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Is there such a thing as a Hairspring assortment?

gmoodyii

By gmoodyii
in Watch Repairs Help & Advice

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gmoodyii Member

gmoodyii

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OK, I know this is a strange question but is there a source for an assortment of different sizes of hairsprings? I know the impossibilities of getting an exact match for a hairspring other from the same movement type but I am looking at a true experimental quest to make something that works.

I know there are still companies out there making hairsprings, just have not been able to find a source for bare hairsprings.

There are hairspring vibrators available on ebay, so I could theoretically attempt to learn how to use one of those.

Will this be sort of like finding a unicorn, my quest for a generic hairspring assortment?

I have one nerve left, just looking for a way to kill it. :)

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nickelsilver Distinguished Member

nickelsilver

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There used to be assortments of hairsprings based on balance diameter. They were iffy at best but they existed. These assortments pop up on ebay sometimes, as well as packs of springs in various CGS numbers and grades. This is really the only resource for hairsprings as the various current makers will only sell hundreds of a given CGS at a time.

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clockboy Distinguished Member

clockboy

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The only assortments are now on eBay. If you know its size then you can use this company. http://www.scotchwatch.com/Hairsprings.html

If you know it's strength and size and are confident in fitting a H/S to a collet there is this company.

http://www.britishprecisionsprings.co.uk/index.html

However this company is very slow with delivery and their sizing method is bit of a mystery. 

 

 

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transporter Super WRT Addict

transporter

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Clockboy, I was going to say British precision springs, although I've never used them as of yet, but i cant understand where I would find the information that they require, if you look at their site page for stock they are asking for strength and a few other bits that i have never heard of.

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praezis Super WRT Addict

praezis

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I think you are better off with the first link. You will have to detemine the needed cgs anyway. This can be done with your balance wheel and any hairspring with known cgs.

The  British springs are from inappropriate material, good for clocks and instruments but notfor watches.

Frank

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clockboy Distinguished Member

clockboy

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I have ordered from British springs and they are excellent quality and they supply for watches as well as clocks. Not knowing what size to order I ordered several sizes and was lucky to choose correctly. Hairspring selection is not easy. The correct length and strength is critical. I found this on the net a few years ago it is an invaluable doc for selecting a H/S

 

Hairspring advise.docx

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Nucejoe Distinguished Member

Nucejoe

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4 hours ago, praezis said:

I think you are better off with the first link. You will have to detemine the needed cgs anyway. This can be done with your balance wheel and any hairspring with known cgs.

The  British springs are from inappropriate material, good for clocks and instruments but notfor watches.

Frank

Hi, You mean dtermine the cgs without use of ergometer?  Flying the H/S in your watch?  If you will please clarify/explain.

5 hours ago, clockboy said:

I agree its a bit of luck to get the correct spring. I don't understand their measurements.

Hi, You don't understand?  The cgs?  Clarify please.

Regards

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praezis Super WRT Addict

praezis

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37 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Hi, You don't understand?  The cgs?  Clarify please.

Regards

In fact British springs don't supply CGS. They give the torque at 100° rotated spring (or so...).

CGS is the gyroscopic moment at 53° rotation of a 1cm diameter spring.

Frank

 

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transporter Super WRT Addict

transporter

Posted
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am i going to make this really simple or have i got this completely wrong, I'm looking at this CGS malarkey on line, now C stands for centimetres as a unit of length, G stands for grams as a measurement of mass, and S stands for seconds a measurement of time.

now for C, is this the length of the hairspring?

and is G the weight of the hairspring on its own minus the collet and stud or with the collet and stud?

and S I'm completely stumped on how to work that  out apart from maybe 60 seconds, i have no idea???

so if we can work out the length of the hairspring (how do we do this?) and then weigh the hairspring on a pair of scales would this not give us two answers out of three for finding the correct CGS??? or have a tried to simplify some equation that cannot be simplified????

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praezis Super WRT Addict

praezis

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1 hour ago, transporter said:

am i going to make this really simple or have i got this completely wrong, I'm looking at this CGS malarkey on line, now C stands for centimetres as a unit of length, G stands for grams as a measurement of mass, and S stands for seconds a measurement of time.

Not quite so simple :-) You are right, CGS means a system with the above base units. CGS is also (mis)used for the number that determines a hairspring. Before 1940 springs were labelled "size" and "force", watchmakers had to use try and error to find the right spring. With CGS it became possible to calculate a  hairspring. 

It is difficult and imprecise to find the CGS from dimensions of a spring. Usually you find it by comparision with a spring of known CGS.

Frank

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Nucejoe Distinguished Member

Nucejoe

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5 hours ago, praezis said:

Not quite so simple :-) You are right, CGS means a system with the above base units. CGS is also (mis)used for the number that determines a hairspring. Before 1940 springs were labelled "size" and "force", watchmakers had to use try and error to find the right spring. With CGS it became possible to calculate a  hairspring. 

It is difficult and imprecise to find the CGS from dimensions of a spring. Usually you find it by comparision with a spring of known CGS.

Frank

Cgs is one variant of metric system, with cm, gr, sec as the base units, other systems namely MKS ..... are fundamentally the same using different size base units. These base units are used as constituent elements of other factors we deal with in daily life such as speed, acceleration, torque etc.

Dimentionally speed is distance over time ie cm/sec or ki!ometer per hour km/hr.

Static and dynamic factors/ functions are derived from these base units, for instance acceleration is distance over seconds square ie  accel  in terms of meter/ secconds to the second power. The unit of force in cgs is called dyne.

In study of rotation torque comes to picture and is derived from CROSS product of these units. 

The pertinent analytical calculations are exact. 

To eleminates such talk for repairman, measurement methods were deviced, instruments based on static and dynamic principles were made for direct measurement of what a watchmaker/ repairman needed to get the job done. The method is known to repairman as flying the h/s, to determine the required length of a given h/s which provides the interval within which the complete balance would resonate to desired frequency or in terms of beat.

Regards

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