Help needed- Omega Deville 1337 movement repair

[EamonF]

Hi all, first post for me on here, would appreciate any advice.

Have recieved a non running Omega DeVille 1337 from my brother. 

On recieving the watch I found the 2nd wheel had some of broken teeth which I thought would be the issue. Found a corrosion damaged donor movement, replaced the wheel and got the gear training running smoothly, but watch stil isnt running. The coil has a resistance of 3.5k ohms so I believe its ok.

Can I get some advice please on how to troubleshoot if the chip, crystal or stepper motor is the issue please? I only have a digital multimeter, not an analogue one unfortunatly.


Cheers from New Zealand,

Eamon

[JohnR725]

I have a link searching for the word working and you get a interesting list of Omega working instructions. Number 18 may be of interest to you but while you're there download all the rest of them they're all interesting and worthy to download

https://www.cousinsuk.com/document/search?SearchString=working

then looking through number 18 you'll come to the page that I snipped image from we get technical specs for your watch

this is where it be nice to have some test equipment because unfortunately circuits without test equipments are basically black boxes that there isn't a lot we can do with. then your measured coil resistance is within the specified range.

then why you're on the cousins website you can change the word working to 1337 and you get the parts list for 1337 which only has two parts? Notice the reference to 1332 that's the base caliber and searching for that the get the parts list for that. Which then brings up the amusing problem of watch repair where's the service bulletin? Most vintage or most documentation was scanned solely for  parts and not for servicing. Sometimes for a lot of watches there never was any servicing as the manufactured perceives that whoever is working on their watches didn't actually need servicing. Although there should be something for this?

I did find you a servicing document but it's more just the test points and  a few helpful tips on servicing because once again they expected you to know what you're doing.

4 hours ago, EamonF said:

found the 2nd wheel had some of broken teeth

did you figure out any reason why the teeth through broken? and typically for a quartz watch everything has to be super super clean and properly lubricated anything that sticky is going to be an issue. Then you want to use the lightest oil possible on the pivots if you're doing more than one quartz watch the 9000 lubricant for quartz watches works really well

then we can only go so far but let's follow the testing procedures. With the battery in place they give you test points ideally for the plus you would like to put it on the plate someplace and not on the battery even though it shows contact with the battery. The reason for this is you want to make sure that the battery power is actually going into the watch and there isn't a short or something else somewhere.

Then yes analog meter supersensitive one would be preferred. You can then check for the impulses to the coil. With a digital meter you'll probably see something as opposed to just sitting there and doing basically nothing. With analog meter on the most sensitive settings what you typically see as the output polarity changes each time the stepping motor steps you would see the alternating movement of the needle by a little bit. So you might build a sort of possibly see that with the digital may be but there should be some sort of change their

then we basically come to the end of the testing that you can do with what you have. Ideally it be nice to have a variable voltage power supply and the ability to measure microamps including fractional microamps. Personally I prefer an analog meter over a digital meter here. Because then we can see what's going on as opposed to we can't at all

then the Chinese do make some inexpensive diagnostic things and somebody will come along eventually and tell you about their nifty device that does nifty stuff. otherwise the Swiss make a whole variety of test equipment but it's hardly worthwhile unfortunately for one watch.

Although? One of things you do is take out the wheel next to the stepping motor. The stepping motor rotor is only turning itself and see if that will turn. You might have to put a Mark on the rotor because when it steps it may actually look like it didn't step would off. So sometimes a small mark on one side than you can tell but it actually rotated. In other words you just trying to get the stepping motor to step if that works you can start to add the rest the gear train in.

omega 1332_complet_4217.pdf

[EamonF]

11 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

 

Although? One of things you do is take out the wheel next to the stepping motor. The stepping motor rotor is only turning itself and see if that will turn. You might have to put a Mark on the rotor because when it steps it may actually look like it didn't step would off. So sometimes a small mark on one side than you can tell but it actually rotated. In other words you just trying to get the stepping motor to step if that works you can start to add the rest the gear train in.

omega 1332_complet_4217.pdf 227.1 kB · 0 downloads

 

Thanks so much for your detailed reply John!

Yeah regarding the broken teeth, there is a magnetic washer on the seconds pivot, I believe the last person in there wasnt carefull when assembling and tightened the bridge without properly alligning the intermediate wheel teeth above the washer.  would be an easy mistake to make. 

I have already tried removing the wheel next to the rotor and stil get no movement in the rotor unfortunatly. 

Ive just ordered a cheap analogue meter so should be able to do those tests in a couple days, really appreciate you findig those documents for me!

Im concidering swapping the crystal out of the donor movement as my last hope.. the chip on the donor movement is obviously fried but guess theres a chance the crystal might have survived.

 

Cheers,

E

[JohnR725]

28 minutes ago, EamonF said:

crystal might have survived

this is where it's nice to have additional test equipment that you don't have like there are ways of seeing of the crystals oscillating. But yes you could just swap the crystal over. then in the early days of quartz watches the used actually sell replacement quartz crystals but that sort of thing ended really really fast because typically watchmakers don't swap electrical components. Then of course you could purchase a brand-new quartz crystal from a variety of electronic supply places as it should be a relatively standard crystal.

[PwrChrdAfcndo]

I recently acquired an Omega Seamaster with the 1337 movement, listed as a non-runner.  It was an ebay purchase that had no pictures of the movement but the price was right so I pulled the trigger sight-unseen.  When it arrived, I discovered the movement was very clean but it had no battery and was missing the battery retainer metal part.  Also, the crown would not engage the hands, so I knew I'd have to sort that out before dealing with the battery.  I disassembled the movement and found a broken yoke and a stem setting screw that would not fasten properly.  I thought about sourcing replacement parts but didn't want to throw money there due to not knowing if the circuit was working.  The cheapest running donor movement I can find is $250 USD and Omega wants $500 for a service, so instead I'm going to attempt to retrofit an ETA movement, since Omega used those shortly after abandoning their in-house quartz movements.  If I am successful, I may part out the 1337 parts I won't need.  I have tested the coil which is showing good resistance on my multimeter.  I suspect the circuit may also be functional but I do not have the means to test it.  Since there appears to be many people with watches containing this movement, I'll try and keep everyone updated if I am successful with the ETA retrofit.

[AndyGSi]

28 minutes ago, PwrChrdAfcndo said:

I recently acquired an Omega Seamaster with the 1337 movement, listed as a non-runner.  It was an ebay purchase that had no pictures of the movement but the price was right so I pulled the trigger sight-unseen.  When it arrived, I discovered the movement was very clean but it had no battery and was missing the battery retainer metal part.  Also, the crown would not engage the hands, so I knew I'd have to sort that out before dealing with the battery.  I disassembled the movement and found a broken yoke and a stem setting screw that would not fasten properly.  I thought about sourcing replacement parts but didn't want to throw money there due to not knowing if the circuit was working.  The cheapest running donor movement I can find is $250 USD and Omega wants $500 for a service, so instead I'm going to attempt to retrofit an ETA movement, since Omega used those shortly after abandoning their in-house quartz movements.  If I am successful, I may part out the 1337 parts I won't need.  I have tested the coil which is showing good resistance on my multimeter.  I suspect the circuit may also be functional but I do not have the means to test it.  Since there appears to be many people with watches containing this movement, I'll try and keep everyone updated if I am successful with the ETA retrofit.

Welcome to the forum.

You need to start a new post of your own rather than add to someone elses.

You do realise that if you just replace it with an ETA movement the value will be gone.

You appear to have done a lot of the hard work so why not continue?

[PwrChrdAfcndo]

1 hour ago, AndyGSi said:

Welcome to the forum.

You need to start a new post of your own rather than add to someone elses.

You do realise that if you just replace it with an ETA movement the value will be gone.

You appear to have done a lot of the hard work so why not continue?

The thread concerns the same movement and the issues appear to be similar, so IMO it's fitting to provide this information in the same place.

The value of the watch doesn't warrant a $500 Omega servicing -- WatchCharts indicates similar models run about the same in retail.  Even going the donor Omega movement route is cost-prohibitive considering there's no telling how long the donor will last.  Besides, I am intending to keep this watch so I am not concerned about resale value.  As such, my main concern is getting/keeping it running and avoiding parts sourcing issues in the future -- due to the movement's scarcity and Omega's reluctance to sell parts direct (especially the circuit, which appears to be the major fault point on this movement) it makes more sense to me to retrofit a modern, current production movement that can more easily be serviced/replaced in the future.

If the OP or anyone else has success in figuring out how to test the circuit, I'm willing to test mine and if mine is working I'm willing to part it out to someone in need.

[AndyGSi]

12 minutes ago, PwrChrdAfcndo said:

The thread concerns the same movement and the issues appear to be similar, so IMO it's fitting to provide this information in the same place.

The value of the watch doesn't warrant a $500 Omega servicing -- WatchCharts indicates similar models run about the same in retail.  Even going the donor Omega movement route is cost-prohibitive considering there's no telling how long the donor will last.  Besides, I am intending to keep this watch so I am not concerned about resale value.  As such, my main concern is getting/keeping it running and avoiding parts sourcing issues in the future -- due to the movement's scarcity and Omega's reluctance to sell parts direct (especially the circuit, which appears to be the major fault point on this movement) it makes more sense to me to retrofit a modern, current production movement that can more easily be serviced/replaced in the future.

If the OP or anyone else has success in figuring out how to test the circuit, I'm willing to test mine and if mine is working I'm willing to part it out to someone in need.

Adding to someone else's post isn't how the forum works.

You can do basic tests with an analogue multimeter and more advanced tests with a quartz tester.

I think others will agree if the movement is swapped for an ETA then it's no longer an Omega Seamaster.

[HectorLooi]

I've be working on a 1337 recently. It was very corroded and had green, powdery residue all over the battery contacts.

It cleaned up very nicely, leaving no trace of any previous battery leak. The coil resistance is 3.5K, which is within specifications. But the movement doesn't move when powered up with my Bulova 700 meter. It shows a short in the circuit.

There are only 2 discrete components on the PCB, the quartz oscillator and the variable capacitor. I have desoldered both of these and the circuit is still shorted. So the short must be inside the IC itself.

I've also checked the entire internet for a replacement circuit and came up with the same results as @PwrChrdAfcndo.

The owner of the watch gave me permission to throw it away for him. I'll probably keep it and try something really unorthodox. I'm going to try an IC transplant from a totally different movement. The only problem is the 1337 uses an unusual method of adjusting the hands.

I think Bulova had a similar movement that does that too but I can't remember which model.

[PwrChrdAfcndo]

16 minutes ago, HectorLooi said:

I've be working on a 1337 recently. It was very corroded and had green, powdery residue all over the battery contacts.

It cleaned up very nicely, leaving no trace of any previous battery leak. The coil resistance is 3.5K, which is within specifications. But the movement doesn't move when powered up with my Bulova 700 meter. It shows a short in the circuit.

There are only 2 discrete components on the PCB, the quartz oscillator and the variable capacitor. I have desoldered both of these and the circuit is still shorted. So the short must be inside the IC itself.

I've also checked the entire internet for a replacement circuit and came up with the same results as @PwrChrdAfcndo.

The owner of the watch gave me permission to throw it away for him. I'll probably keep it and try something really unorthodox. I'm going to try an IC transplant from a totally different movement. The only problem is the 1337 uses an unusual method of adjusting the hands.

I think Bulova had a similar movement that does that too but I can't remember which model.

That would be incredible -- please keep us posted on the results.