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0 exp - would like attempt bringing Yachtmaster back to life


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Hello all - my name is David and I've just made an account here to hopefully start learning about watch repair with hopes of eventually tackling completely revamping my watch.

It's a 1999 Rolex Yachtmaster 40mm - 116622 I believe. I got it in 2011 and it worked well for a few years until it was basically abused and destroyed. The printing on the face has been burned off and it also has water damage. I don't have any tools to open up the case back but I suspect the inner workings has been rusted as well. I've brought it to a local watchmaker and was initially quoted $3000 to get it repaired, but after a month or so they called me back and told me it would be $7000 with no explanation when I asked about why. I suspect they figure I was made of money and that I would just simply pay. I've since picked up the watch and am now exploring the possibility of doing the repair myself. 

Where do I even start? I've seen books for sale on Amazon on watch repair but would I need anything specifically for the watch I have? 

I will post pictures of the insides when I get some tools to open up the case back, but how does one deal with rusted parts? I've seen parts for Rolex watches on eBay, but I'm thinking some parts could simply be cleaned up and reused? 

The watch doesn't wind, it needs new hands, crystal, bezel, and a few links for sure.

I feel like I am pretty mechanically inclined when it comes to cars and replacing parts on electronics but watches are something I've never even considered on tackling. I am a little overwhelmed and would appreciate any guidance you guys and gals could offer. Thank you. 

 

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Without any watch repair experience & correct tools you will not be able to repair it yourself. The dial face will have to be repaired by a dial repair specialist. The movement will have to be serviced and repaired by a competent horologist. 

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That's like telling someone they can't fix their car without experience and correct tools. I suppose I should just pay someone else to do it right? Just quit because it's impossible? I did mention that I'm here to learn. Your comment is akin to telling me to get lost. I appreciate the warm welcome, mister moderator sir.

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26 minutes ago, clockboy said:

Without any watch repair experience & correct tools you will not be able to repair it yourself. The dial face will have to be repaired by a dial repair specialist. The movement will have to be serviced and repaired by a competent horologist. 

Were you assuming I was going to attempt this without investing in some tools and doing some research?

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Hi Hidavidd. It is probably more economical to sell the watch and buy a used one. But that is not why you are here is it!

One of the first watches I worked on was a gold 50s Rolex I bought for my girlfriend, it had a chipped dial. I managed to get the movement out in one piece, carefully touched up the dial with tipex, and gave it to her. It ran like that and was used intermittently as a dress watch for years. She had so much fun out of it, never being 100% sure it was "real", until a jeweler confirmed to her it was real, and still not worth much!

I would be inclined to just fix it up, keep the dial and hands more or less as is, after some straightening. 

I think you need to start with some broken watches, take them apart, read Donald De Carl's books. Might take you a couple of years to get up to speed. I am please you haven't just hacked the back off. Maybe put that to one side for a while. Perhaps you can open the back for a look using a squash ball, just make sure you don't bend the hands if the crystal is missing. I wouldn't do much more though than look inside right now!

 

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1 hour ago, hidavidd said:

Were you assuming I was going to attempt this without investing in some tools and doing some research?

I was just given sound advice. Watch repair is a skill that takes many years to acquire. Also a Rolex is not for the faint hearted. All Rolex parts are not only extremely expensive they are very hard to source. If your watch has had water ingress the movement parts are highly likely to be rusted and they will need replacing. By the time you have added the cost of parts & dial re-furb it won't be far short of purchasing a replacement watch IMO

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2 hours ago, hidavidd said:

That's like telling someone they can't fix their car without experience and correct tools. I suppose I should just pay someone else to do it right? Just quit because it's impossible? I did mention that I'm here to learn. Your comment is akin to telling me to get lost. I appreciate the warm welcome, mister moderator sir.

Actually you should be grateful for the comment and advice received, because if followed will prevent further damage to the watch. If your only goal is to have it repaired give to a professional watchmaker.

Also, since there is no technical question here I'm moving the thread,. 

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1 hour ago, clockboy said:

 By the time you have added the cost of parts & dial re-furb it won't be far short of purchasing a replacement watch IMO

Agreed. Would $5000 get you the same watch if you hunt around pawnbrokers, etc? This watch must have a story to it. It would fetch a lot on ebay as is. 

Why not buy another identical watch for now and then spend a few years learning about watches, then the pressure is off to get that one going, while you pick up the skills.

 

 

Edited by Vacherin
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I could probably find the same watch for around $6000 now, I'd consider selling it on eBay but I'm not sure how much I would be able to get for it. I really like the idea of trying to restore it however as it does definitely have sentimental value to me - seeing it run again would definitely make me happy. I also didn't know if the watch was real 100% either and that's probably how I let it get to this state. When I got the crystal replaced by an ex-girlfriend's father he told her it was fake (I was dismissive of this but it did put doubts in my mind.) It wasn't until I was ready to get it repaired that I found out it was genuine for sure. 

I just watched a video on YouTube of someone servicing this watch's movement and it looks like some serious precision work, but I am not deterred. Having the video as reference actually has given me a lot of confidence in my ability to perform this restoration. I am looking into list of parts I'll be needing. Once the tools come in I'll take a look inside and see which parts I'll be able to salvage and which I'll have to replace. So far the cost of tools and movement parts don't look too discouraging yet - it's the platinum parts (bezel and dial (which I'll probably have refinished instead of replacing)) that are making me flinch.

I'm going to to take your advice, @Vacherin, and just do some looking for now while I read Donald Carle's ebook that I've just downloaded. I'm considering finding a cheaper broken watch to work on first.

Anyone have any ideas as to what it would cost to get my dial refinished? 

 

 

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Looking at your question I think there is a confusion over what you're asking. I see it as a two-part question. The first part you're asking how to learn watch repair and congratulations you've come to the right place. Then the second part your question is once you've learned watch repair what to I need to do to repair this watch?

So the first question Has a variety of options. So one of the easy ways to start off with learning watch repair is the link below. Otherwise you could start a new question of how do I start with watch repair we really should have that permanently anchored someplace as it's a common question.

https://www.watchrepairlessons.com/

So now for the second question once you've learned watch repair which by the way you cannot do. Learning watch repair is not an absolute nobody has learned watch repair. Were all practicing but when you get better at watch repair when you not going to destroy anything and you grasp what you're doing then how to proceed with this watch? By the way You didn't say where you're located that is important for the answer.

So location is important for the answer because in some countries it's much much easier to get Rolex parts. In the USA to grasp the answer I have a link to the Rolex website below and text from the website  " Only official Rolex retailers are allowed to sell and maintain a Rolex. They guarantee the authenticity of each and every part of your Rolex, not to mention its reliability over time, helping you make the choice that will last a lifetime" So simplistic interpretation of the paragraph is parts are not available in this country from Rolex. They were available at one time and stuff does show up on eBay. But some stuff you're just not going to be able to get and because of this the cost of the parts are very very expensive wherever they come from.

So the good news for the website is looks like it's a 3135 movement. So to help you with that I have a link to the parts list. Then the service manual's been attached. Plus a video showing how simple it is  to disassemble providing is not a solid block of rust.

 https://www.rolex.com/watches/yacht-master/m116622-0003.html

http://www.phfactor.net/wtf/Rolex/1055_Rolex 3135 NEW.pdf

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/watch_repair_videos.html/watch-movement-servicing-stripdowns/rolex-calibre-3135-stripdown-see-whats-inside-this-oyster-perpetual-r11/

Rolex 3135.pdf

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You used the car analogy. Starting with a badly damaged Rolex is like doing a rebuild of a BMW V12 instead of a clutch change on a Mondeo.
No reason why you can’t do it, it’s just a serious case of jumping in at the deep end.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Welcome!

I'll echo a lot of the advice already posted here: You have quite a bit to learn before getting to that rolex, provided it's even salvageable.

Get some tools (don't cheap out on the basics), a few dirt cheap movements on ebay, and practice. May I suggest you start with a pocket watch (parts are bigger), and then move down to wristwatches once you're a bit more comfortable. Also, break a cheap movement and you're only out a few dollars; break a rolex hairspring, and you may be a out many hundreds of dollars (yes, MANY hundredS)... 

Rust will destroy watch parts in not time if they stay exposed to moisture; watch parts are not very big and it's easy for rust to eat up all the material that's there, and you're left with a blob of rust dust... 

My guess is that the price you were quoted is so high because most of the parts of the movement need to be replaced... and that probably doesn't include the dial. If the damage is bad, there is potentially thousands of dollars worth of parts that will need to be replaced (assuming you want genuine)...

Let us know how you do and post pictures when you get it open, it may not be bad.

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7 hours ago, hidavidd said:

Were you assuming I was going to attempt this without investing in some tools and doing some research?

Hello and welcome to the forum!

You have a nice watch, and the guys here are experienced and know what they're talking about regarding watch repair even if it sounds a bit hard-edged. The good thing is that working on a quality watch such as rolex is easier than working on a cheap watch....IF you've formed a good foundation on the basics of horology. There are so many things that go into watch repair, but let me start with just opening the caseback. You'll need a special rolex-type opener:

5accd22b8851d_ScreenShot2018-04-10at11_02_33AM.thumb.png.fbb6feff3c60737517f1d4ca080e3011.png

You see how much this is? That's just the beginning! You'll need a set of quality tweezers, screwdrivers, movement holder, eye magnification, dial protector, parts bin, and a benchtop mat with good lighting just to get the movement out and ready to disassemble. Cleaning will require sonification detergent, or  non-residue solvent such as naptha to clean the movement. Rust will require special treatment or replacement of parts ($$$).   We will assume you have a camera to take pictures along the tear down process way or you'll never be able to put it back together. Once cleaned you'll need specific oils (at least 5 types)/grease and a few other things. I would suggest you put that Rolex aside for now, and start with a large pocket watch or a cheap movement (working) that you can practice on...work on handling the small screws, levers, springs and plates to get an idea of how long you'll need to practice before attempting the Rolex. For me, it took at least one year before I could actually take apart a watch and put it back together in working condition, and another year before I could diagnose simple problems, fix them and get the watch running. another 6 months before I learned how to actually regulate a watch using a timegrapher. I did my first Rolex (bunch of bulova, walthams, omegas and cheap pin levers first!) with 2 years 8 months under my belt.

J

 

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I can't add much that hasn't already been said but I will drop in my nickel's worth just the same.

For starters- that's a great watch and if it has sentimental value I'd certainly save the money necessary for a proper repair.  That being said (here comes the bad part) if a trained technician already estimated between $3k and $7k then is sounds like the movement has extensive damage. No one can make that assessment without seeing the inside though so I'm anxiously awaiting any pics you may have to offer. 

Judging by the description "the printing on the face has been burned off and it also has water damage" it sounds like the piece survived a house fire- that's what would be called "salvaged" in the auto industry.  Could be expensive for sure.

A bit about Rolex parts- they're difficult to get a hold of as Rolex only sells to certified technicians.  You can find parts and even whole movements on eBay however but they'll cost a pretty penny.

Regarding tools- I got into watch repair because I figured I could assemble an Omega Speedmaster from parts for a lesser price than purchasing a new one.  This turned out to be true- if I exclude the cost of the tools I purchased.  At the very least you'll need a loupe, a set of screwdrivers, and good (Dumont) tweezers.  Rolex requires some specialty tools as well such as a Microstella wrench for timing adjustments and caseback dies (although if the caseback isn't too tight a wad of sticky duct tape just might work).

As for performing the repair- De Carle's books are fantastic for getting your feet wet.  A stereo microscope is a godsend if you can beg, borrow, or cheat one.  You will lose parts so it's best to practice with a cheap movement so that you can get the feel down when using tweezers (I would suggest a lower priced new movement- there are many that come from China and some are clones of Swiss movements, all are good for practice).

Lastly good luck!

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Hi David,

Looks like you've jumped in the deep end and stirred up a hornets nest.

Anyway.. for all the hype, most Rolex watches are sturdy and well-built. I would compare it to a modern American V8 like the LT1. Old design with pushrods but still capable of amazing performance due to optimised design and modern materials.

If you can pull apart a car or bike engine and get it back together and running then that's a good start. If you take it slow and refer back here often you'll get a lot of comments, mostly helpful, to get you through!

The most important is to not do additional damage. So first off you need to get the back off, do you have a correct tool? The back will come off if you use a hammer and chisel around the edges but that would damage the case-back. Next to get the crown off. Its a screw-down and this can get rusted in place.  A pair of pliers would get it off but Rolex crowns are around USD100 a pop if you can get them. This brings me to the next big issue, parts. Rolex parts are only available to authorised Rolex repair shops. You might get lucky and find someone selling a crown but if the damage is bad you would be looking at buying a lot of parts and that will be expensive!

So first off buy a tool to get the back off. If you have an old type watch repair shop then pay him a visit and give him 20-50bucks to get the back off. If he cant get it off no way you'll be able to.

Once you've gotten the back off then you can asses the damage (post here and we'll give some input) and decide on the next course of action.

About dial refinishers, frankly this is the last thing you should be worrying about right now. No point getting the dial done and finding that the movement is toast.

If you want to practise on a lesser watch, by all means buy a good working swiss watch with an ETA2836 or similar movement and practise on that to give you some experience on handling small parts. They're comparatively cheap and easy to source.

Good luck!

Anilv

 

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Thank you for everyone's words of expertise and I will definitely be taking all of it in mind continuing forward. I've been trying to open up the caseback with rubber balls and duct tape so far but it's not budging, so I'll just have to wait until the tools I've ordered come in. Stay tuned for pictures of the inside when I get it open!

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If you are willing to cover shipping, I could take a look at it down under (Australia).
It is likely that the workshop is full of it. A mate had a Girard with a broken Balance staff which he was quoted $1000 to fix and 12 months wait. I fixed it for $20 for genuine balance. A lot of these top end places just dont want to deal with this due to risk of something breaking later so they give you crazy prices to keep you away.

For what its worth,  alot of parts in watches are brass/stainless/plated so they don't rust very much. There is usually a sacrificial part such as mainspring or movement ring which rusts and causes a lot of debris.

I took a AS movement which was soaked in salt water and brought it back to life by soaking parts in WD40, then vinegar and coke.

I fixed a Wyler which looked 10x worse than your watch, all it needed was cleaning and gentle care.

Cheers.

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13 hours ago, AlexeiJ1 said:


It is likely that the workshop is full of it. A mate had a Girard with a broken Balance staff which he was quoted $1000 to fix and 12 months wait. I fixed it for $20 for genuine balance. A lot of these top end places just dont want to deal with this due to risk of something breaking later so they give you crazy prices to keep you away.


I fixed a Wyler which looked 10x worse than your watch, all it needed was cleaning and gentle care.
 

 

I think you may be right. They changed the pricing and told me it would take 6 months to a year. When I asked why the difference in pricing they simply said "Oh it'll be perfect when you get it back don't worry." :blink:

I've got the case back opener on the way and I'll be posting pictures once it has arrived. 

Fingers crossed that it'll just need a good cleaning!

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On 4/10/2018 at 6:22 AM, hidavidd said:

 

Anyone have any ideas as to what it would cost to get my dial refinished? 

When you open it, expect the worse...it might not be bad, or it could be considerably rusted. For the dial, I  have a place I can recommend in Ohio, they redid a Girard Perregaux with matched fonts perfectly. I will send you PM. Please post pics when you get the case open.

J

 

 

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18 hours ago, AlexeiJ1 said:

A mate had a Girard with a broken Balance staff which he was quoted $1000 to fix and 12 months wait. I fixed it for $20 for genuine balance.

I like the extreme of this example. One year and $1000 to do a staff I wonder if they are going to make it? Then $20 is also interesting.

So is $20 the going rate in your shop to change balance staffs?

 

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OK.

This is the sort of thing that I might get into. I'm happy to help if I can when you get stuck.

With regards to the movement, here's the easy answer: Log in and join RolexForums.com and check the for sale section. Recently a member there had (several) NOS 3135 movements for (if memory serves) $2000.00 each. That's a good price and it will have that off your plate. Yes, it's two grand, but you can easily amass that in replacement parts, assuming you don't cause collateral damage during tear-down or re-assembly... And, the upside is that the swamped movement can be retained for you to learn and work on at your leisure.

I noticed a question regarding refinishing the dial. I would avoid this. These Yacht-Masters have a platinum plated textured dial. I encourage you to make friends with your local dealer's watchmaker (if they even have one on staff) and arrange a service dial from Rolex. This is ONLY done on an exchange basis, and must go through an authorized retailer. You may be able to get one through the selling members on RolexForums too- I do see loose dials there often so it is possible. I don't know if the exchange will be less than a purchase through the forum, but you should avoid refinishing because it's not a simple job (and therefore will be expensive). DO NOT buy this dial on eBay unless it is sealed in a Rolex blister pack. Fakes abound... You will need a new set of hands too. And the bezel assembly (I think the insert is Platinum as well so sit down before requesting the quote)

Case restoration- you need gaskets at the very least, crystal obviously (these are easy to get) and a crown tube tool. CasKer has the tools (decent quality) for not a ton of money. The tube needs to come out, have all threads inspected/cleaned, new O-rings installed and the tube re-installed with low strength locktite (purple). Maybe you should consider new tube and crown (I would). That's a 703 crown and tube. Those can be found on eBay for a few hundred bucks pretty easily. Again, make sure they are sealed in their blister unless you are VERY sure of the seller and the part you are buying. Maybe the case needs a buff. There is no easier way to destroy a Rolex case than to take it to the buffing wheel. THIS is an absolute art, and should be left alone. Get a Sunshine cloth for the polished sides and be happy with that. Seriously. If it's really ugly, send it to a pro. Maybe ABC watchworks out west- someone who specializes in vintage stuff. They will preserve the case shape where even the local Rolex repair center may not. I do my own, but I know my limitations and those were learned the hard way...

But the case needs to be absolutely clean. Tear it completely down (you will probably need the bezel removal tool in addition to the case back tool shown above) and reduce it to all it's parts. Remove all traces of old o-ring that may be present. I like Acetone for this- it may need to soak a while. All oil, dirt, old o-ring etc. must be gone. Then, assuming it is polished to your satisfaction, the reassembly process can begin.

Also mentioned above (I do this exact same thing) take a picture of EVERY disassembly step as you go. That goes for the case as well as the movement. Something you were not focused on during disassembly may become critical for reassembly. This is really easy now with phones.

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Well, the good news is it’s not a replica. 

That movement is in really bad shape. Could be a few hundred dollars just in replacement screws!

it needs to be torn down and every part carefully cleaned and checked for damage. But I fear there is more bad than good there...

Edited by Tudor
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@hidavidd Well I guess you know that its not good, and I would suggest you do not move that oscillating weight--more damage.  If you consider this a long term project, go ahead and attempt to uncase the movement and very gently try unscrewing the rotor plate and the balance hairspring. I fear that most of the plate screws will break right off if you try to unscrew them, so try putting some penetrating oil onto them first and let it sit for a few days before trying. Its going to be a costly project, and I know just one materials house that sells rolex parts. http://www.startimesupply.com/.

 

J

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