lorus Lorus V501-X201 won't start

[Tel7]

Hi Watchmakers/repairers,

I live in New Zealand, am new to this forum, and my main experience with watches is changing batteries for my & my wife’s watches, and as you will see, I don’t know the technical terms, etc.

My wife has a Lorus women’s quartz watch with V501-X201 written on the back (see photos attached from after I took it apart, removed the crown+stem, then reattached it after taking the main workings out of the case).  In recent years the batteries (Maxell SR626SW (AKA 377) meant to be 1.55V) have been failing after only a few months, then I’d take them out, check the voltage (it might be 1.2V), clean it, put it back in, and it would go for another few months.  Recently when this happened I found some specs of blue-ish looking corrosion under the battery itself and in the battery compartment, so I cleaned it a bit, but lacking time, I put the same battery back in with the plan of replacing it another time, and it worked, but 2 days later it stopped again.  This time I cleaned the battery compartment with isopropyl alcohol on a cotton bud, and replaced the battery with an unused one, but the watch would not work (well, I don’t see the second hand moving).  Battery voltage is 1.49V (measured before replacement and after finding the watch didn’t run), because it’s a bit old, but my records show this watch runs on well under 1V.

I note in one of the attached photos, the white pad in the battery compartment has a large hole in it.  Looks like it’s worn through.  Assuming this pad is for insulation (to prevent a short), I tried putting a small piece of paper over the hole, but the watch still wouldn’t start.

Questions:

Q1. Does the watch need to be basically assembled (apart from the back & strap) for it to work, or do I just need to make sure the crown is pushed in?

Q2. Should I be covering that large hole in the white pad at the bottom of the battery cavity with some paper?  Or plastic?

Q3. What are the most likely causes of the problem with this watch stopping often in recent years?

Q4. What are the most likely causes of the watch not working now?  (I have a cheap multimeter if you can tell me what to test...and how.)

Q5. Is it likely that cleaning the battery compartment (not very gently) with a cotton bud could have caused it to stop working?

Q6. How do you think I can fix it?

I don’t think it’s worth paying a watch repairer to fix this watch, but maybe I can fix it myself if it's easy enough.

Thanks for your time and skills.

Terry

[Gpsluvr]

I hate to admit to this method of resurrecting Quartz watches that have stopped but appear undamaged. Usually it is a lack of lubrication for the gears and/or specks of dirt in the gear train. You can’t disassemble them, so this method has brought back to life literally hundreds of otherwise “dead” watches for me. Buy a squeeze bottle of old fashioned lighter fluid, and let one drop of it hit the movement plate and spread out from there. Chances are that it will immediately start up if the only problem is that the gears can not overcome the friction any longer. The fluid is slightly oily and most of the time the watches continue to run for another year or two. You do want to immediately blow it dry with canned air and make sure it isn’t on the dial. It doesn’t seem to affect most paints or plastics like solvents will. Don’t ever use alcohol. It dries them out so badly that a running one will likely stop if hit with it. Hope this helps. It’s worth a shot on inexpensive watches. Steve


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[noirrac1j]

Hello Tel7,

Welcome to the forum. I don't know how long your wife has had the watch, but it sounds like its kaput  after this long! I would suggest a movement replacement. I looked at a website here in U.S. but that epson movement is obsolete. Cousins has a replacement (Hattori, look up V501 under Seiko movements additional info) for very little money. The problem may be whether the hands will fit, but its worth a try:

https://www.cousinsuk.com/category/seiko-movement-parts

 

J

Edited August 12, 2017 by noirrac1j
additional info

[roverguybm]

6 hours ago, noirrac1j said:

Hello Tel7,

Welcome to the forum. I don't know how long your wife has had the watch, but it sounds like its kaput  after this long! I would suggest a movement replacement. I looked at a website here in U.S. but that epson movement is obsolete. Cousins has a replacement (Hattori, look up V501 under Seiko movements additional info) for very little money. The problem may be whether the hands will fit, but its worth a try:

https://www.cousinsuk.com/category/seiko-movement-parts

 

J

I'm with noirrac1j...if you can source a replacement movement I'd swap over.

However, some quartz movements require a 're-boot' after a battery replacement...there is usually something inside the case, such as a sticker over the battery, instructing you to 'short' the '+' and 'A' say, and this restarts the movement...anything there?

Edited August 12, 2017 by roverguybm

[Neileg]

it is a lack of lubrication for the gears and/or specks of dirt in the gear train. You can’t disassemble them,

There are some quartz movements that can't be dismantled but these tend to be the cheapest models and a movement swap is usually the most cost effective foc


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[Neileg]

I hate the edit timeout and gave up on the post last night.
Many quartz movements respond to a proper service just like a clockwork watch.
I will admit to the blow and squirt approach but it's not guaranteed to work.
I Googled the movement and it appears to be available.
Cheers Neil


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[Tel7]

On 8/13/2017 at 1:31 AM, Gpsluvr said:

...Buy a squeeze bottle of old fashioned lighter fluid, and let one drop of it hit the movement plate and spread out from there...

...You do want to immediately blow it dry with canned air and make sure it isn’t on the dial...

Thanks very much for that tip, Steve!

What do you mean by "old fashioned"?  Is this really a type of lighter fluid, or is this just an old fashioned watch repair trick?  Would this qualify: https://www.bunnings.co.nz/neon-butane-lighter-fluid-250ml_p00129965
And can I just break open a disposable lighter and use some of that?

Would sewing machine oil or CRC or WD40 also work?  I've got those.

I don't have canned air (although someone is buying canned air from here in NZ and selling it to some countries with major air pollution problems now, but I'm sure you don't mean that type).  Any household ways to improvise?  Would pointing an open balloon in the right direction do it?

Thanks again.
Terry

[Tel7]

On 8/13/2017 at 8:35 AM, roverguybm said:

However, some quartz movements require a 're-boot' after a battery replacement...there is usually something inside the case, such as a sticker over the battery, instructing you to 'short' the '+' and 'A' say, and this restarts the movement...anything there?

Thanks roverguybm.

I've had watches like that, too (Casio Databank), but there's no such sticker in this watch, and I don't see any such '+' or 'A' symbols in the image I attached to my first post.  Have a look if you like.

[Gpsluvr]

No. It needs to be the lighter fluid that goes in zippo lighters. The brand name here is Ronson.


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[Tel7]

21 minutes ago, Gpsluvr said:

No. It needs to be the lighter fluid that goes in zippo lighters. The brand name here is Ronson.

Thanks Gpsluvr.  I see one of our supermarkets in NZ sells the Ronsonol (note the "ol" on the end) brand, which I think is the same thing. https://shop.countdown.co.nz/Shop/ProductDetails?stockcode=266758

[Gpsluvr]

Yes, it goes by Ronsonol too.


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[anilv]

There are battery powered gadgets that you place behind the watch and it makes the hands spin really fast. I think the idea is that it clears up any old oil/dirt in the pivots.

I dont have one as I dont really work on quartz watches but I'm sure someone here has one.

Anilv

[Tel7]

1 hour ago, anilv said:

There are battery powered gadgets that you place behind the watch and it makes the hands spin really fast.

Thanks Anilv,

Do they just hook onto the second hand (where there is one), or what?  Or when you say "behind", does that mean where the back cover comes off?

[anilv]

Its about the size of a cigarette packet..you lay the watch on top (with the case back off I think) and activate the device. The hands will spin like crazy.

Anilv

[Marc]

1 hour ago, Tel7 said:

Thanks Anilv,

Do they just hook onto the second hand (where there is one), or what?  Or when you say "behind", does that mean where the back cover comes off?

It's basically a strong rotating magnetic field which causes the rotor to spin. You don't even need to remove the case back.

I have achieved the same effect by using a strong magnet (one of those neodynium ones salvaged from an old computer hard drive) to manually turn the rotor to clear a jam. In so many ways it's a bodge but if it gets a cheap quartz that either isn't worth a strip down clean or whicgh can't be stripped down going again then it is an ok work around.

[Neileg]

Quartz testers usually have a line free function which does indeed spin a magnet to drive the mechanism round. No physical connection is made, just the magnetic field.
I paid about 30gbp for my tester on eBay.
However this movement should be self starting and if you need to spin it up that indicates the mechanics need a service.
Cheers Neil


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[Tel7]

Hi Gpsluvr and others,

I tried the lighter fluid (Ronsonol) trick but it did not work.  After that, I ended up removing the 3 screws on the movement plate, and put some fluid directly on the cogs, dried that off with pumped air, but it also didn't work.  At one stage the second hand did move for a few secs, but then stopped.  If I mess around with it more I may be able to get it working - not sure.

If I was to replace the movement, how would I swap the hands over?  Do they just pull straight off, or what?

If I go to cousinsuk.com and search for "V501" I get this search result:
https://www.cousinsuk.com/search?SearchTerm=V501
That gives me a Hattori V501M which it says is "Obsolete", but if I click the "Alternatives" link, it shows me a Hattori Y121M at a cost of £1.65.
Seems incredibly cheap, and postage to New Zealand will exceed the cost of the item, but is this likely to be of reasonable quality, and how can I tell if that would be compatible?

Thanks again.

[noirrac1j]

Here is the spec. sheet for the Hattori Y121M movement....This will help you figure out if the movement is compatible with the one currently in the watch:

http://www.jewelerssupplies.com/HATTORI-Y121.html

 

Joe

[noirrac1j]

2 minutes ago, noirrac1j said:

Here is the spec. sheet for the Hattori Y121M movement....This will help you figure out if the movement is compatible with the one currently in the watch:

http://www.jewelerssupplies.com/HATTORI-Y121.html

 

Joe

The hour hand is 0.65, the minute hand is 1.1mm and the sweep second hand is 0.20mm. The dial feet are at 1 and 5. Remove the hands on the old movement by placing Saran or plastic wrap over the hands and use a pair of levers or .60mm screwdrivers to pry all three hands off at once. The plastic will prevent the dial from getting damaged. Once you do this, you'll need to remove the dial to see where the dial feet are. You can do this by finding either dial screws or the small levers that hold that dial in place.

J

[Tel7]

Thanks noirrac1j,

I had a look at that.  What does "HANDS  65/110/20" mean?  Are they the diameters (in 10ths of a mm) of some part relating to the min/hour/sec hands?

Does Hattori indicate the brand, so should the Hattori Y121M be the same quality from any site?

[Tel7]

51 minutes ago, noirrac1j said:

The hour hand is 0.65, the minute hand is 1.1mm and the sweep second hand is 0.20mm.

What part of the hands do those sizes relate to?

Quote

The dial feet are at 1 and 5.

Are you telling me this because I should check that this is the same on the dial I have, or what?  How do I check?  Take it completely apart?

[noirrac1j]

10 hours ago, Tel7 said:

What part of the hands do those sizes relate to?

Are you telling me this because I should check that this is the same on the dial I have, or what?  How do I check?  Take it completely apart?

You don't have to take the movement completely apart, but you do have to remove the hands and the dial if you're thinking of replacing the movement. That dial (along with the hands) will be needed on the new movement. Its not as difficult as it sounds. Take a look at some videos on how to remove watch hands and dial. Once you've removed the dial, a confirmation of the dial feet position will be needed before you buy the Hattori Y121.

J

[noirrac1j]

11 hours ago, Tel7 said:

What part of the hands do those sizes relate to?

Are you telling me this because I should check that this is the same on the dial I have, or what?  How do I check?  Take it completely apart?

These are the diameters of the hand openings....

[Tel7]

Thanks again noirrac1j,

Quote

Once you've removed the dial, a confirmation of the dial feet position will be needed before you buy the Hattori Y121

I you suggesting I go for the Y121 instead of the Y121M that I mentioned, or was that just a typo?  What's the likely difference between the two?

[noirrac1j]

I think they are the same. Cousins has Hattori Y 121 listed with the code Y 121M.

 

J