Valjoux 7733 Hair Sping Got Loose

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

As per the title, I was checking why my Gigandet Valjoux 7733- based chrono was not working today, and noticed that the hair spring got loose from the small insert that connects it to the balance cock (what's its name again?) Taking a closer look, it appeared to have been fixed with schellac, but I am not sure. Would this be normal, if so?

 

So now I need to find a way to reinstall the hair spring inside the stud. Heating it gently could be the way, but I am afraid I will only riun the hair spring if not careful enough...

 

Ideas? Comments?

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

A couple of pics of the stud holding the hair spring...

[clockboy 1,540]

I have come across this style before but I don,t know what is used to secure. It,s possible shellac is used.

[Geo 1,622]

I think it should be crimped into the stud.

[clockboy 1,540]

The one I came across had some sort of shellac/glue it was not crimped. 

[JohnR725 1,245]

Is this a real Swiss or a Chinese clone?  The glue isn't shellac Using glue to hold hairsprings too things has been going on for quite some time. The reason I asked if it's a Chinese clone is my experience with Chinese glue is it fails really fast. Several times through the cleaning machine it will disintegrate for instance..  Normal glue used I think for practical purposes is almost forever otherwise we would have more discussions about my hairspring came unglued from the stud?

[oldhippy 2,472]

This sort of thing was around back in the 80's. It is a glue and a **BLEEP** nuance it is. I found by cleaning away the old and replacing with Araldite which is a glue you mix yourself, you get a tube of glue and a tube of hardener in the pack. The trick is to set it so it stays in line and not uneven. Why they couldn't pin the hairspring to the stud God only knows.   

[Geo 1,622]

Good info guys, I'll file that in the ageing memory banks! :)

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

@JohnR725: it is a real Valjoux 7733, no chinese replica.

 

@ all the others: if this is indeed a sort of glue, how can I get definitively rid of it, and how can I replace it? the Araldite option is a good one, thanks oldhippy, but I am not really keen in putting such stuff inside a watch movement... But if you've done it in the past with success and no trouble, why not?

 

Any other suggestion? I found a complete balance wheel on eBay, for a whoppin 150€!!!!! TOOOOOOOOOO expensive....

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

Looking today on eBay I found a complete balance for 26€... Used but in good condition. Think I will get that...

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

And I did not get that complete balance so I am still looking for a replacement... Question for the ones in the know: will a poljit 3133 balance wheel fit in my valjoux 7733? I saw they are cheaper to get

[JohnR725 1,245]

Here's the cross reference for the 7733

 

721/1773   (discontinued)
 BALANCE COMPLETE, INCA W/SCREW
 721/VALJ 77 INC

 BUL 14EB      CHORONGRAPH
 ELG 329 14L      17JL CHRONO 30 OR 45 MIN RECORD
 GRU 770R      CHRONOGRAPH
 HAM 640     
 HAM 643      17JL CHRONO 30 MIN REF ADJ STUD HOLD INCA
 HAM 647      CHRONO
 TIS 2060      18000 BPH-CHRONO W/30 MIN REC-INCA-ADJ STUD HOLD-17JLS
 TIS 2070      18000 BPH-CHRONO W/30 MIN REC-CALD-INCA-ADJ-STUD HOLD
 VAL 7730      CHRONOGRAPH-SHOCK-ADJ. STUD HOLDER
 VAL 7733      2 PUSHER-CHRONO-30 & 45 MIN. REG.
 VAL 7734      2 PUSHER-CHRONO-30 & 45 MIN.-REG-CALD
 VAL 7736      CHRONO 30 MIN REG 12 HR REC.
 VAL 7737      18,000 BPH-CHRONO-CENTRAL-MIN REC-10 MIN
 VAL 7739      18000 BPH INCA
 VEN 175      CHRONOGRAPH
 VEN 178      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER
 VEN 179      SPLIT SECOND CHRONOGRAPH
 VEN 183      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER-CALENDAR
 VEN 184      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER CALENDAR-LUNAR
 VEN 185      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER-SPLIT SECOND
 VEN 188      CHRONOGRAPH
 VEN 189      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER-SPLIT SECOND-CALENDAR
 VEN 190      CHRONOGRAPH-HOUR RECORDER-SPLIT SECOND-CALENDAR-LUNAR
 VEN 200      CHRONOGRAPH-CALENDAR-LUNAR
 VEN 205      CHRONOGRAPH-SPLIT SECOND-CALENDAR-LUNAR

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

Thanks John, but I am having a hard time understanding how to read that... Would you care to explain it to me?

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

Take for example art.171634121653 on ebay. Would this fit?

[JohnR725 1,245]

http://www.polmax3133.com/guide.html

 

So the link above explains what a poljit 3133 Is for all of us that don't know what it was.

 

Then for your question you asked what balance wheels replace or substitute for the 7733 and the list I gave you came from a material house where they claim all those balance wheels are identical. Notice on the list that the poljit 3133 Is not listed. So what exactly does that mean? It would normally mean that it doesn't cross reference except. Then I went and looked at the listing to see if they even have a poljit 3133 Which they did not. So they can't cross reference something they don't have a listing for. But the rest of the list everything on the list will fit.

 

So here's a really nice website definitely does not have every single watch made but has a lot.

 

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk

 

So looking down to the list I see they have a poljit 3133

 

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&Poljot_3133

 

So it's a copy of a 7734 which is on the list of balance wheels that are compatible. Except next link is quite interesting explains the difference between the two and the history which I found quite interesting. So it looks like everything probably will interchange except the balance jewels. Probably because it didn't want a annoy the Swiss by exactly copying the balance jewels and because they're covered under separate patents etc. they came up with their own design. But I will make some wild assumption that the pivots are probably still the same because otherwise they would have to make new balance staffs to fit their new balance jewels. So worst-case if it didn't fit it you will have to change the balance staff.

 

http://www.strela-watch.de/watch_movements/3133-maktime-poljot/

 

 

 

 

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

From the last link I got this sentence that basically says it all:

"The balance was modified to a smaller diameter what makes the 3133 faster beating at 3 Hz (21,600 vph). compared to the 7734 with 2.5 HZ (18.000 vph)."

So they are not compatible, I fear...

[JohnR725 1,245]

So I was only looking at physical compatibility the frequency the definitely makes them incompatible.

 

A unfortunate problem with working on watches is getting spare parts. Made even more difficult in the parts are considered obsolete. But there's a few still left out there did a little searching for you.

 

 

7730 721 balance complete $55

http://www.scotchwatch.com/valjoux_parts.html

 

EUR 139.99

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Balancier-balance-complete-721-valjoux-7730-7733-7734-/400207689431

 

https://www.cousinsuk.com/search?SearchTerm=valjoux+7734

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/venus-188-chronograph-golf-continental-time-for-parts-restore-/391352781666?hash=item5b1e718b62:g:86sAAOSwZ1lWgxrQ

 

BULOVA 14EB NOS COMPLETE BALANCE WHEEL WATCH PART #721

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BULOVA-14EB-NOS-COMPLETE-BALANCE-WHEEL-WATCH-PART-721-/141804387832?hash=item2104333df8:g:F68AAOSwpDdVTqHw

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

Thanks John, I knew already all the linsk that you posted, of which the first one is the most promising. Yet I did manage to make a quick fix on it: I noticed that the stud had a very small groove, so I just inserted the hairspring in it and pressed the side of the grooves with a small plier. It worked, amazingly...

 

One problem solved, one problem created: flipping the movement to reinstall all the hands and dial, I lost the chrono seconds hand... damn!

[GeorgeClarkson 221]

And after 2 hours of searching, I found it... Case closed!

[jdm 2,135]

Yet I did manage to make a quick fix on it: I noticed that the stud had a very small groove, so I just inserted the hairspring in it and pressed the side of the grooves with a small plier. It worked, amazingly...

I've got the same problem with a Seiko and was wondering about gluing.. will try this method

 

One problem solved, one problem created: flipping the movement to reinstall all the hands and dial, I lost the chrono seconds hand... damn!

Exactly the same happening here!