance of a jewelled lever arrangement, but is in fact a pin lever. The movement is well made, and pretty easy to work on.

After a little swithering, I did change the crystal. It looked original, and I would probably have left it alone, but it had yellowed somewhat, but the thing that sealed its fate was the crazing that became evident if the light struck it from just the right direction. 

As you can see, it made a marked difference to its appearance, although some might argue that the yellowing gave it a warmer look. I'm in two minds also regarding the hands. I suspect they might polish nicely, but the nagging voice in my head is saying, they might also end up looking uneven.

It does run reasonably well all things considered. It doesn't quite qualify for the 404 club, as it came in at a rather too hefty price tag of £4.99 GBP. but since I've made a few other exceptions to the rules recently, it may just get an honorary membership.

There are a couple of other issue I need to address. The first is the fixed pins and rather small lug width, which measures at a rather odd 15.3mm. I'll either need to source a strap, or perhaps use this an opportunity to make a custom sized strap for it. 

The second issue is.. do I dare set fire to the old crystal, just to see if it is made of nitrocellulose? If you hear a loud bang and detect the smell of singed eyebrows, then you will know the answer.

Edited May 28, 2023 by AndyHull

[rehajm]

49 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

For the last couple of evenings, I've been working on an Amida 15 Jewel based on the Amida 500 movement from sometime around 1950.
This is a slightly odd mechanism, as it has the initial appearance of a jewelled lever arrangement, but is in fact a pin lever. The movement is well made, and pretty easy to work on.

After a little swithering, I did change the crystal. It looked original, and I would probably have left it alone, but it had yellowed somewhat, but the thing that sealed its fate was the crazing that became evident if the light struck it from just the right direction. 

As you can see, it made a marked difference to its appearance, although some might argue that the yellowing gave it a warmer look. I'm in two minds also regarding the hands. I suspect they might polish nicely, but the nagging voice in my head is saying, they might also end up looking uneven.

It does run reasonably well all things considered. It doesn't quite qualify for the 404 club, as it came in at a rather too hefty price tag of £4.99 GBP. but since I've made a few other exceptions to the rules recently, it may just get an honorary membership.

There are a couple of other issue I need to address. The first is the fixed pins and rather small lug width, which measures at a rather odd 15.3mm. I'll either need to source a strap, or perhaps use this an opportunity to make a custom sized strap for it. 

The second issue is.. do I dare set fire to the old crystal, just to see if it is made of nitrocellulose? If you hear a loud bang and detect the smell of singed eyebrows, then you will know the answer.

I don't usually fancy the yellow crystals but it seems to work with that dial...

...and you can't set fire to it unless you share video. I speak for all of us...

[AndyHull]

11 minutes ago, rehajm said:

...and you can't set fire to it unless you share video. I speak for all of us...

I've just had the wood stove door seal replaced. I was hoping not to need to do that again for a few years.

In the name of science I can't say I'm not tempted. I mean how dangerous can it be? Says the man who encouraged his friend the plumber to use phosphoric acid to dislodge the solidified sodium hydroxide that had blocked the bath U bend. We did take that outside first though, and yes, adding concentrated phosphoric acid to sodium hydroxide crystals and drain sludge is as bad an idea as it sounds.. so we did it several times, laughing like delinquent school boys until the explosions of brown goop stopped. The operation was a success, but sadly the patient died (or rather, melted), and we had to replace the U bend anyway.  Children, please don't try this at home.

Edited May 28, 2023 by AndyHull

[RichardHarris123]

8 hours ago, AndyHull said:

I've just had the wood stove door seal replaced. I was hoping not to need to do that again for a few years.

In the name of science I can't say I'm not tempted. I mean how dangerous can it be? Says the man who encouraged his friend the plumber to use phosphoric acid to dislodge the solidified sodium hydroxide that had blocked the bath U bend. We did take that outside first though, and yes, adding concentrated phosphoric acid to sodium hydroxide crystals and drain sludge is as bad an idea as it sounds.. so we did it several times, laughing like delinquent school boys until the explosions of brown goop stopped. The operation was a success, but sadly the patient died (or rather, melted), and we had to replace the U bend anyway.  Children, please don't try this at home.

Definitely sounds like me.  

[AndyHull]

The ESAQuartz 1501 - (ESA 9183 quartz mechanism) -  "Verity" arrived and got a quick tear down and inspection.

Its a pretty substantial watch. Some might say robust. The case is multipart, and the outer case snugs into the inner one using a rubber gasket, which had turned into the kind of black tarry liquid that is often the fate of gaskets from that period.
 

The actual case back was secured with another gasket, which had turned rock hard and broke when removed, and the battery cover had a third gasket, which seems to be fine. There may be an O ring in the crown tube, but I didn't get that far.

Much cleaning later... just for the record, black tarry liquefied gaskets are removable with olive oil, and I felt it was safe to handle without my biohazard suit. 

The mechanism is completely frozen, and the crown wont move, so a full strip down is in order.

Not tonight though. I'll save that for another day.

Here you can see it next to a modern quartz mechanism for comparison, and also next to my current daily "beater" watch. which rather ironically is actually larger than the "Verity". All that effort and research to make smaller and smaller quartz mechanisms and fashions dictate that watches got bigger, not smaller. Its a strange world we live in.

I must say, the ESAQuartz 1501, and indeed the whole watch is fantastically over engineered, and probably cost a small fortune when new.

If you would like to see a good tear-down of the ESAQuartz 1501 /ESA 9183 @Marcdid a good write up about it here.

https://watchmender.wordpress.com/2019/03/04/smiths-astral-quartz-esa-9183/

Edited June 7, 2023 by AndyHull

[thor447]

6 hours ago, AndyHull said:

The ESAQuartz 1501 "Verity" arrived and got a quick tear down and inspection.

Its a pretty substantial watch. Some might say robust. The case is multipart, and the outer case snugs into the inner one using a rubber gasket, which had turned into the kind of black tarry liquid that is often the fate of gaskets from that period.
 

The actual case back was secured with another gasket, which had turned rock hard and broke when removed, and the battery cover had a third gasket, which seems to be fine. There may be an O ring in the crown tube, but I didn't get that far.

Much cleaning later... just for the record, black tarry liquefied gaskets are removable with olive oil, and I felt it was safe to handle without my biohazard suit. 

The mechanism is completely frozen, and the crown wont move, so a full strip down is in order.

Not tonight though. I'll save that for another day.

Here you can see it next to a modern quartz mechanism for comparison, and also next to my current daily "beater" watch. which rather ironically is actually larger than the "Verity". All that effort and research to make smaller and smaller quartz mechanisms and fashions dictate that watches got bigger, not smaller. Its a strange world we live in.

I must say, the ESAQuartz 1501, and indeed the whole watch is fantastically over engineered, and probably cost a small fortune when new.

 

Speaking of a black tar like liquid, I just came across this on my most recent project.  I haven't ran into this before.  I thought that it was some sort of sealant someone previously tried to apply in place of a gasket.  Are you saying this could be the remains of an old gasket?  The watch is from the 70's, but I'm unsure of the year.  Movement is based on an AS 1687/1688.  

Edited June 7, 2023 by thor447

[JohnR725]

1 hour ago, thor447 said:

Are you saying this could be the remains of an old gasket? 

I've seen were back gaskets do the exact same thing. I even have brand-new back gaskets in a package where they basically just liquefied. There were rumors of a bad batch of rubber for the gaskets at least that was the rumor. Then a crown can get exposed to chemicals also are more likely than the back. But it probably just is the gasket of the crown disintegrated.

[thor447]

52 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

I've seen were back gaskets do the exact same thing. I even have brand-new back gaskets in a package where they basically just liquefied. There were rumors of a bad batch of rubber for the gaskets at least that was the rumor. Then a crown can get exposed to chemicals also are more likely than the back. But it probably just is the gasket of the crown disintegrated.

Usually when I find them they are brittle and disintegrate into tiny pieces.  This one was exactly like you described, a black tar substance, and the first one I've come across.  I suppose it is due to whatever material they originally made it from.  I eventually got it all cleaned up though and got the timekeeping side of the movement assembled tonight. 

I'm thankful that's it's running at all after I lost a screw for about 20 minutes.  Right after I found it I turned around and pinged the click spring into another dimension.  I ended up having to make a replacement spring, but it was a simple shape and worked out in the end.  It's running healthy.  Initial readings were great, and I'll dial it in further over the next few days.  It was my first 36000bph movement on my bench, and that timegrapher was moving quick!

[AndyHull]

I think the issue is with the plasticisers in certain types of synthetic (urethane?) rubber . You will see the same phenomenon happening with old drive belts in equipment like tape decks, VCRs, record decks and such like stuff. 
 

25 minutes ago, thor447 said:

eventually got it all cleaned up

If you encounter any more like this, try using olive oil to clean up the black goop. It works remarkably well.

 

Edited June 7, 2023 by AndyHull

[thor447]

25 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

I think the issue is with the plasticisers in certain types of synthetic (urethane?) rubber . You will see the same phenomenon happening with old drive belts in equipment like tape decks, VCRs, record decks and such like stuff. 
 

If you encounter any more like this, try using olive oil to clean up the black goop. It works remarkably well.

 

Ironically I read that the other day, but I had already cleaned the parts at that point.  I found that my ultrasonic solution of water, simple green, and bit of dish soap did the trick, as it generally does on almost everything.  I wasn't going to take a chance of contaminating my cleaning fluids with whatever that gunk was on the stem.  There were a few stubborn bits of it in the crown tube, so I removed the tube and got it all cleaned out with a smoothing broach and then pushing some Rodico through it.  

I'll try some olive oil the next time I run across one of those.

Edited June 7, 2023 by thor447

[luiazazrambo]

Andy, what am I missing here? What is the movement in red circle?

[AndyHull]

8 hours ago, luiazazrambo said:

Andy, what am I missing here? What is the movement in red circle?

Its just a random modern quartz movement for size comparison. I think its a Ronda, as I have a pile of various new old stock Ronda movements I bought in a job lot. Whatever it is, its similar in size to the one in my Sekonda, but the Sekonda is actually slightly larger (but considerably thinner) than the "Verity".

As I say, its only purpose is to show the relative size difference between the 1970s ESAQuartz 1501 - (ESA 9183 quartz movement) and a 2020s quartz movement.

I put the "Verity" to one side as I wanted to take a look at the Peseux 320 in the little Catorex pocket watch, and who can blame me.

It seems it rather relished the attention as it is now ticking away nicely, and looking almost brand new.

I'll let it run for 24hrs and then set it as close to 0 sec/day as I can.

The chain I put it on is a somewhat utilitarian, so I'll need to keep an eye out for something a little more refined. Its mainly there to lessen the chance of me accidentally launching the watch across the room while I'm carrying it about for testing purposes.

 

Edited June 7, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

 

https://www.instructables.com/Mechanical-Apple-Watch-From-Real-E-Waste-Apple-Wat/

You might enjoy this.

 

[AndyHull]

 

No doubt you are familiar with sand timers and possibly sand clocks, however this is a slightly different take on the idea of sand as a power source. 

The museum website is here -> https://thehouseofautomata.com/

 

[AndyHull]

Well worth watching.

[KarlvonKoln]

10 hours ago, AndyHull said:

Well worth watching.

OMG!!!  It's art!  Functional art!  Thanks so much for sharing this. 

Lots of very handy tips in the video too!

Edited July 10, 2023 by KarlvonKoln

[AndyHull]

38 minutes ago, KarlvonKoln said:

It's art!  Functional art! 

It sure is. I suspect the blue accents on the dial are made from lapis and as to those spectacularly delicate springs, what can I say. Art, science,engineering and human dexterity of the highest order.  

Edited July 10, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

This is sort of off topic, and sort of on topic.

I'm over in India visiting family, and my glasses screw kept unscrewing itself. Now if I were at home, I'd reach for the GS Cement and pop a little in the hole, screw the screw back in and it would be fine for another six months or whatever.

Here in India, I only have access to Amazon (no ebay in India, despite what you might have heard), and I couldn't get GS cement for a reasonable price. Don't ever be tempted to put superglue anywhere near anything optical. It will all end in tears (and cloudy white permanent marks on your lenses).

So I did a little trawling to find out roughly what is in GS cement. I came up with a Chinese clone called Zhanlida E8000 and ordered a tube. It comes in a plastic tube, unlike the aluminium one which GS cement uses, but it does have the thin needle applicator.

So far I'm impressed. It seems to do the trick, and as an added bonus it has "Mad fans around the world".

Pop "e8000 glue" into your favourite "cheap'n cheerful stuff" search box and give it a try. Let me know your thoughts.

Edited July 20, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

I'm just curious to know what is in it.

I know what you are thinking "... obviously it has a watch mechanism in it ..." but what exactly?

I splurged the princely sum of £ 3.86 including postage, to find out. Place your bets ladies and gentlemen.

 

[rossjackson01]

ST 96?

[RichardHarris123]

Pin pallet. 

[AndyHull]

Both good guesses, I'm going to hedge my bets and say perhaps an AS 570, an ETA 390 or something similar from around the 1930s or 40s.
I'm not sure about the case. Obviously the case back is stainless, but I can't tell if the case itself is steel or not. It may be pot metal, but I don't think it is brass, as I don't see any obvious brassy marks and worn plating.
I quite like the dial, and the case lugs, so I would be more than happy to get it running and find some hands and a bezel for it, whatever it is that makes it tick.

Edited July 20, 2023 by AndyHull