Bhi Distance Learning

[david]

Old Hippy,

I think back in the early 1970s there were numerous independent watch repair shops and several watch repair schools. The Chicago School of Watchmaking, Bulova School of Watchmaking plus many watch repair programs offered in various community collages. The mechanical watch industry was almost destroyed after the Japanese figured out a way to miniaturize the piezoelectric quartz crystal by machining  it into the shape of a tuning fork. This paved the way for a more accurate, more dependable watch at a much lower cost per watch. This also led to the ultimate demize  of the independent watch shop. The mechanical watch industry was brought back to life by the Swiss watch companies. Unfortunately, for the small independent repair shops,  they also took over the service and repair aspects of the industry. This was also sad for the customers who purchased their watches because these companies turned watch service into a rip-off operation. My dentist was quoted around $2000.00 and an 8 month turnaround from Patek Phillipe to clean and lubricate his watch. A small independent repair shop might have charged $150.00 with a 3 day turnaround.

david 

[clockboy]

2 hours ago, david said:

Old Hippy,

I think back in the early 1970s there were numerous independent watch repair shops and several watch repair schools. The Chicago School of Watchmaking, Bulova School of Watchmaking plus many watch repair programs offered in various community collages. The mechanical watch industry was almost destroyed after the Japanese figured out a way to miniaturize the piezoelectric quartz crystal by machining  it into the shape of a tuning fork. This paved the way for a more accurate, more dependable watch at a much lower cost per watch. This also led to the ultimate demize  of the independent watch shop. The mechanical watch industry was brought back to life by the Swiss watch companies. Unfortunately, for the small independent repair shops,  they also took over the service and repair aspects of the industry. This was also sad for the customers who purchased their watches because these companies turned watch service into a rip-off operation. My dentist was quoted around $2000.00 and an 8 month turnaround from Patek Phillipe to clean and lubricate his watch. A small independent repair shop might have charged $150.00 with a 3 day turnaround.

david 

I absolutely agree David but the issue small independents and one man operations have is credibility.  The scenario is a customer goes to Rolex & is quoted £600 + parts then goes to an independent & is quoted £150. The customer is then in a quandary does he trust the independent to service his Rolex or take the hit with a guarantee repair with Rolex. 
I think this is why those that would like to make a living from watch repair/servicing should at least get some sort of accreditation such as from the BHI. The best would be a recognised apprenticeship but for many this is just not possible. 
 

[Geo]

It's funny that you mention £600 CB.  That's exactly what a friend had to pay to have his Rolex GMT serviced; it would have been over £2000 if he let them do all the extras like case and bracelet.  Here's the bad bit.............it now barely holds to a minute a day and he was fed a load of bull$it when he took it back and complained.  He's now decided to sell it as it and buy a high end quartz  'cause it's not worth all the hassle. :-(

I personally would use a highly reputable independent!

Edited October 22, 2017 by Geo

[clockboy]

46 minutes ago, Geo said:

It's funny that you mention £600 CB.  That's exactly what a friend had to pay to have his Rolex GMT serviced; it would have been over £2000 if he let them do all the extras like case and bracelet.  Here's the bad bit.............it now barely holds to a minute a day and he was fed a load of bull$it when he took it back and complained.  He's now decided to sell it as it and buy a high end quartz  'cause it's not worth all the hassle. :-(

I personally would use a highly reputable independent!

I have also been told of other horror stories such as this. But it's the credibility us independents do not have is the problem.In some ways the industry is getting into a real mess since the Swiss stirred up the pot.  

[oldhippy]

If it comes with a guarantee, then it should be taken back. If at the time there was no guarantee given then it is all down to the person that the watch belongs too. I always gave a full 1-year’s guarantee if the watch had a complete overhaul.   

[Geo]

He did take it back but was so dismayed by the bull$hit that he had no confidence in them to do a good job the second time.  Neither did he want to enter into a prolonged argument with the the "experts" that would grind him down.  All he wants is a good reliable watch that doesn't need fettled every five years or so at an exorbitant price, so quartz it is.  He will also manage a couple of nice cruises from the sale of the Rolex!  I had to agree with him.

[transporter]

Oooops I can see this topic has restarted, ok as for my quandary with the BHI distance course,  I will hopefully for a few pounds next week get the whole syllabus to study and see if it's for me, I attended a BHI function this weekend and not to be disrespectful, but myself and two qualified smiths that I know lowered the average age of that hall by about 45+ years, and none of us are spring chickens, and there's a fact that the industry needs to take a look at, its a dying trade, quite literally! 

It a shame, and there in lies a heads a up to the BHI, to maybe give out abit more info, so a ups potential smiths can get an idea aupsns to what's expected of them.

[jdm]

40 minutes ago, transporter said:

 I attended a BHI function this weekend and not to be disrespectful, but myself and two qualified smiths that I know lowered the average age of that hall by about 45+ years, and none of us are spring chickens, and there's a fact that the industry needs to take a look at, its a dying trade, quite literally! 

You've hit the nail on the head. The old guys at BHI want  to preserve their income and aloofness image with zero innovation,  in turn they leverage street-facing shops which service older customers that give more importance to a frame on the wall, than Internet reputation.

 

[Peterburke340]

Rolex charge £600+ and take 4 months to return the watch.As an independent I charge £350 and return within 2-3 weeks maximum.
I was told from a very highly qualified watchmaker when I was starting out
1) Don’t be too cheap or the customer will think your work will be sub standard.
2)Don’t be too quick or the customer will think your work will be sub standard
Wise words that have served me well.
I always give a 12 month guarantee but never give a guarantee on water resistance. I do, however, tell the customer whether the pressure test passed or failed. To date, it’s never been an issue.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[teegee]

On 10/23/2017 at 3:15 AM, transporter said:

.. I attended a BHI function this weekend and not to be disrespectful, but myself and two qualified smiths that I know lowered the average age of that hall by about 45+ years, and none of us are spring chickens, and there's a fact that the industry needs to take a look at, its a dying trade, quite literally! 

Hah, I noticed the same at the awards ceremony last weekend (my first time there), but I knew that would likely be the case anyway. I think they're aware of their advanced average age, and they're very keen to attract younger members.

I'm doing the DLC just because I have no other means to learn (besides internet and books), and I think it's a fun course. Like any education, there may be parts of it you don't like. I never had any interest in quartz watches and clocks, but discovered that high-end (non-junk) quartz watches are OK, and clocks are great. I had technical drafting nightmares from school days, but actually enjoyed CAD escapement drawing (year 2).

And yes, the first few units are about metalworking skills. If you're already good at that, then it's easy for you, but the course targets beginners. If you never plan to make new parts at all then maybe this course it not for you. For the technician exams you will need to make a fictitious clock part.

Did you ask the BHI for a few sample lessons? I do agree with you that it can be hard to find out detailed information about the DLC, exam procedures etc. I'm doing everything from afar, which makes the procedures (invigilator, etc) even more complicated.

You mention £600, but that won't be enough. Exams are £120 apiece these days, and there's three for the technician grade.

If you think you're good enough, you can always just start taking in customer work, and build up a critical mass of clients. Or buy, fix and sell watches on eBay. When you're established with a good reputation, nobody will care about your qualifications anyway.

Cheers!

    Rob

[oldhippy]

I think I'd fit in very well at the old farts club.

[vinn3]

Accreditation is the answer.   that is why we learn "to fix it our self"  or just buy a new one.  Vin

[jdm]

11 hours ago, teegee said:

Exams are £120 apiece these days, and there's three for the technician grade.

Do they administer exams outside the UK, or remotely?

[teegee]

12 hours ago, jdm said:

Do they administer exams outside the UK, or remotely?

Depending on where you live, they may be able to arrange an invigilator for you. I had to find one myself, which can be very difficult (I was lucky to have a professor friend at a local uni). Exams are never done remotely (i.e. skype or something), but only with an approved invigilator.

For technician grade, you'd need the invigilator for D1 (theory) and D4 (quartz service).

Year three exams have to be done at the BHI, which means I'm going back there next year

Cheers,

    Rob

[jdm]

5 hours ago, teegee said:

Depending on where you live, they may be able to arrange an invigilator for you. I had to find one myself, which can be very difficult (I was lucky to have a professor friend at a local uni). Exams are never done remotely (i.e. skype or something), but only with an approved invigilator.

For technician grade, you'd need the invigilator for D1 (theory) and D4 (quartz service).

Year three exams have to be done at the BHI, which means I'm going back there next year

Good for you if you have the will and funds for all that. In practice the way the administer exams and the travel makes most of the cost for anyone not living in the UK. 

[transporter]

I’m back again folks, well I got the whole course work from a very kind fellow, weighs in a 3kg!!! I’ve had a look through and there’s some good stuff in there, I’ve only browsed at the moment so will look in depth later.

i attended a local watch and clock fair at the weekend ( managed to pick up a full Helios staking set for £80 ) and the BHI were there trying to get people interested in joking etc, well unfortunately it going to come down to COST, first to do the DLC you need to join the BHI £102 annually then you need £600 for the course then £ 102 per exam x 3, if you want to practice an exam they charge £500!!!  For other modules such as quartz it’s another £450 for a 2 day course, to learn how to hold a file and use hand tools add another £450 to the bill for another 2 day course. I will list the prices when I get home and course durations so members can have their say on costs etc.

i understand that these are skilled people doing the teaching and funding must come from somewhere, but these prices and durations of courses seem to me a little excessive, how long will it take someone to recoup that amount??

 

 

[clockboy]

It is pricey for a amateur/tinkerer for sure. However I notice that in the BHI mag most of the courses are full so many think the fees are worth paying.  As you say funding has to come from somewhere.  

[transporter]

Guessing for now I’ll study the course content I’ve got thoroughly and then make a decision as to wether it will be a step towards retraining for a fall back career incase mine goes belly up.

[oldhippy]

At some point the B H I got 2 and a half million from the Lottery.