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Reassmble Problems - Newbie needs advice

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Link Member

Link

Posted
Posted

All things considered, my first tear down and rebuild didn't go too bad.

Some general things I learned:

  • Face side first!
  • Don't grab things too tight with the tweezers, two screws are somewhere on the floor
  • Don't over tighten screws, I broke one off and somehow managed to get it out
  • Take photos, don't rely on an exploded diagram

Ok so my questions. Here is the movement tech sheet I was using.

Crown set bridge. The crown locked in place but it wouldn't engage any gears. Any clue what went wrong? I'm assuming what they call the sliding pinion is in the wrong location or I'm missing tension on it? I just can't tell from the diagram what I did wrong. Photo as I assembled it:

IMG_0129.thumb.JPG.462b6299f488c660c794a894dba6bbbd.JPG

The balance wouldn't freely spin after assembly. My assumption here is the staff didn't make contact with the top and bottom pivots? Should I have taken off the regulator to seat that jewel correctly? Did I mess up the staff? Two photos:

IMG_0133.thumb.JPG.df23ca560341210c77520f3169fb37db.JPGIMG_0130.thumb.JPG.38345e954a8ad9ebe3dcc0630b8cbc51.JPG

 

The gear above the crown with the huge flat head screw. I assume this isn't made to come off?

 

IMG_0131.thumb.JPG.a573b0082724545093b4ac2dcf813316.JPG

 

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anilv Distinguished Member

anilv

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re crown set bridge - the set lever should hold the winding pinion against the clutch wheel.. ie the two parts with the ramped teeth should be forced together when the set lever and its spring is installed.

A pic without the bridge would assist diagnosis.

Balance wheel. Can only see one pivot clearly.. the other should look the same. You would usually get the balance in place and the balance bridge in position before tightening everything down gradually while making sure the balance spins. Tightening the screw in one go will break the pinion if it is not safely in its hole. If the balance spins one way and not the other then the impulse jewel is not in the fork at the end off the pallet lever. If all is in place correctly but the balance is still sluggish then you may need to clean the balance jewels again.

big screw/gear .. this is usually a left handed screw. ie clockwise to open. It is also usually very tight. This can break, especially if someone has already used force to try and unloosen it like a normal screw. I would leave it alone for the moment

good luck!

Anilv

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Link Member

Link

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big screw/gear .. this is usually a left handed screw. ie clockwise to open. It is also usually very tight. This can break, especially if someone has already used force to try and unloosen it like a normal screw. I would leave it alone for the moment
good luck!
Anilv


Ah! It spins freely now but doesn’t come out. I guess I broke it.

Thanks for the help!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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anilv Distinguished Member

anilv

Posted
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2 hours ago, Link said:


big screw/gear .. this is usually a left handed screw. ie clockwise to open. It is also usually very tight. This can break, especially if someone has already used force to try and unloosen it like a normal screw. I would leave it alone for the moment
good luck!
Anilv


Ah! It spins freely now but doesn’t come out. I guess I broke it.

Thanks for the help!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ouch... well live and learn.

It is good when working on unfamiliar movements to check on the direction a wheel/gear will rotate when in use.

In this case, when the watch is wound, the gear would move counter-clockwise and potentially this could cause a normal screw to unscrew, hence the use of a left-handed thread which will only get tighter.

Most manufacturers will mark the head of a screw with 3 lines to indicated that it is a left-handed thread but there will be some exceptions.

Anilv

 

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rappeleur Member

rappeleur

Posted
Posted (edited)

It looks like the pallet fork is not in the right place... It is not evenly lying / rather slanted. Is it moving freely from left to right and vice versa? (maybe it is just the angle of the photo).

Capture+_2018-03-13-23-35-32.png

Edited by rappeleur
Inserted detail pic
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hokavan Watch Enthusiast

hokavan

Posted
Posted
It looks like the pallet fork is not in the right place... It is not evenly lying / rather slanted. Is it moving freely from left to right and vice versa? (maybe it is just the angle of the photo).
5aa852a1a7c30_Capture_2018-03-13-23-35-32.thumb.png.8fa62f57f42e57bce8b8e3217786e393.png

The pallet fork moves with each rotation of the escape wheel. With photo can not judge if it is evenly lying or not. However you can check yourself by gently notch the fork from both directions. If it moves with escape wheel it seems to be okay. Remind that you should check the pivot of the pallet fork before tightening the screws.


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rappeleur Member

rappeleur

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yeah, I know, I wanted to give adive to the TO "Link"  for his/her problem:

On 13.3.2018 at 1:01 AM, Link said:

The balance wouldn't freely spin after assembly

I only saw the photo and thought this might be a thing to check for him/her before taking apart the whole movement... (It may also be that the balance was just set a bit wrong in place, so that the jewel came to lie outside the pallet fork and thus couldn’t be moved by it).

 

 

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jdm Distinguished Member

jdm

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7 hours ago, hokavan said:

With photo can not judge if it is evenly lying or not.

For sure the pallet can't stay in the middle like that. Definitely something is wrong with that escapement.

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Link Member

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Thanks everyone for the advice!

I think I had the pallet installed incorrectly, I was able to wind it up slightly and make the escapement tick after this try. As far as I can see in my loupe the pallet isn't damaged. For the balance, it has a tooth looking jewel, impulse jewel? where should I put this during installation? In the fork? Should the spring have any tension?

IMG_0139.thumb.JPG.b8b54ecb5371a3b2138dd22f968139d9.JPG

Now on to the crown. Here is a pic with the set bridge removed. What is wrong with this picture? I feel like the spring isn't in the right place. Actually I think maybe the sliding pinion is backwards?

These pics are all through a 10X loupe and my iphone, this works amazingly well.

IMG_0140.thumb.JPG.2a4ae41c35ac07a919dad5096fec43dd.JPG

Edited by Link
I can't spell
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Eckehardt Watch Enthusiast

Eckehardt

Posted
Posted

The roller jewel on the escape wheel should rest between the banking pins ( no tension). This can be checked with the pallet fork removed and the balance cock reinstalled. And looking between the banking pins make sure the roller jewel on the balance wheel roller table is perfectly between those pins.

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Eckehardt Watch Enthusiast

Eckehardt

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Eckehardt said:

The roller jewel on the escape wheel should rest between the banking pins ( no tension). This can be checked with the pallet fork removed and the balance cock reinstalled. And looking between the banking pins make sure the roller jewel on the balance wheel roller table is perfectly between those pins.

 

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      I have that French tech sheet too, it is a little different than the English one (eg, it doesn't have the auto works diagram). BTW, it looks like you are looking up the case number in the 1979 ABC supplement. The 1974 ABC catalog does have the 3093 case. As you determined it takes the 1222-5 crystal.  When I serviced my President 'A' (which also takes that crystal), I was able to fit a 29.8 crystal from my DPA crystal assortment. Those are, in my opinion, a great deal. The assortment comes with 10 sizes each from 27.8mm to 32.4mm in 0.2 increments. I pretty much use them for any non-armored crystal that takes a high dome crystal. I think they no longer make them but Cousins has still has some in stock but when I bought them they were around $40 for the set and now they are around $100. Still, at 40 cents a crystal it's still a good deal. For the large driving wheel, I remember I once assembled the keyless/motion works first and when I placed the large driving wheel it was interfering with the setting wheel on the dial side as the teeth were not fully meshing and it wouldn't fully seat. If that isn't the issue I got nothing and am looking forward to see how you solve it 🙂
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