Clocks are taking over my house some I have worked on recently

[wls1971]

When I joined the site I had only a passing interest in clocks but I have over the last couple of years started to buy more and more they are starting to take over every shelf window ledge and free space I have here are just a few of the clocks I have picked up over the last 6 months.

The first one is a Walnut Lenzkirch ting tang clock bought off the bay of evil, I paid £70.00 and had to go to Hull to collect it, the clock had suffered quite a bit of neglect over its 100 plus years and had been stored somewhere damp it had areas of lifting veneer. all the varnish had deep scratches and the movement suffered from a fair bit of rust in fact when I picked it up my heart sank here are a few picks before I started working on the clock.

I have cleaned the movement, I use brasso cotton wadding and clean by hand, and brasso and a medium brush to clean the wheels and small parts I then wash in nothing more than warm soapy water  and clean out the pivot holes using pipe cleaners soaked in alcohol for the larger holes, and cotton thread or peg wood for the smaller holes I then dry and brush with french chalk pivots are burnished on my lathe I usually replace all taper pins on a clock of this age as most are pretty chewed up the springs are removed inspected, replaced if needed and oiled.

 The bulk of the work on this clock was on the case the lifting veneer was glued and clamped in place, there was a crack running down the middle of the clock front I have filled this with filler, I use a white filler and paint the surface once dry and sanded with watercolour paints to match the colour of the wood there are various coloured fillers available but I find these a waste of time.

The back door panel was broken into four parts, it had been glued at some point in it's life but was a bit of a mess, I removed the old glue then re glued and clamped until dry, I have replaced the cloth on the back door the old cloth had rotted, having no knowledge of what the cloth was I have replaced it with a red satin cloth I have no idea if this is the correct cloth to use.

The vast majority of clocks of this age are varnished with shellac based varnishes it was in such poor state the only option was complete removal, this I do with very fine steel wool 0000 grade soaked in methylated spirits I would never use sandpaper on a clock case other than on small filled areas, the steel wool breaks the surface of the varnish and allows the spirits to do the work after a bit of light rubbing the varnish turns to a sludge that can be wiped of with a cloth, again soaked in spirits the advantage of steel wool is it kinder to the wood surface and can be easily worked into corners and detailed areas. I then french polish the case leaving a hour between coats after every 5th coat i rub down again with very fine wire wool and start again applying coats it is a time consuming process and there is no easy way to do it. French polish will darken quite quickly with age but you can add spirit dyes to it if you wish to change the colour or if the colour is not to your liking.

The dial and bezel where cleaned and polished then re laquered and the inner bezel cleaned re silvered and laquered 

This clock has a plaque on the front it was a gift to the Rev T. Salusbury Jones from the  congregation of his first pastorate in 1901, I can never resist looking up the people on these plaques. Clocks where a very popular gift to vicars in the 1900's and I have three such clocks, the Rev Salusbury Jones had three sons whilst at Sutton Valence church sadly two lost their lives in the trenches of the great war and there is a local Sutton Valence history web site that tells the story of how his sons where killed in the war.

I still have a little work to do on the clock the gongs where rusty so I have cleaned them with fine wire wool but I need to blue them but they are quite large so im thinking of buying a electric hotplate so I can blue them and any others I may have to do in future. I also need to clean the decorative band around the top it just needs cleaning with a cotton bud and spirits as it has residue from rubbing with the wire wool and looks a bit dirty.

The next two clocks are french striking clocks with slate cases the Brocot is a 14 day duration by Samuel Marti the other is a 8 day by Richard and co. Both are rack striking movements and are very easy to work on I think they are more prone to wear on the striking train but are generally very robust movements. Both these clocks where very grey in appearance when bought, the easiest way to restore these cases rather than buying the various potions available is to rub the case with baby oil, Literally 2 drops on a duster and a bit of elbow grease and all the grey areas return to black you really do not need to use a lot once the case is back to black use a wax polish and case comes up like new.

I also love carriage clocks and when ever I see them cheap on Ebay I buy them three of the clocks in the next picture cost no more than 30 pounds with the cheapest being £22.00 bought from a antiques centre the same day I picked the Lenzkirch up from hull 

I try where possible to buy with original platform escapements but where they have been replaced with modern ones I replace as soon as I can, as is the case with the next clock

Two things attracted me to the above clock the shape of the case and the buy it now price of £30.00 free postage it was listed as not working, but the only thing wrong is it hadnt been cleaned in a very long time, the clock had a new platform fitted I would guess in the 60's 70's so I have replaced it with one from the late Victorian period that is correct for the period this clock was made I have re laquered the case with a mid gold Horolaq laquer. I source platforms from antique centres and ebay there are many unloved clocks hanging around antique centres and if it's cheap and has a platform I buy it and use it for parts the platform I used in this clock came from a clock with a case beyond repair and missing its back but the platform was good it cost me £8.00.

I haven't really gone into detail on how I clean a clock in this post and the light has been against me today as far as photography has gone but I have a clock hopefully coming next week so will do a full walk through of how I clean a clock and hopefully any one who spots any thing wrong in what I do will tell me.  

 

 

Edited May 30, 2018 by wls1971
Spelling always the spelling

[Marc]

That's a cracking collection of clocks, and some really nice restoration work. Thanks for showing.

The only pitfall of so many clocks is, as my wife keeps reminding me, that where a man with a clock knows the time, a man with two clocks is never quite sure!!

[wls1971]

That's very true its the one thing that drives me nuts regulating them, and having so many striking clocks in the house drives my partner nuts when coronation streets on the telly.

[oldhippy]

From day one of joining this forum, this is what I have been hopping to see. A member who takes pride in his work in restoring clocks to a very high standard. I have been studying the photos and work with a big smile on my face.

Wis1971, where did you learn you skill? Did you serve an apprenticeship? You remind me of myself years ago. I loved my work so much it became more of a hobby.

 Lenzkirch ting tang the material colour is correct. Most of the ones I have seen have been red. I think I can remember seeing a sort of dirty blue/green, which did not look right. The gongs can be tricky to restore.

I do not know if you do this with all your clocks ignore this if you do. I would always put the arbors in a lath and polish the fronts with fine emery so it looks as if they have been burnished the same goes for the tip of the centre wheel.

Going on to the French clocks. Baby oil is a new one on me. I am wondering what does it have in it to mask or remove oxidisation, because that is what happens to black slate cases?  

The carriage clocks are amazing. I can see you know what screws to blue and the ones not to. Fitting a replacement platform, having the correct size with the screw holes in their correct place can be a pain.  Horolaq laquer is a cold laquer. I had a very fine artist brush it was flat to apply it, also dries quick. With your skills, you must be able to undertake invisible re-bushing. With carriage clocks, there is nothing worse than seeing bad work.   

[wls1971]

Many thanks for the kind words on my efforts to date 

1 hour ago, oldhippy said:

Wis1971, where did you learn you skill? Did you serve an apprenticeship?

No but I work with a lot of people who have, its funny where conversation lead sometimes but I mentioned in passing to someone I worked with a clock I wanted to restore with a wooden case but didn't know the best way to remove scratches from the wood, he then told me the best way to do this, it turned out when he first left school he was apprenticed to a cabinet maker and had served his time so I read up on the methods he told me and have used  them ever since, before this I had sanded a clock down with less than spectacular results.Very fine wire wool and methylated spirits does not remove the surface of the wood it just breaks the old  varnish down to such an extent it can be easily wiped off, if the scratches are not very deep and do not break the surface very fine wire wool and a  very tiny amount of spirits and a bit of light rubbing will remove these without removing the varnish

My theory on the Belgian slate is that oxidisation happens at the exposed surface of the slate, it is despite appearance a very porous material, it is also not marble its a form of calcite which is crystalline in composition as light hits the oxidised surface light is reflected back and it appears grey to the eye applying oil stops the crystalline structure of the surface reflecting light back and it appears black to the eye.

It is surprising how little is needed and you should be able to touch it if left overnight and have no oily residue because the oil has been totally absorbed by the porous surface, wax polish just seals the surface once applied. Why baby oil well its a cheap mineral oil but I have read on various forums on the web that people who have tried slate oil say that baby oil works far better.

I know which screws to blue because you mentioned it in a post quite a while back that the end bearing screw for the  contrate wheel should not be blued although I have noticed on 1970's English carriage clock's such as Fema it always is blued. I also remove any dimple from this screw which may be apparent whilst servicing.

I'm afraid I cheat with the lacquer I have made many failed attempts to brush it on, clear lacquer is easier to apply with a brush but as soon as you start using tinted lacquers any imperfections in application become glaringly obvious, so I spray it on with a air brush.

[Lenj]

Lovely collection, I also like the lacquer, can I ask when you got this from?

Thx Len

[wls1971]

4 minutes ago, Lenj said:

Lovely collection, I also like the lacquer, can I ask when you got this from?

Thx Len

The Lacquer is from cousins but there are many suppliers. it's made by Horolacq and comes in three shades clear, pale and medium the medium gives brass a golden tone not unlike ormolu in tone. I use it 1 part lacquer to 1 part meths, its a shellac based lacquer.

I don't think its available in all countries and because its a solvent based product I don't think it can be shipped to America, but I did find a interesting article on how to make your own Lacquer which I may try soon:

http://www.lungov.com/wagner/DIYBrassLensReLacqueringOldWay.html

[Lenj]

On ‎08‎/‎06‎/‎2018 at 11:22 AM, wls1971 said:

The Lacquer is from cousins but there are many suppliers. it's made by Horolacq and comes in three shades clear, pale and medium the medium gives brass a golden tone not unlike ormolu in tone. I use it 1 part lacquer to 1 part meths, its a shellac based lacquer.

I don't think its available in all countries and because its a solvent based product I don't think it can be shipped to America, but I did find a interesting article on how to make your own Lacquer which I may try soon:

http://www.lungov.com/wagner/DIYBrassLensReLacqueringOldWay.html

Thx I just like the colour, looks good on your clock.

 

Len

[Lenj]

The link to the lens looks great..

Len

[Lenj]

On ‎30‎/‎05‎/‎2018 at 8:48 PM, wls1971 said:

When I joined the site I had only a passing interest in clocks but I have over the last couple of years started to buy more and more they are starting to take over every shelf window ledge and free space I have here are just a few of the clocks I have picked up over the last 6 months.

The first one is a Walnut Lenzkirch ting tang clock bought off the bay of evil, I paid £70.00 and had to go to Hull to collect it, the clock had suffered quite a bit of neglect over its 100 plus years and had been stored somewhere damp it had areas of lifting veneer. all the varnish had deep scratches and the movement suffered from a fair bit of rust in fact when I picked it up my heart sank here are a few picks before I started working on the clock.

I have cleaned the movement, I use brasso cotton wadding and clean by hand, and brasso and a medium brush to clean the wheels and small parts I then wash in nothing more than warm soapy water  and clean out the pivot holes using pipe cleaners soaked in alcohol for the larger holes, and cotton thread or peg wood for the smaller holes I then dry and brush with french chalk pivots are burnished on my lathe I usually replace all taper pins on a clock of this age as most are pretty chewed up the springs are removed inspected, replaced if needed and oiled.

 The bulk of the work on this clock was on the case the lifting veneer was glued and clamped in place, there was a crack running down the middle of the clock front I have filled this with filler, I use a white filler and paint the surface once dry and sanded with watercolour paints to match the colour of the wood there are various coloured fillers available but I find these a waste of time.

The back door panel was broken into four parts, it had been glued at some point in it's life but was a bit of a mess, I removed the old glue then re glued and clamped until dry, I have replaced the cloth on the back door the old cloth had rotted, having no knowledge of what the cloth was I have replaced it with a red satin cloth I have no idea if this is the correct cloth to use.

The vast majority of clocks of this age are varnished with shellac based varnishes it was in such poor state the only option was complete removal, this I do with very fine steel wool 0000 grade soaked in methylated spirits I would never use sandpaper on a clock case other than on small filled areas, the steel wool breaks the surface of the varnish and allows the spirits to do the work after a bit of light rubbing the varnish turns to a sludge that can be wiped of with a cloth, again soaked in spirits the advantage of steel wool is it kinder to the wood surface and can be easily worked into corners and detailed areas. I then french polish the case leaving a hour between coats after every 5th coat i rub down again with very fine wire wool and start again applying coats it is a time consuming process and there is no easy way to do it. French polish will darken quite quickly with age but you can add spirit dyes to it if you wish to change the colour or if the colour is not to your liking.

The dial and bezel where cleaned and polished then re laquered and the inner bezel cleaned re silvered and laquered 

This clock has a plaque on the front it was a gift to the Rev T. Salusbury Jones from the  congregation of his first pastorate in 1901, I can never resist looking up the people on these plaques. Clocks where a very popular gift to vicars in the 1900's and I have three such clocks, the Rev Salusbury Jones had three sons whilst at Sutton Valence church sadly two lost their lives in the trenches of the great war and there is a local Sutton Valence history web site that tells the story of how his sons where killed in the war.

I still have a little work to do on the clock the gongs where rusty so I have cleaned them with fine wire wool but I need to blue them but they are quite large so im thinking of buying a electric hotplate so I can blue them and any others I may have to do in future. I also need to clean the decorative band around the top it just needs cleaning with a cotton bud and spirits as it has residue from rubbing with the wire wool and looks a bit dirty.

The next two clocks are french striking clocks with slate cases the Brocot is a 14 day duration by Samuel Marti the other is a 8 day by Richard and co. Both are rack striking movements and are very easy to work on I think they are more prone to wear on the striking train but are generally very robust movements. Both these clocks where very grey in appearance when bought, the easiest way to restore these cases rather than buying the various potions available is to rub the case with baby oil, Literally 2 drops on a duster and a bit of elbow grease and all the grey areas return to black you really do not need to use a lot once the case is back to black use a wax polish and case comes up like new.

I also love carriage clocks and when ever I see them cheap on Ebay I buy them three of the clocks in the next picture cost no more than 30 pounds with the cheapest being £22.00 bought from a antiques centre the same day I picked the Lenzkirch up from hull 

I try where possible to buy with original platform escapements but where they have been replaced with modern ones I replace as soon as I can, as is the case with the next clock

Two things attracted me to the above clock the shape of the case and the buy it now price of £30.00 free postage it was listed as not working, but the only thing wrong is it hadnt been cleaned in a very long time, the clock had a new platform fitted I would guess in the 60's 70's so I have replaced it with one from the late Victorian period that is correct for the period this clock was made I have re laquered the case with a mid gold Horolaq laquer. I source platforms from antique centres and ebay there are many unloved clocks hanging around antique centres and if it's cheap and has a platform I buy it and use it for parts the platform I used in this clock came from a clock with a case beyond repair and missing its back but the platform was good it cost me £8.00.

I haven't really gone into detail on how I clean a clock in this post and the light has been against me today as far as photography has gone but I have a clock hopefully coming next week so will do a full walk through of how I clean a clock and hopefully any one who spots any thing wrong in what I do will tell me.  

 

 

Now I would have said that this clock was made by Couaillet Freres, am I correct or has any one got his mark, they all confuse me..I would love to know the difference..

 

Thanks Len

[wls1971]

Yes it is generally believed that the hand arrow mark punched with six dots is used by Couaillet Freres on their movements but the work of marking the backs of the clocks with punches was outsourced to home workers by the factory these workers would have also been marking clocks for other makers so may appear on clocks not made by them.

[oldhippy]

15 minutes ago, wls1971 said:

Yes it is generally believed that the hand arrow mark punched with six dots is used by Couaillet Freres on their movements but the work of marking the backs of the clocks with punches was outsourced to home workers by the factory these workers would have also been marking clocks for other makers so may appear on clocks not made by them.

That is very true. You will find out it is not all plain sailing with clocks.  Unless you can handle the very item, it is imposable to tell. Photos can only reveal so much.

[Lenj]

1 hour ago, oldhippy said:

 

That is very true. You will find out it is not all plain sailing with clocks.  Unless you can handle the very item, it is imposable to tell. Photos can only reveal so much.

Very true as we saw with those fakes that you showed us..

Found this it show the 4 dots that represent the 4 brothers.